Thx Mr. Basara!! It says that Ryu has lower body invincibility during 3 to 16 frames of Light SRK meaning I can’t hit him while he’s in the air? I’m gonna go confirm this in training mode.
I’m not gonna go and read all this thread, cuz Dr. Chao’s post summed up everything that needs fixing with Ken.
If half of those things are addressed, I love Capcom all over again. Like the first time I played DMC–I might just call out of work for a week.
based off the frame date of ken close mk and fk have the exact same start up and active which is 8 and 3 which can’t even be linked with lp or lk. It should be at least 5 max start up to at least make the kick useful other than in a jump,which ken has much better options if a jump in is connected. i occasionally use it after certain jumps ins followed by cr hp xx tatsu on characters with large hit box’s like gouken and honda. ryu’s is 3 and 3. capcom fix this for ken.
This kick is virtually useless. The only good thing about thing about this kick is it forces stand, but why would anyone ever use it when there’s cr hp. If the start up frame for this was lowered that would be a huge booster for combo damage
For instance cr lk, cr lp, cl mk, cr mk, ex tatsu could become a new and decent bnb for ken. or we could add cr lp, cr lk to the combo already possible to the characters above. so bottom line lower startup on cl mk.
Lets be honest, ken doesn’t need anything besides a way to connect full ultra 100% of the time. “Anything less, would be uncivilized” if anything he should get more + frames on EX hado so that its easier to fadc current ultra afterwards. Even if its only 1-3 extra frames ill take it, besides that combo is sexy enough as it is. If it was just a little easier to land i wouldnt complain, they could leave him exactly the way he is now adding those 2 buffs and i would say hes perfect.
p.s Alpha roll, and Crazy Kick additions were confirmed by at SSF4 Capcom event in NY. I cant give any names or other information, but suffice it to say you can rest assured you heard it hear first. :wgrin:
If you’re not full of it that would be interesting to see
Names, links, or vidz, or you’re full of it…
And Ken needs his shoryukens fixed… I personally think the MP shoryu should do one hit and the FP shoryu should knock down on the first hit always, just like a counter hit shoryu.
ken needs his shoryuken fix, this the worst they have ever been including in ST. I want his normals fix. He is a rush down, kick priority person so all his normal kicks should do there job well. faster start up on cl mk and sweep, and desent target combo damage. i mean we have a focus attack that’s slow and spines us around on recovery!
I don’t really mind his focus. It seems to get the job done. If it was too fast, fireballers would be useless against Ken, thanks to kara focus. However, if I was to nit pick it, I would say the animation is horrible. The kick looks terrible… like a kick that someone first starting karate would do… Not someone who spent their entire early life learning it…
They can keep his Focus attack frames the exact same way they are now… But please give use a prettier kick…
Or they could actually have him move forward during his fa. I hate that he stands still and I have to kara focus. A tad bit more range on it would be nice…even C.Vipers FA moves forward and its completely useless to her lol
But if it moved him forward AND we could kara it, then it would make fireballers useless against him. Well… Not useless, but Ken would be able to get in too easily… And kara focus fishing would DESTROY Chun and a few other characters.
Not that I’m totally against fireballs being useless against ken. I’d sacrifice kens current fireball for that to tell you the truth. Make it disappear like chuns to compensate. Maybe I do wanna destroy chun and other characters, yes you guile, yes you sim. lol
Ok don’t kill me for this but ken isn’t about knocking people down? That’s you guys general idea right. That he prefers on their feet mixups? The game engine reduces the impact of throws in a couple of ways from ST’s engine.
- All throws have some startup frames.
- Teching a throw avoids all damage.
- Due to 1 they are easier to reverse out of.
What if we give him his kneebash back, with no mash, like boxer’s headbutt throw. Except like ST it doesn’t knock down, and lets him jump on them/dash under them. In ST he could safe jump practically everyone with his knee bash setting up a safe jump. He doesn’t have to get a safe jump for IV, just a really tight window. It could just be his forward throw.
I want ken to have a command grab(knee bash perhaps) I think it would add to his tatsu mix up…at least you would have a little more fear from them:lovin:
Command grab? I dunno how to feel about this…
It’s like when the guy who made the Guile thread started talking about Guile having a command grab. WTF?
I would love me some knee bash mix ups, but I don’t know how well they’d work in slow mo SFIV engine mode. Ken walks too slowly to reliably walk under them. I guess he could stop RIGHT underthem, so when they fall “on” him, no one knows which way they should block. 
As much as I love the idea of him getting his knee bash back (though I don’t know what command they would give it, unless it was like 3s and it’s command was just lp+lk with no directional input), I just don’t see how they’d balance it out. I don’t want it being OP and then EVERYONE using Ken… But at the same time, I don’t want it in there, but it ends up useless due to how NON ST the SFIV engine is…
While the return of the knee bash could be nice, I wouldn’t want it to be a command grab as that makes it a special move Ken has never had (and would rather see a psuedo-shoto like Dan with one if anything) and frankly doesn’t need.
seriously… it’s starting to sound like Ken players want to be Abel with his cmd grabs, rolls, overheads and SRK (or 3s Sean)
If you want more fear from a tatsu, give the tatsu options based on input strength and how it lands (spacing and frame adv) not a new move that gets the old moves nerfed to compensate. With a soft buff to ex.tatsu ken could mixup with a cr.lk/srk/throw on hit.
I would want his SSF4 hp.SRK more like in SSF2 and not knock down on 1st hit. iirc its (burning) stun lasted the full active frames (rise) of the attack with just 1 hit and ~1/2 the recovery frames (descent) with 2 hits. With SF4 data he has 24 frames of hit stun; 8 more than his 16 active. FC and your sitting on a lvl 2 FA 
+6 more hit stun frames and he could FADC into a full ground Ultra. This also narrows the window to punish the 1 hit hp.srk.
yeah I think Ken should generally…
- walk faster than Ryu.
- have more forward range on each SRK (by input) than his shoto bro, with a subtle 2nd advantage (unique to input).
- be buffed more in his (standing) mixups than his (knockdown) resets.
- have less safe specials than Ryu but harder to punish when spaced properly on block.
- have a useful FB, despite being less dominate to Ryu’s in speed, dmg, start up, or recovery.
yes I would want more fear of it, yes I know command grab was a bit odd for him but well…thats what a suggestion thread is…an idea and feedback on it.
So if command throw is too weird, how would you soft buff the tatsu?
didn’t say weird, just unnecessary given his current tools. Remove the tatsu, add a cmd grab, and you practically have the [media=youtube]2QrCq9v-pH8"]SFex shoto clone [URL=“http://strategywiki.org/wiki/Street_Fighter_EX/Characters/Allen”[/media]. Not a bad shoto, but different game plan then ken.
1st make the 1st hits of tatsu a knee bash that force stands the foe.
2nd make it so landing just the 2 spin kicks of lk.tatsu has frame adv like the current ex.tatsu.
3rd like Fei’s rekka, when spaced properly, a tatsu could be harder to punish on block.
4th increase 1st hit’s stun dmg by 25 on mk/hk/ex.tatsu
5th take 1 frame off of ex.tatsu’s current recovery and add +10 dmg to 1st hit.
- add extra lp in combo strings and lk.tatsu’s 1st hit can whiff but last two can still connect (11 frame window)
- add extra lp in block strings and tatsu’s 1st hit can whiff for cross up shenanigans
tatsu already does this(maybe your just stating that this needs to stay or I am misunderstanding what you mean)
I like the ideas of being harder to punish on block if properly spaced. or maybe if blocked you get spaced more from opponent
well… I don’t think the tatsu force stands the foe :wonder: cr.hp does.
but yes spaced so one or two spins getting blocked should keep you further away from the opponent while only hitting with one or two spins could net you frame advantage. In this way ken is trading hits and dmg for safety and mixup options.
while it might be too much… I’ld consider adding juggle (on CH) and float properties to knee and spin parts respectively.
It does.
The knee of Tatsu does stand them up.
But using this requires you to not hit confirm a tatsu so I wouldn’t consider it useful information.
There are only two things I think Ken needs:
A damage buff.
Tatsu being +1 on hit.
Other than that I’d say he’s fine.
EDIT:…AARRRRGH, ok, I’m lying.
Buff his DPs. I mean, this might be a nitpicky reason, but how does KEN end up with the worst DPs in the game?
I dunno about his DP having counter-hit properties all the time, but seriously, do somthing.