thats exactly why it isnt well known. Maybe the range on the lift up hit of the tatsu can be increased
Even if they did that you’d still want to hit confirm it so I don’t really see that as an essential change. He already has c. lp, c. lp, c. hp, Tatsu. Just use that.
didnt think of that…your right:bgrin:
scratches it off of fix it list
They should replace all of his moves with Shoryukens. His playstyle among the newbies wouldn’t even change slightly…
Well I offered just changing his shoulder throw to the knee bash. Why couldn’t he dash under them? Dash forward, back up? The mixup is there, it would just be something else he could use.
Just an idea nothing more.
GTFO…
I hope you don’t think I was bashing the idea. I would LOVE to see the knee bash in. I just don’t want it to be too good (no one else really got their throw loops in SFIV, and do we really want to be even more afraid of Balrog’s throw?), and I don’t want it to be useless either. I just didn’t have any suggestions on how to make it useful, so I guess my post was pretty pointless.
If Ken’s tatsus had these properties, it would actually be scary getting hit by them:
LK Tatsu: +1 on hit, 0 on block, travels just like it does now, about 50 more stun
MK Tatsu: +1 on hit, -1 on block, travels just like it does now, but the first knee has a little bit more range, about 50 more stun
HK Tatsu: 0 on hit, -2 (maybe -3) on block, same travel, 50 more stun
EX Tatsu: +2 on hit, 0 on block, the first knee has more range, 50 more stun OR +3 on hit, -1 on block, -50 or so stun. With the damage scaling the way it is, even if you link a hit confirm combo afterward, it would do shit damage… However, if you could link another tatsu, you would get massive stun… Hmm… Maybe take away 100 stun, since I think EX Tatsu, hit confirm, HK Tatsu would be an instant stun against Seth and Akuma.
I dunno… I just don’t think Ken should EVER be thrown out of his own damn Tatsu set ups. That’s my only problem with it. If the opponent knows that the odds of them throwing you out of the tatsu or the odds of their normals beating yours were slim to none, then they’d be a lot more afraid of the tatsu.
I like your thoughts on this, I dont think the +3 will on ex will happen just because you would be able to do some gnarly damage…ex tatsu, crouching light light, cr. medium kick, ex tatsu,crouching light light,cr. medium kick, ex tatsu,crouching light light, cr. medium kick ex tatsu… or something like that
my biggest agreement is the LK tatsu…I hate how it leaves you at -5 on hit…
After the first tatsu loop, each hit of that combo you mentioned would probably be doing 1 damage… The damage scaling is crazy in this game. Even if you used it to dizzy someone, you punish combo would be scaled to hell. In essence, that would just be flash…
But I know +3 is too much. At the very least, you could to ex tatsu, hit confirm shoryu, which would net your tatsu a free knockdown just like Ryu get’s off his tatsu…
+2 on ex tatsu would make it scary.
+3 advantage on anything is kind of ridiculous… besides, I’m fairly certain Tatsu’s don’t scale per hit, since damage scaling revolves around the number of moves used.
Besides, like mentioned above, EX Tatsu > cr.jab > cr.mk > EX Tatsu > cr.jab > cr.mk > EX Tatsu would require serious damage and stun nerfs.
agreed… the thought that my tatsu would actually make opponents have a small bit of fear makes me…:clapdos:
yes its per move…it would still scale by the end but you would still get some pretty good damage and stun like you said
Considering that Ken has to work so damn hard when compared to the other two shotos, it makes me wonder why Tatsu isn’t positive on hit in the first place. It’s fucking stupid.
Seriously, I think making it at least +1 and upping the damage on his DPs is all he needs.
Aside from that, let’s say that Ken has a second ultra.
What would it be? Shippu?
Seeing as there’s no ultra cancel (nor should there be) I don’t see how it would help his game. Unless of course, this new move that they mentioned compliments it…
Watch it not even be a new move. It’ll most likely just be funky kicks.
You are completely exaggerating the scaling. cl.RH EX tatsu already does what? 320 damage? adding jab, RH tatsu gets you another 130 damage, if you end up close enough to get all of the EX SRK instead of doing the RH tatsu that’s pushing 500 damage, that’s not “flash”, that’s absurd. Even Sagat/Akuma/Viper does less damage than that for a bar or two. That’s more than most people get off of an RSF. And that’s not even thinking about EX tastu->cr.jab->EX tatsu nonsense.
You’re at +1, have a three frame short and an uppercut. It’s already scary against most people without a reversal, and making it +2 isn’t going to scare Sagat or Ryu.
Seriously, you should never be able to get guaranteed hits from landing an EX tatsu. That’s way too dumb.
I’m saying that even good Kens get grabbed after their EX tatsu. All I want is for that to not be the case. You either make them commit to a reversal, or sit there and block… I know the +3 frames is much. That was just me talking. But +2 is pretty much a necessity.
Agreed, so is guaranteed safe on block… why make the new [ssf4] lk/mk/hk.tatsu recover better than old [sf4] ex.tatsu does on block. Now that is OP Mr.B.
the current mk and hk tatsu are fine on frame adv; lk and ex tatsu could use the buff to up his mix up game; needs some risk reward too.
lk.tatsu +1 on hit, -3 on block (like current ex)
mk.tatsu +0 on hit, -4 on block (like is now)
hk.tatsu -1 on hit, -5 on block (like is now)
ex.tatsu +2 on hit, -2 on block (1 frame buff is plenty)
up the stun on mk/hk/ex 1st hit, up the dmg on ex 1st hit, and have the spins float airborne foes too.
hmm… i still like the idea of different outcomes if the knee hits or not since you can space for it to whiff in a combo. What if the knee juggled his foes and the spins would float airborne opponents? then a close tatsu would knock down. If not maybe as a CH.
I just want to put emphasis on this. Theres no way in hell you should have the same amount of options I do after I hit you with an ex tatsu. I mean, ok, I hit ex tatsu in kens current situation now. I either cr.lk, throw, or dp or mix it up. You should be either trying to reversal or BLOCK, why the fuck would you be rewarded with a third option in a throw off of MY mix up.
I really think the frames on block for tatsu should remain the same.
i think at maximum tatsu on block should be -2, ryu has this advantage and as such he’s able to get in on fireball zoners much easier, meanwhile the rush-down version of the pair ken does not have this option for getting in… and it’s not like tatsu is un-counterable, you can crouch and duck under > punish. uppercut, punish etc.
edit: on second thought ken’s does do a lot of damage on hit though… so maybe have it safe only if spaced well to where it’s hitting 1 or 2 times (ie. ken can’t just throw random tatsu’s in close but can use them to enter a fireball zone.
backdash
Maybe lk tatsu could leave ken some space, each tatsu shoudn’t leave you point blank, since what would be the real point for all the strengths.