Well technically he can do judgement cut. That’s +8 on block.
What? I just tested it to make sure I wouldn’t look like an idiot when I posted that and no he can’t if he’s not in DT. Tested using Judgment Cut too.
(whiff cancel, not cancel from a blockstring)
And I guess to be absolutely clear, you need to pushblock him before he ends his blockstring so he whiffs his last hit, then he has to super or die if he’s not in DT.
I’ve seen Vergil accidentally wife stuff a lot thanks to push block. However, I don’t see him punished enough for it, I blame experience.
Also, canceling into judgement cut usually isn’t a very good block string.
Also, he neutral is sketchy and his defense is ass.
Haggar and Iron Fist shouldn’t be in the same tier as Hsien-Ko PW.
Although I still have my doubts on Nick being totally bottom tier.
Akuma is still one of the best level 3 x-factor characters
even his speech after coming in with 2 allies K.O.ed proves so. “Finally! A true battle!”
Frosty Fausting tournament was a Vergil invasion. Top 3 all Vergil players… Sam’s Club, Omg Itz Andre and Zeus. Zeus ran a train through everyone’s team with Vergil and the occasional Dark Wesker. Really impressive play.
Dude. Everyone disagrees. I gave way more than that, you just refuse to see it.
I find Vergil to be pretty easy to use. I don’t know why people still whiff stuff with Vergil in his regular form. As long as you do a short string into rising sun and they block any hit of the sun you can’t be punished after you teleport down. His normals are so absurdly long and on point you can easily cover them with assists if you’re really that bad at whiffing his stuff. Has the most left/right mix ups of any character in the game so basically the longer you sit around against Vergil without hitting him the sooner you’re going to get opened up into DT/sword combo etc.
He’s even easier in a 2nd spot or anchor spot where you just give him meter for DT and most every special he had that was unsafe before is pretty much safe. Even doing stupid useless shit like raw lunar phase is only neg 2 on block instead of the normal neg 7. 20 percent damage increase, 15 percent speed increase plus sitting on XF means you really don’t have to think a whole lot to start running the team with mix ups. Especially if you kill one character that’s free left/right with the round trip on the next character. If that don’t work then you get neg 3 on block rapid slash, teleport + assist mix up and from longer distances even a decent high/low mix up with air dash H or dash up c.L.
I don’t know I think he’s really easy to use and just a bit meter dependent. Not much he can’t do IMO.
I wouldn’t worry about Vergil too much since he basically just barely rounded up into the A plus tier. His score was better than anybody else in the A tier by a considerable margin but he like barely made the round up into A+ tier. I only did a 5 letter tier list because I wanted something simple that shows a quick idea of which characters are clearly thought to be a class above the others. Some of the characters in the B tier could qualify as like a B+ tier but for a quick tier list I felt being B+ tier wasn’t that much of a difference from being a B.
The next time I do the tier list it will most likely have a B+ tier and a B minus tier because there’s basically a lot of characters fighting to get out of Cool tier it’s just they didn’t score high enough to really round them up. The next tier list we do after another major things could very well change for any character outside of maybe the S tier. It’s just in general it seems like there’s about 10 characters that really run the game, (6 slighty better than the other 4), a set of about another 10 very formidable characters with usually solid assists…and then there’s the guys that need backup, are best used for their assists or basically just aren’t that hot in general.
I was going to talk about why Viper isn’t top tier, but someone already did that. lol @ Theory Viper. I’ve been using her since vanilla and still don’t feel comfortable with burning meter on EX moves, unless I’m punching through projectile spammers.
I was also going to talk about Dormammu’s lacking speed, but someone beat me to it.
I’m almost certain someone talked about Felicia already, so no point going there…
Welp, I guess everything I would’ve said has been said already. THIS TIER LIST IS QUESTIONABLE. Can’t wait for it to be updated.
SN: Hsien-Ko is severely underrated. If more people took the time to see just how well she can obliterate a rush character, they’d realize she’s not quite as useless as they make her out to be. Of course, not many will see that potential, because they’re too busy nailing her to the bottom of the barrel, all the while bitching about Phantom Dance-using shadeless Weskers. No one progresses while complaining, and everyone rides the tier-whore train to Neverland, so they never really get a good look at everyone else. Just sayin’… if you stop swimming in Wesker skeet, you might notice that some other characters aren’t dicking around.
Remember Vanilla? Shitty MODOK, let’s all laugh at him and question his place in Marvel.
sigh Some of you STILL question his place in Marvel.
Remember shitty Arthur?
That’s all I’ll say about that… good day, children of the popcorn.
Akuma has self mix ups via Demon Flip and his ridiculous Tatsu. Can’t say the same for Cap. Also, Akuma can convert off a random fullscreen with any full screen assist + j.Projectile. After that, watch as he nearly kills almost anyone in the cast and uses Wesker to extend his combos to 1.1 mill damage.
You said the most important think I was going to say: His neutral game is ass.
People concentrate way too much on combos apparently. Vergil has good normals for the neutral, but besides that he’s sub-par in that area. Felicia’s neutral game isn’t very great either, but she has a 1 frame command grab, safer strings, and Delta Kick.
Trish and Ammy on the other hand both have neutral games far superior to Vergil’s.
Oh ok, I didn’t want to put words in your mouth.
Apex stream. Demon Hyo proving what I said about Dormammu providing you play the matchup properly. CJ’s Dorm didn’t even get a combo.
His neutral and defensive game are both decent, more then enough to help him get the single bar necessary to get overly offensive or defensive depending on the match up.
This had to be the most chaotic, unorganized post ever.
Also, Hsien-Ko cannot obliterate anybody. Seriously, no on. Unless she’s an assist with gold armor lol.
My small issue with the list is that Hsien Ko, PW and Tron were consistently voted in the bottom tier by pretty much every one in this thread. They really should be differentiated from Iron Fist, Haggar, Iron Man, She Hulk etc. who made the cut in the 2nd worst tier or just below Mid. It just doesn’t feel right.
Well to be fair, just because they’re in the same tier doesn’t mean they’re even. I mean, there’s clearly a top and bottom to each tier.
The characters in this game are so close. I can see someone making a Tron team work just as well as a She-Hulk team despite the latter being a better character.
Ya know?
You should really read what I said…
Hsien-Ko can obliterate a rush character. That’s definitely true. Most of her attacks have a hurtbox that extends beyond her hitbox, and most of her moves linger. Especially in this rendition, she has various methods of swinging into and out of pressure areas. While her crossup isn’t as great as many others, her ability to limit the safety of a rush’s movement is beyond daunting.
In general there’s just way too large of a difference between the abilities of Wesker or Viper compared to Hsien Ko where it would really matter. The most anyone could realistically push her too especially considering one of her special moves is basically a random mode item toss is B tier at best. She has a solid assist when armored but it’s not what Haggar assist used to be at all and you’re shit out of luck using it against any team with full screen projectile supers.
If you want somebody that shits on non projectile rush characters because their normals are ginormous and disjointed, just play Vergil or Zero.
I’m sorry, but I’ll have to see it to believe it.
I did read your post dude. It’s incorrect. She isn’t going to obliterate rush down characters. Everything you said is negligible. Did you just use the word daunting to describe Hsien-Ko’s use against rush? Oh my lord, you’re misguided. She can’t handle pressure. Her moves are too slow on start up and not very useful in defense…there is no need for me to type more. I can already see where this is going.
@everyone question the tiers:
I also disagree with some of this, but you can’t take things so offensively. Sometimes it isn’t just that character can’t do things well, it’s that other characters do it better. We could argue often times that a character can do things pretty damn well, but we’d be wasting our time if we didn’t consider what characters can do it better + more. Ya know?