Well said.
I think the problem you have with him is what range you were trying to fight him at. If you back up and let him throw fireballs you can headbut them to build some meter. You donât need to rush and down all the time. Once in sweep range be patient, you can win the footsie battle by staying in sweep range. You can react to fireballs with lariat at this range Fireballs only do 60 damage which means you can take 19 to the face before you die. Unlike Lariat or headbutt that he can only take 10. Plus him landing fireball doesnât really leave him at a great position. Unlike you lending your lariat or Headbutt which gives you a great position. At sweep distance he effectively loses the fireball because the risk is more than the reward. Letâs not even talk about when you get the trigger, then throwing fireballs become stupid.
OK in footsies crouching medium kick fireball you can flex for free SPD. And now when you knock him down he has to eat your mixup. That being said his standing medium punch is still a hard button to deal with. But thatâs what makes it fair. I donât see how this matchup is a nightmare.
Just now I was demolished by a Rashid who completely had this matchup down. He would zone with those whirlwinds and punish subsequent Lariats with Eagle Spike. He always just managed to stay out of my effective range, very hard to deal with.
Also got stomped by a good Urien. You can barely gain any ground by walking forward when he does his regular projectiles. When I jumped, he used the angled one. A Urien with good reading is a real nightmarish matchup.
Whatâs the Gief playersâ level on this board? Iâm a Super Gold scrub, never got anywhere near Ultra Gold. Take what I say with a grain of salt.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRhJatpC8F4
I always thought that Cammy beat Gief but for anyone that thinks differently, can you please explain how Gief wins this mu after watching this? This is at the highest level and the best Gief in the world couldnât do shit against a Cammy who knows the mu and the ranges to punish.
ok this is just a simple thing of he was outplayed. even the best players that happens to, it has nothing to do with the character.
i have talked to cammy players and they feel it is fair. the problem not what buttons he was throwing but when he was throwing them.
look at 1:36 he waited to throw out MP until after he saw the cammy was going for cr mk. there are 13 recovery frames on the move so you can punish it.
your st mp beats all her kicks from distance.
Cammy has one button that will cause you issues cr mp, after she throws it you need to do cr jab as that will beat anything, but only if you throw it after.
This fight is a war of attrition, you can not go all in until you get the advantage but once you do you press it till she is dead(and her life and stun are low so that is two mixups.) And with the nerfs to DP she has now way not to eat a mixup without spending meter which is bad for her because she is a very meter dependant character
She can do the same for you as you have no way to get her off of you.
lets look at where each character wins in this match.
Cammy wins
close range
walk speed
best button in the matchup(cr mp)
Gief wins
long range
burst damage
health
seems fair to me.
there are a few characters as Gief you want to zone and this concept is just foreign to Gief players. Gief is not a RTSD character and the problem is most low level ones play him that way.
here are the characters i think you zone,
Mika
Bison
Alex
Laura
Balrog
Cammy
your buttons at distance are better than all of these characters, make them come to you.
ok Rashid bulldog in until you get into effective lariat range. before that he wins. his fireball is slow so easy to react to. The thing about Gief is you can block a shit ton of fireballs before you die, the chip doesnât matter. walk him down slowly. you will not win this match quick against a good Rashid but your damage is so much better than his you only need a few hits where as he needs to beat your ass with a ton of hits.
on Urien i have no idea i have played good ones that dont know the matchup completely but think once they do this character will stomp our asses. it is similar to nash in season one he can run away with zero risk and keep you honest with the ex shoulder tackle, which for some fucking reason is safe. the difference between him and Nash is Nash could easily excape the corner easily but did low burst damage, urien has to eat the mixup but burst damage is huge.
you have to take twice as many risks as he does, and because of his run away he always has meter to get you off. it is not unwinable but damn is it a struggle.
Hey, so I think you get a legit VT setup when you AA with lariat super close. I set Chun Li to neutral jump and then did AA lariat and immediately did VT. Had her set to block and do reversal cr.LK (3 frames). After VT, I was able to hit her cr.LP and her button didnât come out. Iâll test more later, but some of yall may wanna play with it.
BTW, I had Chun set to jump, and then after AA lariat I paused and set her to standing, all guard, reversal cr.LK.
I really need fucking help on Guile matchup
This matchup is crazy, I think it is Giefâs hardest matchup.
His sonic boom is too hard to headbutt due to huge speed difference from L/M/HP version.
Meanwhile I can headbutt almost 90% of Nashâs sonic boom.
You can never jump on him
Lariat not work on his sonic boom
Seems nothing I can do with gief
I am pretty sure Ryu is still 7-3 to Gief if he know how to play.
Gief can lariat his fireball but this is USELESS if he know how to manage the fireball game.
If Ryu shot fireball from mid/mid-far range, you have enough reaction window to lariat him.
If Ryu shot fireball from mid-close range, you are extremely hard to lariat him, due to the lack of reaction window and huge input lag in SF5
Ryuâs throw loop game in corner is as annoying as ken, which can kill Gief easily.
I think Gief still has no hope in Ryu matchup.
Just V skill it. Urien is a tough match but not because of shoulder. V skull shuts down a lot of his moves. Head butt, shoulder tackle, knee. None of these moves are more than two hits and if you guess right then itâs Gief mix up time. Iâd much rather have a Urien use those moves than sit back and chuck balls at me.
Yeah I was more talking about when he does the shoulder tackle after you jump the long range fireballs. I have no idea why that damn thing anti airs is safe and has armor. Not to mention itâs really fucking fast. Iâm getting better at dealing with the matchup but damn is it a bitch.
Why are 90% of the moves in this game safe? Thatâs the real question I have and one of the main reasons why I donât like this game.
I absolutely hate that especially after all that work to get in. Iâve struggled reacting to the shoulder it feels just like Nash and his scythe from season 1, where at moments it feels like you canât even walk forward and next thing you know you are eating that plus CA.
after playing alot of the cammy matchup last night i am starting to think it might be in giefs favor. next time you fight one stand just about 1.5 characters away and counter poke with st mp. it beats every single button she has. when you knock her down because of her low life and stun she cant really risk missing an uppercut.
Also played a good Sim last night and i donât know if that is as bad as i originally thought. After you block any long range normal he is very negative and you have three options that will beat his next attack. ST HK will beat any normal other than st hp. st hk will beat anything but it is risky because he can punish if he delays his attack. ST MP will beat anything with no risk but little reward.
it is still in his favor but i just dont feel scared any more, if it hit st or cr hk and get the crush counter i get in for free and then it is on.
thoughts?
Thanks for this. I still have trouble with Sim and will try this out.
Agreed on both accounts. Gief has an advantage on Cammy so long as youâre playing heavy neutral. Thatâs all counter poking and whiff punishing with st.mp and st.lk xx lariat.
Sim is still very painful, but winnable. Patience with this one. You canât bulldog your way past the limbs. I like trying to get a sweep cc on his st.mk then dash in. Once youâre in his face the MU is GREATLY in Giefâs favor. Patience.
Yeah Iâm starting to think that Sim is just a 6-4
Now just to figure out the guile and urien match up. Those are the only two that I feel like he loses because of character design and not just the way I play. Everyone else I feel like I got outplayed when I lose. Those to feel like a massive uphill battle. I need some tech guys, help me out.
Also I canât find it anywhere and Iâm not home to check. What is the percentage of chip damage that special moves take off. Is it 10% of the special moves regular damage?
But of course Lariat had to be -35âŚ
I didnât like how everything was unsafe in SFIV, but I think they overshot it with SFV.