Nash ging on mission despite having family just feel like Nash being Nash
" Until every sin and atrocity is punished by justice, my duty will not be complete! "
—Charlie ( Street Fighter Alpha 3 )
Tragic hero figure that put “superior good” above his own life, he already did it in the past multiple times
He did’nt left his family, he tried to give his family (and everyone else) a world without Bison
Consider also he may have to keep secret his family exactly because Shadaloo and Shadaloo’s spies/traitors inside US army
If he wanted give his woman and sons a normal life, Shadaloo must be destroyed
What i really find interessing is that Nash was already my candidate for Remy’s dad back in SF3 days…
…and years after SF4 told us (throught Abel’s story) that Nash has been in France at some point before his death in SFA. I don’t believe it’s a coincidence
Guile reaction to Abel in SF4 make think master Sonic Boom is’nt something other fighters can do, how he reacted make seem Guile believe only him and Nash use that technique
The plan was unlock Sim paying whatever price in FM (i think i spent 20 ticket and 20k FM) and buy with actual money the stage
End up i tapped the button for error and i bought the stage with FM too LOL, now i’m at 95k FM
Btw i’m not worried, i think in august we will get minimum 2 new characters, and i will buy them with money, not FM
Each character is worth fuckton of FM: story, demostration, survival easy-medium-hard, trials, easy fast level ups untill for first 20 levels
Did’nt know exact number, let’s say its a good 40K FM for character
If they’re 2 it’s already easy 80K FM
If they’re 3 or more do the math
Plus i will not buy next crossover (Ibuki) wich save me 10K, mean from now till august i will just add more, from either playing online or weekly trials
Tbh if Nash “soul” survived somehow inside Twelve experiment, they can ever recover him to his original shape as Twelve an take the form of any fighter…
He does’nt even have to be full white SF3 style, as SFV retconnected that tech as able to replicate colors too
this was Eleven, so i’m assuming in current timeline Twelve being more advanced will have same ability
I wouldn’t say it is his “soul” that survived. Rather his memories, personality, and character were passed on to Twelve. Twelve is not Nash in the same way Ripley8 is not Ellen Ripley in the Alien universe. They share memories but are different people.
Twelve would of course feel and believe that he is still Nash (and could inherit his fighting prowess). It’s a very transhumanist idea, uploading one’s consciousness into an artificial vessel. It’s the technological albeit accidental equivalent of what Bison does willfully through ki manipulation. I like this idea because it draws greater parallels between the grand villain and one of his key rivals.
Yeah, that why i put the " " on soul, i was thinking exactly something like Ripley
Staying on hollywood movie inspiration in SFV Nash got a bit of Robocop too, if you think about it
A detail imho passed a bit underrated is that when in SFV he chosen to use Illuminati power to save Abel (again), he may have compromised the kill-Bison mission
Considering his power in SFV it’s not pure ki (as Nash is without vital energy) i think Nash power in SFV it’s more like a charged battery (the forehead gem), so he can’t regenerate it…he was on kamikaze mission after all, was one-way travel
I think he used a good chunk of that power on Abel here
Watch how looks weakened right after
I like to think Illuminati plan failed not because they calculated wrong the amount of energy needed for the kamikaze bomb (and the timing of stopping the Moons going wrong)
I like to think it failed because they understimated Nash’s humanity, thinking he can’t use the illuminati powers for anything else outside the mission they gave him (kinda like in Robocop)
Remy’s dad being Nash could work if Street Fighter 3 took place a lot later. I can see Nash being the type of guy who goes for Bison for the greater good, dies in the process and his son misunderstands later that as Nash leaving him to get fights. Especially if his mother was only expecting at the time and probably wasn’t even married to the guy so Guile or whatever never got to tell him the full story.
It would actually make the revenge driven SFV Nash even more tragic, since he abandons all possibility for love and care in order to kill Bison and in the process push his son even more away.
It even makes sense for the SF2 revenge driven Guile to forget about Nash’s girl since he forgets his own damn familiy during that time so some French chick he only tangentially knows wouldn’t cross his mind.
But Remy is way too old to fill that role. Not to mention his little sister, who makes even less sense to exist in this story’s context. Unless we’re up for some massive retcons, those guys will never be linked.
That could be a possibility, but who then would train him if he kept things about that part of his life a secret? Would him being old enough to learn how to fight line up with the time that Charlie would have to disappear?
If he’s 17 in 1999, he’d be born in 1982, SFA 2-3 is supposed to be around the early 80s. If he was old enough to remember his father, that would mean that Charlie couldn’t have started his mission and leave as early as he did. This can be sidestepped if he didn’t remember his father because he was so young and only knew of him through the people who talked about him, but if that’s the case, then who trained him and at what age?
That’s my point, I believe that in canon he trained others, but only Guile showed any real talent (I could be wrong on this though). My idea was that one soldier was subpar (maybe could only throw a Dan sized sonic boom or pretty much hop for a flash kick), took things to a level of obsession and just couldn’t ever get good, so when Bison’s forces infiltrated the Armed Forces, he jumped at the chance to carry favour if he could become stronger, get revenge on Charlie for a perceived slight or something that makes him flee once they learn Charlie is killed.
My loose idea was basically a guy who couldn’t hack it, became more of a deadbeat, had ties to Shadaloo, learned an alternate way to gather ki that looked similar to Charlie’s (his being light based, Charlie being sonic) and eventually walked out on his family.
That’s a very interesting point! Yeah, they expected him to be cold and just 100% on his mission, but his heart softened and him helping Abel was definitely not part of the plan.
I agree with this except for the kamikaze. I’ve mentioned this before, but I think that Charlie improvised the explosion. I don’t think that was ever how they wanted him to kill Bison. It’s a very risky 1 shot miss for a guy known to be able to fly at high speeds and teleport.
I think they, knowing of his past fighting skills and some of the prophecy apparently held him as a winner, planned on him fighting him to a standstill. If we don’t have the scene with Abel you mentioned, he has more power to use, with more power the fight where he knocks down Bison before the cutscene would play out differently, in the end, I do agree with you that they underestimated his humanity and over estimated his thirst for revenge-over-reason.
@Dracu
Tbh i think time span is kinda generic in SF, mostly about whats before and whats after
Btw Remy having a lil sister does’nt work against that idea
Well, it will if she’s potrayed as a little girl obviously born after SFA days, but she already looks in her teens
To make it work Remy needed to be old enough to learn sonic boom (or at least to get teachings and later learn/understand by himself), so even considering him a fighting genius kid like his father and that he started very young like Mel trying to copy dad
We seen people like Dan, Sean or Sakura learn “the school fireball” with very little time of training, so i can buy the son of a genius to somehow understand the mechanic behind sonic boom with very few years of training
Guile himself learned it at late age too (without a lifelong training on ki), so Nash was just that good teacher
Like Remy being around 10yo or slighty older when Nash left, and from there he developed his style by himself there in france (Savate being the local martial art)
Another thing i see many call it
“Nash gone to france and banged some french girl”
Is possible something else
Nash already got a woman/family in US, but brought them to France as soon he did’nt trusted USA anymore (due Shadaloo agents inside US Army)
Guile maybe know it maybe not, likely yes but NEVER talk about it for obvious reasons
Wich link to a thing we know
Nash wanted to hide Abel from Shadaloo, and he chosen France (or at least a french place) for that
V
Wich mean he consider it a safe place from Shadaloo agents… maybe because he’s already using it for very same reason and know it’s safe?
Perhaps. I obviously prefer to think that the Illuminati underestimated Bison and overestimated the efficacy of their mystical techniques and advanced technology against the GREAT EVIL of this universe.
Theyr plan was’nt much about Nash defeating Bison 1v1 but more an offensive on layers
The plan itself was good
1-Stop Moons/Bison regeneration
2-Nash being good enough to weaken Bison a bit
3-Kamikaze bomb to finish Bison
On reality
1- they did but few seconds too late (Bison recover from the round he lose to Nash)
2- he did (defeated Bison one round)
3- possibly did’nt worked 100% because Nash wasted power to save Abel
So watching story i think Bison both recovered due #1 and the bomb was less deadly due #3
I say it was a kamikaze mission as both Kolin and Nash himself known his time on earth was very limited either win or lose, and chances of him both killing Bison and even come back “alive” were very low
I think the bomb was part of the tactic, like if/when you reach the point of realize you can’t defeat him, go kamikaze explosion
After all he got nothing to lose, he was already dead with little time left in any case, make sense
Bison recovered from theyr first round as Moons were stopped too late, Nash realize his chances of win the fight were 0%
So
Bison was unscathed by Nash. He didn’t demonstrate any actual hesitation before fighting Ryu. If Bison was considerably affected we would’ve noted it in a change in his demeanor or appearance but we did not. Therefore we shouldn’t assume that there was by default.
Nash probably did have an effect on Bison, but it was negligible in isolation. It was the power of nothingness that destroyed Bison’s body.
I think Nash’s real contribution is buying the heroes time so that Rashid could stop Final Bison from emerging. Which lead to Ryu destroying the vessel that Bison was operating in.
If Nash did not keep Bison busy, the other pieces would not fall into place at the moment they needed to be.
It doesn’t make Nash’s effort any less brave or effective, but I just don’t think Psycho Power could be driven out without the power of nothingness.
The Psycho Power within Abel is merely a fraction of what is within Bison. It’s like suggesting that blowing air from your lungs could extinguish a forest fire because it worked on a candle.
Two years left and maybe an extra year doing international law+human rights but I’m thinking of whether to do the extra year or not.
Prior to SFV, I thought that Vega was Q. Hear me out on this, but I thought that Vega’s hunt for preserving his beauty using the SIN chip he stole would fail miserably making him an twisted man with a metal mask. Vega then makes the realisation that corruption is inevitable and now goes around fighting. Though I can’t explain how there are Qs at multiple places.
I really love the idea of Charlie being immortalized through other character such as 12. Eventually 12 passes on Charlie’s consciousness onto the other Illuminati experiments and after the Illuminati is deafeatwd they become mysterious anti-heroes living out Charlie’s dream of Justice.
As for everyone still going on about Charile = Remy’s dad. It wouldn’t really make sense if Remy’s mother never told Remy and his sister about Charlie being an US soldier or never being told about his death, surely he would’ve known. The only way that could’ve happened is if Remy’s mum never knew about Charlie and they just had sex, which brings another problem being that that kind of thing is OOC for Charlie. Also it’s mentioned that Charlie’s family know of Guile in SF4’s prologue
As for Abel being his dad, Abel looks like he’s in his early twenties, he’s more like Ed’s older brother.
I think the kamikaze attack was supposed to finish an already weakened Bison, not take out him in normal state (like he was recovering with Moons)
As i was saying to Shockdingo i think the bomb attack ever been part of the plan
Theyr speech was
B “you’ll never win against my Psycho Power”
N “Perhaps… but i will achieve my victory”
There Nash admit he’s unlikely to win, but he’s saying he don’t need to win… in theyr plan he just need to inflict maximum damage by fighting (won first “round”, then should have continued in 2nd), then explode “achieving his victory”
But when he see the Moons stopped too late he instant notice it, that’s where the plan really failed
About the explosion we can’t know how much of it he lost to save Abel, but one sure thing is that was a waste of the gem power that Illuminati did’nt considered in theyr plan
We seen to some extent it took a part of Nash energies (he fall on his knee) but hard to measure how much… i will not overstimate or understimate it, i’m just pointing it was for sure a detraction from the power Illuminati gave him
In fact, there was a small change in his appearance after Nash’s self-sacrifice. When he’s about to face Ryu, you can notice his Psycho Power aura is a lot smaller than it was when he was continuously getting amped by the Black Moons. So I do believe Nash managed to absorb some of his power. As for his demeanor, Bison is a character who shows no weakness, only power. This guy laughed when he was fading away after getting hit by Ryu’s Hadoken.
