Just wondering what are the max damage corner DHC’s into vergil
with no Groundbounce/Wallbounce
With only WB
WIth only GB
Also how do I get the high time extension using jam session. I can’t figure out the timing to get j.s/helm breaker midscreen.
With no wallbounce, I don’t know that you can get anything with roundtrip (if I’m wrong, please correct me! Sometimes I like to get the opponent cornered with my Nova BnB), so you might end up just doing swords -> double lunar phase (and then another swords -> double lunar phase if you still have your groundbounce). Seriously, is there any way to get out of the corner without a wallbounce or an OTG assist?
With ground bounce and wallbounce I’m pretty sure max damage is lunar phase -> lunar phase -> stinger -> round trip, and then loop from there. Or what CoosCoos posted above. Without ground bounce is what interests me as well… I’m running Nova/Vergil/Doom; does anyone have a decent max-damage combo that either doesn’t require the groundbounce or that builds in nova’s assist? I’ve been trying to get double lunar phase with the nova assist built in, but is that max damage? And does it work on the whole cast? I can’t get it consistently; the timing to get the nova assist on the first lunar phase is a pain.
Also, trying CoosCoos’s loop on a pad, standard A configuration… Clawing. I’ve gotten better at it since I picked up Vergil. 
Seems like H (B on my pad) is the button to hold down. Trying to sneak a nova assist in there… not the easiest thing in the world.
For Nova/Vergil, you can either do an unfly loop to dp.L > hyper in order to not use the groundbounce, or you can reset it after the DHC.
If you use the groundbounce, simply call Nova at any time during the loop. Alternatively, do the loop as normal, and after the Lunar Phase which will result in a hard knockdown, do Call Nova > delayed High Time > Trick Down > c.H > Stinger.
If you don’t use the groundbounce, do the loop as normal, and after the first Lunar Phase, do c.H + Nova > Lunar Phase > c.H > Stinger. Alternatively, do the loop as normal, but after the first Lunar Phase, do c.H > Lunar Phase > Call Nova > delayed High Time > Trick Down > c.H > Stinger.
Your team is much better as Nova/Doom/Vergil, though. I don’t recall if that was discussed on this forum or the Nova one. But Nova/Doom/Vergil is stronger bc:
No need for Sword DHC when you have easy TAC infinites and a safe DHC.
Doom has better incoming, and one of the best ways to get Vergil in safely.
If all else fails, you want Vergil to be anchor to give you another shot at blocking the incoming mixup and letting him play.
The threat of TAC infinites opens up the opportunity for TAC baits.
Hmm… See, I really like Nova/Vergil instead of Nova/Doom because with vergil I can get a guaranteed kill on most of the cast, whereas with doom my damage maxes out at around 850k without a TAC or reset. But I have faced matchups against mixup-heavy teams and thought to myself “Damn, I wish my vergil wasn’t out front right now…” I’ll experiment a bit more. Thanks for the tips WRT the loops.
When doing sword loop, I often like to end a combos with Sword, RT, c.:h:, qcf+:l:, c.:h:, dpf+:m:. I’m sure many of you have had that fatal drop on dpf+:m:. Is there any way to confirm that they will take the last hit or that it won’t whiff entirely? I can’t tell you how many matches I lose because of the occasional drop where they roll out and punish me.
Omit the last c.H (and the qcf.L too if you’re really worried), and dp.M shouldn’t miss.
picked up vergil recently, so i been playing the sparda brothers shell a lot, some dante/vergil/doom combos, let me know if i can optimize them anymore guys, any input would help.
first part of the video is point vergil stuff, the rest is point dante.
[Deleted!]
Normally I would post this thing here, but I felt it need it’s own thread due to how complex the subject is. Basically I made a thread for exploring Vergil’s RT/Sword loops covering options, adjustments, and common issues in hopes of improving them. I feel it necessary as c.:h:, qcf+:l:, c.:h: is not optimal and is very risky as the norm.
Check it out and help if you can, I cover some neat stuff such as an RT loop that charges into another RT loop for free …and the discovery that Vergil’s sword loop, dpf+:m:…has side specific properties (fuuuuuuuuuck)
[Fixing Vergil’s RT/Sword Loop Inconsistencies](Fixing Vergil’s RT/Sword Loop Inconsistencies
I am working very hard on some great Vergil updates that I am collaborating with another popular front page SRK member once we have established consistency in our finds. A lot of these will greatly improve combos and options. As a tease…we have a solo anywhere on screen 1 meter BnB at 880K+ off s.
, Tons of vergil/strider synergy (no more silly hightime, vajra, hightime extensions…), Why helm > raw XF > DT > loops is bad and how there’s a much better thing you can do now, etc… So any help in that thread is greatly appreciated. I’m not sure when the video will drop as it’s a lot tech and we want these to be as practical as possible.
Can’t wait to see that
I’m really excited about the new Helm > X-factor combo. All x-factor levels deal 1.25mil, work on happy birthdays, all characters and stage positions, and are meter positive…No one will EVER need to do XFC > DT ever again unless already in X-factor. Hopefully this will release before next week, I’ll be filming saturday.
The big one that I’m trying to work on is improving those Sword loops. It won’t earn him much more meter or damage, but I’m seeking a universal optimal variation. I think ultimately I’ll find my answer in side specific loops. I think we’ll have one for each side and prevent a lot of the drops we see. The RT loops are still iffy and my best solution won’t work late in combos. Currently I have optimal combos that help him, but given the random issues, it still suffers random inconsistencies and I’d rather fix those then show the world how to get 1 free hit to charge RT w/o glitch if it might drop 20% of the time.
Did you guys see clockwork doing the blistering swords combo? That was sick.
Link?
I can’t find videos of this but the combo is: instant overhead blistering L - c.l, c.m, s.h, stinger - 1 sword - s.h, stinger - 1 sword - s.h - stinger - (by this time the swords fire by themselves) - round trip, wavedash backward so the RT does more hits, teleport M, c.H and then the basic loop using wall bounce, grond bounce, vajra etc.
It works fine on standing characters but i find it inconsistent on crouching. I think you have to delay some moves a bit when they’re crouching.
Sounds amazing! Really looking forward to it.
It’s going to be a minute before the video drops so I’d figure I’d give up the XF3 variant now and let you all experiment. Basically we’re testing consistency in all x-factor levels, happy birthdays, corner/mid, etc…
So basically whenever you get a raw helm breaker, don’t do XFC > DT, hightime…do this instead:
These basically do 1.25 mil as quick as possible with the most reliability and you can do a lot of free form as well so experiment with what you find reliable. We’ll have our vid when we do, but if you find tips on consistency please share. And one thing to note is we are being mostly careful during swords since finding it has side specific properties. So our old combo was:
and for optimal (yet inconsistent) shits and giggles…
This will ONLY work on player 1 side, on player 2 they will almost always fall out so you must do a slight dash adjustment first.
More to come…but have fun with this.
Those are sick. They seem to work fine with no adjustments in xf2 as well. They also work off a back throw in the corner.
Neat stuff, but spending a bar for DT is better than spending a bar for Swords, in XF. But, if they have enough health, you will build meter during that…You should figure out at what point it’s more optimal to do those combos over DT combos, because it’s likely not always the case. If they only have ~800k or something, I’d much rather spend the bar for DT and have those powerful bonuses for the next character, over building a small amount of meter.
After several tests we’ve found that swords is all around superior for many reasons.
[list]
[] Depending on the variant you use, you either use less X-factor due to all the hits or about the same. In many cases the character can be killed quicker due to low life and vastly beat out DT. This is because of how many hits you are doing.
[] Works on corner, happy b-day, mid screen etc… those adjustments are logged, but not posted on here yet
[] You gain meter, if completed easily over a meter gained. This means you get meter to pop a fresh DT for the incoming if you want that benefit.
[] It is more consistent and easier to execute. While some cases of happy b-day and getting 1.25 rather than an easier 1.1 variant can be a little off, we are nearly solid on 100% variations.
[] If you screw up but keep the combo alive you can make adjustments
[] Swords leads to a reset opportunity on tech if you screw up…DT just drops them
[/list]
In cases where all you need is a small amount of damage…you shouldn’t need to burn DT. Just high time, x-factor and do a normal BnB. Then you have more meter and can then use DT. Once you pass the threshold that you need DT to kill quick enough to save X-factor time…you’re pretty much at the point you should be using swords and you’ll get the whole meter back anyway. XF3 vergil hits like a truck, if they’re low life they should die very fast without needing DT. Mind you their may be minor cases…but overall I see DT as only useful once you’re already in x-factor.
There is a 1.25+mil for x1-3, happy birthdays included…and they will kill thor/haggar in a happy birthday at XF1.
Hey guys, I am a vergil point who is trying to learn a frank/dante team. I have done a lot of searching and cant seem to find any up to date jam session extensions for vergil that dont use my ground bounce (so i can hard tag into frank for the level up). I prefer to do the high time opener so combos that use that into jam session would be great if they exist. Help would be greatly appreciated!