I won’t comment on the above because u view the game more like mvc2 where meter is meant for supers and not tvc where your meter is more dynamic.
The way I see it, the super whores lose to the meter managers because bbq combos hurt more. Supers are best used defensively imo.
Yatterman#1has some good things but alot of characters seem better to me. Also I hope u dont think im dissing yatterman. He’s like my 2nd team partner for Roll. My friend says batsu is easy to him. How is batsu gona approch with that kick seriously? Whats the advantage of it going full screen. If its blocked what are u gona do. That moves laggy as hell. All the low tiers up to Saki are pretty even to me. All above Saki seem to be a slight better than other characters.
teams used in top 8 at final round XIII from what i remember
jun/chun
yat 1/chun
jun/ryu
zero/alex
yat 1/ryu
doronjo/chun
gold lightan lol
blade/ryu???
Batsu/souki
Yat 1/???
GG’s btw Kurasa
Show us tournament videos of that tournament, then we might also believe in your tier lists. To whomever attended that tournament. I don’t think there are any characters in this game that can make other characters unviable, unless it’s Lightan vs Tekkamen.
Kurasa: No hate but your opinion is based off what now? You play Doronjo and Chun-li right? I mean yeah you might dabble with others but those are your players right??? Well lets look at their supers and then I am pretty sure we can figure out why you would say something as crazy as: “u view the game more like mvc2 where meter is meant for supers and not tvc where your meter is more dynamic.” and “the super whores lose to the meter managers because bbq combos hurt more. Supers are best used defensively imo.”
Chun-li: She has one effective super and even that super is only good when your opponet has close to 2 bars and you still want your combos to hurt.
Doronjo: she has no good/usefull supers at all. And she even has a counter super.
Hummmmmmmmm… No wonder you would say supers are best used defensive. All of your supers suck. Now if you change your players and play… Tekkaman Blade and Tekkaman, would you change your mind about usefullness of supers???
I can assume that you do not play MvC2? If you do not see that a 30 bill dhc will make Yatter1/2, Zero,Volutt, Roll, Karas more of low life scrubs then you are missing the " more dynamic" uses of meter in this game. You really are off base with your statement about me tho. I only play DHC teams for the low lifes. Anyone over 40 bill will not see my Ippatsuman/Tekkaman team because I can do better with a more well rounded team.
32 bil off one bar with no baroque on either character.
37-38 bill off one bar and only Alex having chip baroque.
54 bil off one bar with alex having 17-20% baroque.
One bar man. This is meter magement at high level. Finding a way to kill the oppomet with the bar you start with. Or better yet I am sure I could pull all the above damage from no bars with no baroque.
To call a team with a powerfull DHC “super whores” is stupid. How many times does Storm DHC to Sent in one match? I really have never seen americas fav DHC more than once in a match. and I have watched alot of marvel matches. Strong DHC teams do not rely on it but they have it and other teams do not. Think about it. When playing a zero if you never have that there for you then the zero has no fear until he gest far down into guts, like 20% health. With a strong/overpowered DHC, Zero is now scared at like 75% health. Just think about it.
Until you guys go toe to toe against Jwong or Marn and win major tourneys you guys just don’t know. Kurasa has a very strong point, seeing TvC at high level makes it look like everyone else is playing the game wrong. BBQ is the most powerful tool in the game no doubt, that you have use more consciously than anything else. Having meter to spend in tight situations is also very important. Sure you can use it to kill people like you would anyother game, but i saw some crazy stuff with it I’d never even thought of before. Saying chun in this game has bad supers is like saying sagat has a bad super, doesn’t matter when you’re the best character in the game. Using one meter several times for superficial amounts of damage is not nearly as useful as having a bunch of meter on reserve towards the end of the match.
TvC is not MvC2, Kurasa is 100% right in that meter is much more dynamic.
Saying chun has bad supers is like saying chun-li has bad supers. If you make a assumption of how the whole game uses meter based off your team then that is stupid. They added one extra thing to meter and now it is like some big thing that all Vs players do not understand?
Dude think about what I typed and then respond. I am saying that Kurasa needs to think outside of what is going on in front of him and think about the system the game plays in. No where in my post does it say that meter is not more dynamic but instead that he is missing the “more dynamic” uses of meter.
Again no where in my post does it say to use one meter several time for superficial amounts of damage. I clearly say use 2 meter to get 30+bil un crashable damage. Did you miss that? when you stock up bars that means you do not know when/how to use them. What are you waiting on, them to get in? Why not kill them instead of being ready for when they break you down. Hell if they do it once what is to say they will not do it right after that.
Thanks FunkyP.
@Saetan
First off, I play everyone in the game with the exception of Cashern, Ken, Lightan, and Morrigan at an above average level. You can ask the guys that I played in casuals for proof. I’m a firm believer that in order to combat other chars you first have to be able to play them. The characters that I don’t know are the characters that other players in STL play well or guys that I see at tourneys all the time (cough cough Keits cough cough) play well.
Second, you really don’t understand my main team at all if you think that their supers suck. Doronjo’s boiler drop is amazing as is Chun’s KikouShou. The boiler drop does 10k per clean hit, can easily be combo into, and sets up a very sweet air reset that carries your opponent to the corner allowing you to do corner combos which hurt. Her counter super can be used on wake up to counter any meaty jump-in and can be used during block strings to catch your opponent. Bolier Drop DHC into KikoSho also combos and keeps Chun completely safe from any punish.
As for Chun’s options, KikoSho takes up roughly 3/4 of the screen and is great for catching people that like to jump around, and I don’t think anything has to be said about Senretsu since it is one of the best supers in the game. It deals decent damage and allows follow up combos, you can’t really get much better than that.
As for damaging DHCs, yes they are good when they are straight up going to kill a character, but the game is a lot more dynamic than that. You aren’t going to face Zero/Yatter-2 every round of the event. Your team is going to have to rely on more than just a strong DHC to win since your opponent will have a ton of potential if your DHC does not kill them.
Thirdly, you a completely missing the point. In MvC2 the only things that you could use your meters for was supers, snapbacks, and variable counters. In TvC you have variable counters, VAR, supers, and Mega Crash. That last item on the list changes things a ton. I feel that being able to mega crash far offsets the need to deal a bunch of damage with a DHC since doing so gives your opponent the opportunity to deal even more damage with a combo. This obviously changes some if the DHC is going to kill a character but you have to respect your opponent’s ability to damage you at all times.
I don’t even consider using a super unless I have 2 stocks in reserves because I don’t want to get fucked up. Dealing non-fatal damage just isn’t worth the 2 meter investment. Now, if you have 4 or more meters, I can see using them, but having fewer is not wise.
Justin and I were talking about this on Saturday and he completely agrees. You’ll notice that he NEVER uses a super with Jun unless its a fatal lvl 3. He also won’t combo into Senretsu with Chun unless he has or is close to having 2 meters in reserve. You can see this in his match vs Skisonic’s Lightan. He had 3 meters built up and could have easily lvl 3’d him but he chose not to because he felt that it was too risky. The damage just wasn’t worth the risk…and Jun’s lvl 3 deals 27k+! Marn also follows this mantra. I dunno man, there just might be something to this meter management thing don’t you think?
Lastly, I know that TBlade and Alex are strong. But guess what…they are strong even without their supers! If you tag Crash Interlude onto the end of a 20 hit combo, you are adding 4 - 5 k damage. I don’t see that as a worthwhile investment at all and here’s why. Adding in Crash Int just ended your combo, cost you a meter and added a rather insignificant amount of damage. Your opponent in turn gained 8-10% red life. That small percentage of bbq translates to 10 - 30K worth of damage depending on their character and the amount of red life they had before. I’ll use Doronjo and TBlade as examples.
Doronjo with 10% red life can do a 47 hit corner combo that deals 27 - 30k damage and builds 2.5 meters for her. That same combo deals 51 - 54k damage when you increase her red life to 20%.
Tekkaman Blade can easily get 25K with no super no bbq. With 10% red life, the same combo gains a relaunch and deals in the neighborhood of 35K. With 20% red life it deals just under 42K.
Tacking on that extra 5k sends your opponents potential through the roof. This is why i don’t advocate using DHC outside of death combos. This is why I don’t support normal supers outside of fringe cases.
Kurasa listen, I read your whole post every time you type, if I decide to respond to it I make damn sure I re-read it and then respond.
If you think the supers are great then I want to see you use all four of them. We can leave out the lvl’3 but the all other I would like to see you use them.
I clearly said that I only use Death DHC Teams (Ippatsuman/Tekkaman, Casshern/polimar) against low life peeps. Because, get this, it works. To have 30 bill in the same two bars that will save you makes these low life/low damage output players not a prob as much.
No I am not missing the point. I clearly understand how great megacrash is, I play casshern!! More than that I understand how inportant VAR is and again I think you do not, as well as not understand the importance of 30 bill off 2 bars uncrashable is against a really good zero. It gives you a really good upperhand. But meh it does not matter.
Again, I am not selling my opponet short. How can they damage me if they are dead? How? just play a DHC team and see how much life it kills Zero from. It should be right around 70%. May be like 65%, it really does make a hughe diff. Just try it.
Never once did I say that Alex or Tblade should ever use meter. Why would you even talk about Crash? That super is crap and we both know it. Or maybe only I do. You go on this long tangent about crash but never once do you talk about his other super and the fact that it causes freefall and can DHC to make it rain at the end of a 30 bil combo. I know I told you this but you are acting like I did not tell this to you over the phone. Meh.
I guess I really do not care since you seem so stuck in your ways. If you calim to see the game so well but do not see the big leap a Death DHC will give you over these low life bums then go on with your game. I only told you because I wanted you to know.
I agree with Kurasa. Generally I feel supers just aren’t worth it when you can do pretty close to the same damage and save meter for NOT DYING. Generally other than the first 10-20 seconds in a match, any decent hit is going to result in a character dying or getting really damn close to death. I would rather save that meter and watch for a baroque so I can crash than blow it doing like 4k extra and then watching as they drain my life bar with a Baroque combo while I’m sitting on one bar.
Saetan - I hear you dodged Final Round. If you had any traction to speak, its lost now.
Kurasa and Wong are right about meter management in this game. What Kurasa just typed is bible-like.
Does anyone even care about Karas anymore?
Was Karas’ infinites the only reason anybody used him in CGoH?
I mean, yes he has the worst health of all the characters, but doesn’t he still have insane speed, range and a lot of combo power? Doesn’t he also build up meter fairly fast?
Summing it down for people catching up; unless you really have faith in your ability to not get caught in huge combos, save those two bars.
Also I disagree with the Tekkaman Blade sentiment. Once the flow is in his direction, it’s almost impossible to stop him. I’ll be posting my detailed thoughts later.
His damage output is also crap, pretty much every other character has an easier time dealing damage than him as far as I’ve seen.
Huh. Last time I used Karas he didnt seem that bad at giving damage seriously tho.
Huh? who did i doge??? This Jeff kid calls me at 11:30 pm on saturday and said are you still comming and I say yes my home girl is on her way now and we should be leaving in the next 30 mins I will call you when we leave. He calls me back in no shit 11 mins and says, “Justin and Marn and I are going to get food and we do not think we will be up when you get here, I am pretty sure they are going to bed after we eat. Bla Bla BLa”
I told him before he ever got down here that I will do it on fri or sat. Sat comes around and he tells me not to come? All he had to do was stay awake and win money right? I told him I could kinda understand Jwong and Marn not wanting to stay up until I got there because they were actually going to play the next day. Kurausa had no excuse other than being “Bushed” If he did not travel all this way just to play TvC then I would say it was not a doge, but did he enter anything else and think he was going to win it? I think not. He could have stayed awake and made me actually doge him. But instead he tells me “I am not trying to doge you man but…” If he did not go to sleep before 3 on sat then he doged me right?
I had no prob with it but now you spew this like I did not call him 5 times over Fr weekend to get this going, like I did not have someone else to drive me so there was no excuse, like I did not make sure he knew before he ever got down here that I would not leave my house until (11:00pm or 12 am) my kids were down and my wife was cool. He knew all this and said “Saturday it is then.” No doge, I just was not going to pay 35 bucks to get in to fr just to play Jwong and Marn and Him, if they could set it up at someones room.
Keits I love you man. LOL And don’t you do Crash after all your blade combos??? LOL Read the bible son!
It’s not that he can’t give damage, it’s just that it’s harder in execution than pretty much everyone else (a long Karas combo won’t do as much damage as a long combo from another character). I could just be wrong though, I’m no expert afterall.
I think trag proved karas can do some serious damage with his meterless bnb. If it’s hard or not, I must say I have no idea since I don’t play him.
Even trag himself said that that combo was hard enough to not be viable as an indicator of how good his normal bnb damage is. So basically yes, every other character has an easier time dealing damage than him.