None of that is your business.
Please go back to play online tourney, or if you ever want to do something constructive for the HDR community, you should help out and try to get HDR featured as a main game for stunfest or whatever European tourneys that you go to.
Report back if you have done anything if at all. We would very much like to hear from you.
Hahaha wow aren’t you the feisty one.
What do you want me to do specifically ?
Stunfest already has ST on cab and HDR on console.
Both as main games.
Good to hear. If you stop for a minute and not trying to create a scene here, what you reported is actually the best scenario if both tournaments have good turnout.
What about tourney in other countries like germany and england?
Dunno about Germany.
France and the UK are pretty much the only countries with big tournies here.
The main reason being that they actually have active arcades that include SF2 machines.
But yeah France is pretty top tier.
Cab for everything from Garou to HNK to 3s to alpha 3 to ST:
http://a10.idata.over-blog.com/630x470-000000/1/91/30/40/STUNFEST-X/DSC02003.jpg
Can’t find a good pic of the ST setup but here is me getting my ass kicked by NKI:
[media=youtube]mYVLOVN_1MU[/media]
This is actually the second ST cab setup.
edit: no wait that is the first setup.
Here is the second one featuring Fuulani’s beastly blanka almost taking down Tokido:
[media=youtube]9CGNSxfAgcc[/media]
Hmm… something changed…
QFT
Everyone’s only been switching back to ST since Zangief won EVO.
To morons, this spells “bad game” but to me it spells “dumb ass community”
I want to play the better game.
The better game has tighter tiers.
Zangief is never going to win in ST.
Thus HDR is better.
L2P or GTFO
Honestly I think HDR did not need to change motions. My only criticism of the game.
Old motions were better, and that’s why ST is coming back. People don’t want nubs taking advantage of easy motions.
I agree with this, apart from the fact that there’s no 3P or 3K button in the game. That needs to be there.
If it wasn’t for LP+LK replacing it, Snake Eyes wouldn’t have won EVO on a pad.
So great that Sirlin opened the game up to pad players, to Zangief players, to Blanka/Cammy/Fei Long players.
Fuck you ST elitists who want to be lazy and not have to worry about harder fights against these characters.
It’s not like any of them became top tier or something like that.
That and I miss CPS1 music, and CPS2 backgrounds.
CPS1 music was top tier.
Or perhaps people don’t mind playing ST or HDR?
I now play both, and i typically lose to pretty much the same things in both give or take.
For online though, ST GGPO still gets the nod.
In Germany (at least when I was there) arcade games are 18 and over only which harshes a little on the arcade scene.
there has been held 2 HDR tournaments in Norway wich acctually had pretty good turnount. As a tournament game its had the largest number of entrants only behind SSF4 and Tekken 6. i think the first tournament managed to gather 32 people and the second one 24 , its kind of strange really ,but Tekken 6’s popularity is acctually fading where as HDR has seen an upswing of popularity in 2010.
There could be several reasons for this , one possible explenation could be that the hdr tournaments are usually held at bigger events were ssf4 is the main game and a lot of people joins just because its “another street fighter game”. No matter the reason HDR is the third most popular tournament game here.
Bodied.
Nice post.
PimpUigi: While tiers matter, most players aren’t at a level where tiers inhibit them. Zangief would never win ST? If Pony was playing in our tourneys, I guarantee he’d be winning some, even against some of his most disadvantageous matchups. It’s just a question of how much dedication you put in. Meanwhile, in HDR, it’s still not clear to me whether Zangief is that good or if Snake Eyez is that good or both.
As for pads, Snake Eyez used the Mad Catz pad with all the buttons lying on the face so it wouldn’t have been terribly difficult to perform normal SF lariats holding a pad in the “Tekken” multi-finger manner. And pads are just as possible on any arcade version of ST via the use of laugh’s PS converters, which were used in all the recent ST tourneys, so that’s not really an issue either.
On an aside, I’m not sure you can discount Snake Eyez just based off a button shortcut without proof that he wouldn’t be just as good without it. Right now, he remains an unknown commodity at ST, possibly just as excellent as in HDR, possibly not.
Regarding the supposed recent east coast shift away from HDR, it’d be best to take a look at posts here from pre-Evo. The question of versions started well before Evo, when HDR scenes started cooling down nationwide and northeast folks started preparing for Tougeki SBO. At the tourneys you’ve attended, how was HDR received by everyone else?
If more people like you who actually supports the game came out to tourneys, we really wouldn’t be having this disagreement since many active ST fans would just tough it out with HDR like they were before (and some still are) as a cost for playing a more popular game. I’d certainly be willing to sacrifice my preference for some slight changes and a majority of entrants who are there just for HDR, and have done just that in the past. But when HDR is no longer demonstratively more popular in their area’s competitive scene, then ST fans have to question their decision to not play their preferred version.
If HDR had increased numbers at Evo (like SSFIV did), then perhaps that would have been some cause for hope. But instead, the numbers fell. Now, HDR’s turnout didn’t drop much from the previous year but compared to SSFIV’s large growth at Evo this year, the growing disparity is a cause for concern. And will this number hold once MVC3 rushes onboard?
This concern is heightened in light of HDR majors this year dropping to, but maintaining, ~30 entrants, which is good but it’s exactly the numbers ST used to have before HDR. If SFIV majors were experiencing those same numbers filled with former 3S players, you can only imagine them clamoring that 3S should have the turn back in the spotlight again. Why not play a game that gets the same results yet players enjoy more?
Essentially, your hate is misdirected by a case of mistaken correlation: it’s not ST fans who’ve pushed HDR fans out but rather HDR fans who choose not to compete and thus the remaining HDR fans such as yourself are experiencing less representation. How can you possibly blame the group that’s been most dedicated to HDR (in tourney form as Sirlin had wished) during its lifespan for not supporting the game? Just because they’ve chosen to turn back now when they don’t see anybody following their lead? A lead into a path that they were heading into only because new players seemed to prefer that path but have now abandoned them?
I feel that the 2 year window (since HDR’s release) given for players to show their dedication wasn’t unreasonable. Now that it’s just about disappeared in my area, I’ll play the game I’ve always preferred (in my words: if HDR is 9.5, ST is a 10) unless I turn back and see a crowd again. Pretty much the only thing I’m heavily against in HDR isn’t the rules changing but rather the input lag in at least the PS3 version (which really ought to be scientifically tested): it’s not only annoying but it unfairly affects players who have poorer reaction times.
But as always, there are still plenty of opportunities for HDR fans to sway the curve their way. Anybody in the west coast region, esp. those who often play online, should really represent at NCR and/or SCR. If you really want your version to keep going strong, that’s the best way to make your case. Perhaps Sirlin is happy enough with verbal/written support but the scene as a whole cares little about what SRK posters think and will move to what the majority of its players want.
If players don’t show up, it’s possible nothing will change but don’t be surprised if HDR gets continually less support. Otherwise, if enough HDR fans participate, then I can’t honestly support switching to ST over in Cali so long as real support is there. Yeah, it requires more energy and self-confidence to participate offline but no worries, I can assure you that every SF2 veteran is happy to see new players on board and you’ll have a more satisfying time playing the game in its intended environment without the extra online variables.
This post may go unheeded and, honestly, I may be sounding like a broken record now with variations on the same theme, but I do honestly think participation is the best step HDR players could follow if they really want their game to have a competitive future and maybe attract back some folks who’ve already given up.
Anybody got the amount of people who participated in ST & HDR throughout the years in Evo.
Jesus christ. It’s pickyness like this that will kill oldschool fighters in general at Evo. I’m sure MrWizard doesn’t want to repeat that one Evo when they had to buy a ton of CRTs to satisfy the winy 3s players. There is nothing wrong with a lag-free HDTV set for letterboxed 4:3 content.
It’s not that cut & dry. SBO wouldn’t be SBO if it’s not all arcade with cabs and everything. (check out my sig)
If EVO have enough budget, man power and staffs, why not make the biggest fg party in the country the best experience ever for everyone?
But I also agree that if logistic is limited, we should make some compromises to at least make something happen if not perfected. It’s better than nothing at all.
Just to bring back a dose of reality in here, if Season’s Beatings was any indication, I would be really wary before declaring that cabs is “the best experience ever for everyone”.
The SB ST cabs had pretty massive technical problems, very long and limiting setup times, the cabs’ control panels themselves each had their issues which had many people complaining (sticks dropping diagonals, people claiming that buttons misfired, screws coming loose, start button getting unplugged, general unfamiliarity with the stick type used), the promised PS converters weren’t even available to use during most of the time because it was too much of a hassle to even access (even during the actual tournament!), there were regularly awkward pauses as people fumbled down the cab’s bottom panel to reach the hidden “insert coin” button, one cab had sound turned off for a long time before a staff member could get to it and fix it, one cab’s screen had a slight red tint over everything on screen and had clear red/green/blue alignment issues, another cab just randomly resetted itself at times, etc. So yeah, lots of players were complaining about it.
For comparison, zero of these problems occured on the HD Remix console setups I bought for casuals and the tourney, which took like five minutes to setup or pack up, and I can’t remember a single complaint or problem about them.
I’m not blaming the SB staff in any way, they did their best to fix the cab problems as they popped up, but these are the kind of problems you get when you try to use cabs. It’s just false to say that cabs are the best experience ever for everyone.
comparing the growth of hdr vs that of ssfiv at evo, is not really good imo since many factors are involved. by evo2k10 there were already some people who started moving away from hdr and into other games (or even back to st only), so that could have taken away from hdr’s numbers.
evo2k09 had sfiv, and there is a big difference between sfiv and ssfiv. ssfiv is actually almost a new game even with the new characters and changes etc. and the changes have been so positive that ssfiv doesn’t have to worry about any “divide” or split in their community. you will not see any movement of players clamoring for a return to sfiv.
hdr’s numbers held pretty steady from evo2k09 to evo 2k10, considering there weren’t any changes, additions, or upgrades. so you’re comparing a 2 yr old game with 1 that was barely even 4 months old
also, hdr did not have the evo2k09 spotlight to itself. when it was released (4th quarter 2008 i think), any hype or momentum it had was clearly affected by the console release of sfiv. actually, although sfiv had maybe 1000+ participants, and hdr only about 300+, hdr would/could have been the game with the most participants had sfiv not been there. and sfiv had alot going for it as far as hype since it was the newest installment vs hdr being just a “remix” of st. and let’s be honest, capcom went all out with sfiv promotion in usa, while hdremix got barely any. and we all know how little it was even promoted in japan.
btw ganelon, i believed i asked this in the “sbo thoughts thread” but didn’t get an answer from anyone. what are the hard numbers looking like at the tourneys on the eastcoast? like, how many more people are showing up for the st tourneys vs the previous events etc.
i believe i read somewhere on the srk forums that evo2k09 and 2k10 had about 300 participants for hdr. in past evo b-series events, i believe st was said to have about 150+ at the most, but clearly nowhere near the numbers of hdr. but even those numbers should be taken with a grain of salt, for the simple fact that evo is obviously more popular and getting bigger still. as exposure increases, of course you’ll see more people. and we don’t have any good way of checking the true interest in the game since so many games are involved at evo. for example, if hdr was the only game at evo, you would get x amount who will show up for it. but since ssfiv, tekken, mvc2, etc are also being played, then that original x amount for hdr + more will play
unless there is some official push or st is somehow released in it’s original form on xbox/ps3 or whatever next gen platform comes along, i don’t see it overtaking hdr at evo, even if it was put to a vote. some games you might see a resurgence, but there has to be something to cause it. like 3s for example. it’s popularity has peaked here in usa, but you will see some resurgence once it’s finally re-released on the consoles (but would it be enough where we’d see it getting center stage at tourneys over other games? that’s a wait and see).
As far as I know, the only east coast tourney so far to emphasize old ST over HDR was Season’s Beatings, which had about 26 entrants for singles and 21 entrants (7 teams of 3) for teams. I think the upcoming NEC will also emphasize old ST.
thelo, how many people entered sbr singles st? i believe i saw a different post from you where you mentioned that 20+ people showed interest in hdr, but because of time issues and what not, it was pushed back a day and by then there was only 9 people who entered. at face value, it would look like interest was very weak for hdr, but in fact, hdr wasn’t given proper attention (certainly not equal to that of st there), so the numbers dwindled the following day. i’m under the impression that the st people would also have entered an hdr tourney (assuming no other factors restraining them), unless they were trying to make a statement by supporting “st only”.
See my post just above for ST attendance.
For ST entrants entering the HDR tourney, I actually individually asked most of them while they were waiting around in the ST tourney area. Some of them just gave a dismissive “no” (like Justin Wong, grafx, Corrosive?), some said it was too late or they had prior arrangements (like damdai (plane to catch), James Chen (SF4 to commentate), megaultrasuper (early ride home to take)), and some of them just said they didn’t play HDR so they wouldn’t enter (don’t remember who offhand). Bisel said he was too tired to enter HDR.
There was one guy who I can’t remember who said he wouldn’t enter because he didn’t have an Xbox stick with him and could only play on bat-top sticks, and the sticks I had were all ball-top (I later found out that Krost brought his bat-top stick with him, so in theory that guy could have used that one).
For Evo SF2 attendance, the only approximate numbers I have are those I’ve entered: Evo 2008 (ST, about 125 entrants, people were saying that it was the biggest US ST tourney to date), Evo 2009 (HDR, ~330 entrants), Evo 2010 (HDR, ~300 entrants).
thelo, in your honest opinion then (strictly yours alone). if st was not present at sbr, and hdremix was a tourney game there instead. do you think the numbers would have come close to the 26 st participants?