[FONT=arial]Hsien-Ko is capable in the right team any slight tweak could create a broken team not hsien-ko but a team, imagine hsien ko with character like she-hulk, zero, ammy etc. Airtola made hsien ko work and as beaten 90% of the so called top player. Chris G made ryu work and ryu is getting a buff i though ryu is very underrated strong character. Jint made cap work one of the deadliest Captain america. If combofiend wasn’t using Spencer people will say Spencer is not tourney worthy.[/FONT]
if I worked at capcom I would buff my chars and nerf yours
I expect to be hired by capcom within the hour
this
task for god tier honzo
who says he isn’t in ultimate:nunchuck:
Oof. Though yeah, I came to that conclusion long ago. If this is true, I’m not sure why Niitsuma wouldn’t want to see his favorite girl do well and would actually be fine with her losing tools and options from her other games.
On teams with Hsien-Ko, she’s pretty clearly the weak point. How exactly would she be broken? What’s preventing other characters from becoming broken with slight tweaks that are already better? Hsien-Ko is not Spencer. Really, I want to know what makes Hsien-Ko fine as she is.
But then that means Tasky gets stuck in some weird buff/nerf limbo and gets sucked into his own tier. Either that, or he doesn’t change at all.
a freind i play with recently got dealt hsien ko on a random select, and during the match he asked me “how the hell can you play hsien -ko?” i simply responded “with difficulty” a lot of my game with her has devolved into SJ ing around all over the place and abusing the crap out of her J. H until i get a hitconfirm.
Unfortunately, that’s mostly all you can do in the empty space. There isn’t a whole lot you can do to hit confirm with her when she’s as slow as she is.
Ok, first off, MVC in general was MADE to get you very salty. So keep on bitching, people.
SECOND that doesnt mean there isnt things to bitch about. Xfactor stupidness, Phoenix, yuh know the rest.
SERIOUSLY. I used to play Ko all the time, but now over time since my skill level has changed, she is COMPLETE ass. The only thing I find really useful about her now is her golden mode, and the fact that she has pretty easy unblockables, with that low to the ground J.H
(Hsien-ko’s looking pretty doomed at present. Not going to lie.)
Well, I seen not much has changed with regards to this despite my absence, at least.
As much as I’m a “low tier warrior” or, at least, someone who generally doesn’t enjoy playing most top tier characters for one reason or another, I’m going to be rather blunt here: this is a fucking stupid attitude to have.
If a character is going to be in the game, they should never be a waste of a slot. (Oh hi there, MvC2 Roll.)
Wanting to see characters lose some really stupid “herp-derp” shit (if you’re even for nerfs at all, since some people apparently aren’t) is understandable. Wanting to see characters become straight out bad so that “true fans” of the character will still use them is dumb, especially when, in this case, so far it seems like they’ve done very little to fix what’s actually completely retarded about Dark Phoenix as a couple of other people have already said; if anything, she arguably got a slight buff with Air X-Factor since she no longer has to wait to hit the ground to become God, so you can’t, say, instantly kill her with Level 3 X-Factor Dormammu twice over on her way in anymore.
It’s even worse since your examples aren’t very good. Clockwork doesn’t really like the character–or, rather, he loathes Dark Phoenix whereas regular Phoenix is the one getting nerfed–and has said like months ago that he’s dropping her for Strider. Filipino Champ, as much as I don’t get most of the hate for the guy, has a rather mediocre Phoenix (IMO) and seems to rely on her going Dark more than any of the other pros I see use Phoenix, which basically means that you’re making him more dependent on (Dark) Phoenix as a crutch, not less.
I’m sure there will still be some people who use Phoenix that are actually fans of the character–she’s actually rather fun to play rushdown-style. However, that doesn’t change the fact Capcom seems to be completely missing the point of what’s actually wrong with her.
I’m not “salty” about it, but despite being initially somewhat glad about it and saying that it would force people to become better with regular Phoenix, I’ve come to realize that if this is all they’re changing about her or, at least, the general direction they’re going with Phoenix changes, then it isn’t; it’s just going to make people more dependent on Phoenix as Win Button gimmick than an actual character.
Given how short a time the game’s been out, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if Phoenix, like Hsien-ko, was one of those characters that Capcom honestly had no idea about how to change for the better.
yea pretty much, i just repeatedly airdash at the lowest height and J.H for multiple triple overheads, eventually they crouch and i get them. occasionally i might mix it up by teleporting to the other side on landing. still crappy though.
It sucks that j.H is her best lead in but scales her combos horribly.
I love wasting three bars to kill someone with Hsien Ko from 80% health… Granted, the fact that she has an infinite hyper is a bit stupid, but it’s not as bad the reason of why you have her on point in the first place. Catching someone in a teleport dash requires them to have the brain of a fish, getting j.H to hit requires them to be playing someone lower tier than Hsien Ko herself, and that airdash just screams ‘Do something faster than me and you win’. It’s just not worth it… You have to have some big balls to play her on point, some big ol’ freaking balls.
I, for one, do not have said balls, nor will I ever try to. She’s going Golden the first chance I get and sitting right in third slot where she generally ends up. WTB Hsien Ko buffs so I don’t have to rely upon a gimmicky assist and I can finally land a Tenrai Ha Balls to Chris’ Sweep Combo more than 5% of the time.
Phoenix losing tools in normal form does further makes that “gimmick only” stamp on her forehead grow even larger unfortunately.
Taking away feathers is honestly all that needed to happen. At worst make it another level 3.
And don’t bother making the “but shes over-powerddzzz then too, she has a FRIEBALLZ” no she has tools that make her a character worth using.
Feathers being a level 3 after the wait for the initial 5 bars seems fair to me.
Honestly if shes able to build up those 8 bars against someone without getting killed twice at less than half the health of most of the cast, the player might deserve the win. Make it punishable and there is no way it’s a win switch for a last place phoenix.
Without the feathers she kinda has to use combos in both forms with dark just being a power increase. If the fireballs are that much of an issue to you still, don’t play UMVC3, because red armerer and dr. strange will end you from the looks of it.
Not really, her fireballs are hated because they are the win switch for scrubs, generally speaking. A good chunk of the cast doesn’t have an nswer for teleport>Shot Spam. They track and keep her relatively safe when in tandem with those teleports. It really gave players an easy way out. Now they actually have to bother learning to combo, control space, etc with her to get anywhere since the braindead side of her runaway game is gone. She’ll have to press forward more than just “OH A FIREBALLZ HIT THEM TIME FOR MASHING”. It’s really a step in the right direction.
Whatev.
UMvC3 added an easy out to this in additional to cutting her air actions though(Strider assist). Swapping out one person on your team to make a bad match up into LOL is not a bad thing.
(Seriously, the alerts system is mystifying me when I thought I had it figured out. Hmm…)
Oh, I agree that, with regards to the homing fireball stupidity, the limiting of her air actions makes her less stupid. The thing is that I don’t think it’s a step in the right direction because, as of yet, we’ve gotten no confirmation that they’ve made the homing fireballs themselves less stupid (as I brought up earlier with the fact that they don’t disappear when/if you manage to hit her, which is the real problem beyond the angle and durability). This while they’ve limited all her other options that she can do from super jump height; although, now that I think about it, I have to wonder how her flight mode is affected by this…
Anyway, they seem to be just chosen to do a really broad brushover of the actual issue which doesn’t actually address (much of) the problem. So they ended up taking away options that weren’t really broken rather than just limiting homing fireball to having one screen or even not being air ok or something like that. I mean, it’s not like she’s not going to have superjump a lot to avoid chip with her atrocious health anyway, so making her plummet like a stone just because one move in the air is really stupid doesn’t seem like the way to go. That combined with no word as of yet if they’re getting rid of Dark Phoenix’s true stupidities–feathers on spammable moves and M Trap bouncing, namely–is why I can’t say that I feel it’s a step in the right direction anymore. This even though I had the same opinion that it would force people to learn her better up to less than a week ago.
Sure, the people (try to) stick with her will learn her better, but the nerf itself could have been done better for the benefit of the character. It makes me think that Phoenix is one of the characters Capcom doesn’t really know what to do with beyond simple like “Dark Phoenix plus Level 3 X-Factor should equal a win”…even though that’s kinda the whole problem in the first place given how easy both things are to get to.
Yeah, I could definitely seeing the Feathers being a Level 3 “I should win this” timed super because, really, her normals are excellent in normal mode without those damn things and with them she’s just stupid. She gets like Zero’s uncontestable normals, only they’re on more crack because can chain into themselves, have more range and make her immune to all non-projectile counters even she’s doing the utterly predictable thing of L. humping the ground repeatedly.
…Oh, haha. I just realized that because of the projectile nature of the feathers, Doc Strange can pull a Wesker and use Seven Rings of Raggador to counter anything she does outside of throwing him (or TK Overdrive, maybe) and considering that looks it’s his stronger super, he can probably almost OHKO her even outside of X-Factor. Good one, Capcom.
THAT. IS GENIUS. Strange has da matchups.
I see your point regarding the nerf though. Taking Air Ok away from fireballs probably would have been perfect. She’d still be able to avoid chip, just not get free damage while doing it.
I still would have rather seen feathers be removed from jabs, since they were clearly the most abused attack that produced them.
I have been saying this from the very beginning there were only four steps needed to make a fair and balanced phoenix.
- She should only be able to have one tracking fireball on screen at any time. Let her keep her 3 air actions just one fireball. Why? Simple without a way to escape chip damage (teleport) jumping is now a death sentence. Example: Super Jump Air fireball Float down. Dormammu: Burn to Cinder…X factor Burn to cinder Chaotic Flame. Phoenix: Aaaaaaaaa Scott,Scott. You could already do that before the Health nerf she received.
2.Remove the Feathers from all of her DP attacks. That is really where the problem lies when fighting against her. People like to crouch jab jab jab jab jab jab jab teleport rinse wash and repeat. It is pretty cheap.
3.Completely remove the Damage bonus she gets as DP. Her enhanced specials are more than enough without the extra (I am God) Damage.
- The infinite ground traps thing in DP mode… That needs to go as well.
result would be a much more fair but still playable phoenix.