Charlie!!!
Ask BKB for Guile. 
Hey, sup man. Sorry I don’t make it out to SF all that often, but MvC2 just ain’t my thing. Though I hear they put up a 3S machine and are getting CvS2 so maybe I’ll be out there more often with Eric and Mark. It’d be great to get some A3 casuals in with a large gathering.
This thread should be a sticky.
Those fireball VCs with Dhalsim and Dan were crazy! Awesome stuff all around, Xenozip. I really liked your Alpha 3 tricks video, and these new videos are just as full of win.
I noticed you didn’t include any of those guard-nullifying crossup VCs with Dhalsim like you did with everyone else… I guess he just doesn’t have any?
Update: Added Juli
Woo, half way done. :o
He has a 50/50, but because it’s not a true guard break I didn’t bother including it (it’s in the Tricks and Tips video tho). Fortunately the corner fireball stuff is a guard crush, so even if they block they eat damage.
But no, his drills can be blocked low and his jump arc and air teleport are simply too slow. I had theorized that maybe he could get the opponent into an extended block stun using shadows, then instant air teleport and do an attack from behind on the way down. Alas, I haven’t found a way to do it yet.
I remember some of James Chen’s V-Charlie combos being pretty cool, but i’m sure you’ll get to him eventually. Sucks that Guile isn’t in arcade SFA3. He’d probably suck but he always has some interesting combos. Anyway i’m an A-Ryu scrub so i guess the V-Ryu video is the one i’m waiting for.
Not necessarily. They are fairly similar. Charlie’s normals do more damage, and his JP SB seems to move slower. Charlie also has his command dash which cancels into the knee bazooka, and both are important for his VC’s.
And I may be on crack, but Guile also seems a tad slower. He also lacks the command dash, but he still has the knee bazooka itself.
Guile’s VC’s most likely consist of just Somersault (then strong normal) and knee bazooka loops till corner (or just Somersault xx knee loop), which is about the same as Charlie, pretty much. Ender is most likely a CC setup into air kick throw (slams, probably).
And he has a deep cross-up, so he probably has a midscreen unblockable.
Another really big thing though, I think Charlies normals are better over-all. His controllable standing MK and c.RH are really good.
But, this is just conjecture. Don’t mind me.
Guile can do (VC3) crouching Jab, Forward Flash Kick [neutral standing Fierce, Forward Flash Kick]x5 as a midscreen, does about 50% damage to Birdie. The shadow of the standing Fierce hits the same time as the regular Fierce hits. You might be able to something with canceling a standing Fierce into a whiffed knee bazooka also, but I can’t really test things out…I don’t have a copy of A3 anymore, and I just happened to have that particular VC on tape (now on DVD since I’m backing up my super-random VHS tapes…random A3 footage followed by 30 seconds of “The View” from 2001, followed by G Gundam).
In the corner he can do something like (VC3) crouching Strong, FK Flash Kick, [crouching Fierce, RK Flash Kick]xn, but I don’t remember exactly how it went.
…in case anyone asks, Dee Jay can do (VC3) c.JP, Short upkick move, c.FP, Short upkick, and then switch to standing Fierce xx whiff upkick. Standing Fierce does more damage. The version I have on tape actually uses standing Roundhouse, which may do the most damage, and will push the opponent towards the corner, whereas other versions will cross themselves up and stay midscreen, sorta like the one V-Cammy midscreen in the Youtube vid. The Roundhouse version does 82 points of damage to Ken, just under 60%.
He can do the same VC in the corner, but just c.FP xx Short upkick over and over, IIRC. I actually wonder if there would be timing problems in HSFA or the A3 Upper…I remember in the DC version, the Guile midscreen had different timing than my old Saturn version, because they probably changed either the speed of Guile’s s.FP or it’s hitbox. I wonder if there any new changes, or if that was a DC-only thing.
About Guile: Guile hella sucks. Terrible. Questionable priority, and Flash Kick is…it’s like they made the move just so you wouldn’t use it. It’s really easy to airblock, at least in the Saturn version (and I hear it was this way in the PSX version, too…I assume he’s better in the DC version and Z3 Upper…though he really couldn’t be any worse). I don’t mean like Charlie’s Flash Kick, or DP’s, etc…I mean, I don’t know if there’s a point where you can’t have it air blocked. And, of course…it’s horrifically unsafe if blocked.
The selection of his normals was questionable, also…V-ISM was the only version worth playing, IMO, but he lost the cool stepkick with Roundhouse that X-Guile has, and of course can’t do the backfist while charging. I also remember some issues with the standing Forward sobat move, probably that it was retarded how you couldn’t do it and charge without moving backwards, but that’s pretty standard.
Guile :: Charlie
Dan :: Ryu
He’s not unplayable, but he’s definitley not as good as Charlie, at all.
Yeah, come to think of it… Guiles’ flash kick is his strongest single-hit move, so you want as many as those pre-damage scaling.
Looks like he can loop [FK flash kick, (any normal move)]xN midscreen. Starting with c.SK xx SK flash kick (then any normal move).
One thing about Guiles flash kick though, I agree it’s not meant for AA outside of VC’s. But during VC’s it’s quick enough that he can AA with a normal move and cancel into flash kick to set the juggle-state.
But yeah, Guile seems like a butchered Charlie. Another major difference I just noticed is their c.FK’s.
Guile’s best version of the his Somersault Kick is the Roundhouse version. Can be blocked in the air, but it has some invincibility.
I like A-Guile; far standing Roundhouse complements his crouching Fierce for a more ranged anti-air. Also has the the crouching kick-stuffing upside down kick. Very nice.
Also gains the non-stationary Sobat, which helps his offense some. Level 3 Sonic Hurricane is great anti-air, though damage isn’t very spectacular (about 40%).
V-Guile’s VC was VC2-> crouching Short-> Short SK-> [crouching Fierce-> Forward SK] x n. Very damaging.
Also, in HSFA and SFA3 Arrange, but not the Saturn, PSX or DC versions, why does Guile’s kick air throw score 2 hits?
Thanks :karate:
I’ve never gotten far in playing SFA3 competitively, but is there a reason for doing two whiffed throws after almost every combo? LOL, is it just a signature, or does it have something to do with not being in a neutral state and them air recovering? Aren’t those two things related, therefore having a purpose for crouch canceling and all that? >_>
Good stuff. :o
Hmm… Could the air throw be because of the slam properties? Was it a slam in the Saturn, PSX, and DC versions?
Capcom may have overlooked it originally and rather than recoding the move, they just lowered the damage of the initial hit and then copy/pasted the code for a slam throw and tagged it onto the end of his throw. Lazy wins.
Whiffed throws build meter. But it’s more of a signature than anything else, I guess.
Yeah, that’s the Guile VC i came up with… doesn’t seem to have much else. No infinte, can’t cancel boom recovery during VC (I think), etc. Is there anything else?
He can combo after boom combo in the corner… but seriously, it ain’t much. It’s nice to VC after they jump a boom, but could he be better in another -ism?
Update: Added Charlie.
Update: Added Chun-Li
Thanks to Middlekick for helping with the stomp cancel info.
Holy shit late for work. I’m out.
Nice work. However, when Chun cancels the stomp into a VC, she is supposed drop down very quickly, keeping the opponent in block-stun. I suspect that this is more likely to occur when the stomp is performed as an instant overhead or when Chun is very low to the ground.
A good set-up would: blocked cross-up jumping Short-> IOH/LTTG stomp-> VC-> cross-up Short etc. and Chun should drop down super-fast, leading to the unblockable.
Nice V-Charlie unblockables. I’ve never seen anything like the first one before.
Hmm… Weird. Well it appears I can hit a crouching Ryu instantly when leaving the ground and it still doesn’t work.
Tried cross-up, IOH, VC.
Tried j.HP, IOH, VC.
Then tried them both on crouching Ryu. Still no luck.
Is there some trick to it? A kattobi maybe?
No worries though, I wanted to re-record a few of those combos anyway. I’ll remove the video for now 'till I get it fixed.
Really? The acho nash players use that as their primary B&B. I’m pretty sure I x-copied his anti-air from TOMA.
I’ve seen the anti-air ones before as well as the midscreen ones starting with low short xx LK Flash Kick, but that corner one where you did a bunch of blocked low shorts into unblockable j.HK is new to me.
Oh, I see. Didn’t know what you meant by “the first one”.
Incidentally there’s a few more characters that have similar ones (akuma, blanka, honda, rolento, to name a few). But they aren’t as “safe” as the midscreen crossup ones.
One of the many benefits of shadow hits. It actually keeps them in perpetual blockstun untill you break their guard. Though grapplers don’t have much use for it.