Mad comp in Malaysia (specifically: Kuala Lumpur). Went there for 2 weeks and the mega-mall arcades basically have every noteworthy arcade game from early 90s till now. It was incredible.
So does anyone know much about how Zangief works in this game? In ST, when someone does a close jump in on me, I instinctively buffer in a 360 motion that ends at down-back just in case they’re going for a tick; if they go for a tick, I get a 360, and if they continue a combo/poke string, I get a crouch block. But this doesn’t seem to work in HF, I buffer in the motion like always, but if someone goes for a low attack, I get hit. What’s the deal, does this game work differently than ST or something?
If someone does a close jump in, I usually do PPP anti air instead of going for the 360. PPP knocks down even on trade. From there, it’s a usually a free body splash cross up into SPD if they block it. If they don’t block the body splash cross up, then crouch jab x 3, crouch HK = dizzy. If that happens, cross up body splash, crouch MK, PPP for the knock down. Which sets you up for yet Another body splash cross up …
I shouldn’t have put the word “close” in there. Lots of characters have jump-in attacks that beat the lariat from various distances, so assume you just blocked someone’s jump-in and that the jump-in is followed up by some low attack. In ST, you can buffer in a 360 motion ending at down-back after blocking the jump-in (or any potential tick), and if the opponent keeps his low poke string going you just low block his attacks, but if the opponent ends his poke string, you spd him. In ST, you run the risk of getting dragon punched against some characters because of the spd whiff animation, but whatever, I’m not talking about that. I’m just wondering why in HF, when I do the exact same thing I’m used to doing in ST, and even though I’m actually negative edging the 360 so as to get no whiffed punches, I get hit by the opponent’s low attack instead of blocking it.
As I type this I just realized that maybe the problem is that I’m playing HF on XBLA, where because of the input delay the game doesn’t yet register me as being in down-back when the opponent goes for his low attack. You know what, that’s probably the culprit right there.
No tests should ever be done on xbla. That shit is trash.
And yes, you answered your own question. It’s because of the lag. Empty jump into crouch shorts is a common strategy on live because it takes advantage of the lag.
If you tried your strategy offline, yes it would work, and it would work better than ST - due to the lack of whiff animation.
re: Bison vs. Gief
A bit late, but let me clarify: This is Dicatator vs Gief, not Boxer vs. Gief. There is literally zero way for Dictator to stop Gief from advancing on him and killing him with splash -> stuff -> SPD ticks.
Also, who cares about online? I only play HF in arcades here (where it still is played every single day).
It’s exactly because of lag, what your doing works fine offline. I’ve seen people win with just jump in roundhouse followed by crouching roundouse and it couldn’t be blocked simply because of lag. HF online isn’t exactly GGPO, LOL.
Haven’t played 360 in over 2months n just got back into it glad to see my 20 rank go down to 13000:rofl: anyways yall hit me up sometime, even though plenty of ppl play this game it’s hard to find comp outside of the same few i always play with and it’s tiring to always get matched up to lag abusers who spam hondas headbut or dic’s torpedo all day.
Is i just me or does chuns jumping short have a ridiculously good hitbox? Ever since this game came out on XBLA i have lost to chuns who spam j. short on my sagat simply because it beats out TU most of the time even when i time it perfectly and hit her “deep” yet i can easily AA chun’s j.short with ken and ryu:rofl:
I also have problems with her lightning legs it does hella chip and leaves my sagat in blockstun more then long enough for the chun player to tick and i feel the input delay is the cause for me not being able to punish a walkup throw even when i see it coming from a mile away but maybe it’s just me.
I dunno if it’s just my version of the game or some weird bug but sometimes my crouching normals with claw go straight through the opponent is that how the game is supposed to be? And any help with the shoto matchup would be appreciated it seems claws izuna drop can’t grab shotos in the middle of their DP animation and it just seems like everything i try gets stuffed clean 99% of the time.
Yeah, all of chun’s kicks have really good priority. I don’t play Sagat much, so take this with a grain of salt, but I think that one of the reasons he has a harder time TU-ing her kicks is because he has less invulnerability than Ryu/Ken’s DPs. If she jumps in shallow, so only the edge of her foot is going to hit you, then I think you’re better off just blocking than trying to TU. If you’re closer to being directly beneath her, then you should be able to hit her clean.
Yeah, that’s the lag. Sometimes the lag also makes it hard to block her legs or Honda’s hands low right away :sad:
Yup. That’s the way it is. The same thing happens with Dhalsims far attacks when you’re up close in ST. Basically, the move extends so far that the hit box doesn’t even start until it’s on the other side of the opponent’s hit box. In my experience, when this happens, both players tend to freeze up for a moment in shock. If you train yourself to go for a throw immediately when you see this, you can get some free damage :wgrin:
First of all, you can’t spam them like you would against many characters. Against shotos, you need to play more of a reactive and baiting game. On the ground, try to bait a fireball and jump over to punish or bait a DP and slide, poke, or do a walk up throw to counter. You want to play like a slippery rat against shotos. You should spend most of your time just outside of poke range, where you can counter their moves because of your speed. If they try to come in on you, just run away. Since Vega doesn’t really have any good reversal or close AA moves, you’ll often get murdered if they get on top of you. If you use enough hit and run tactics on them, it’ll annoy them and hopefully cause them to make mistakes.
Also, realize that Vegas wall-dive isn’t godly in HF, like it is in ST. It’s still useful and it’s fast, but especially against shotos, if you try to spam it you’ll get hit by a lot of DPs and hurricane kicks. With that being said, it tends to work great to bait out DPs. Do a wall dive against your own wall and hold back so that you don’t land on your opponent. Watch them do a DP and sail into the air and counter that with a slide. In general, this seems to be more effective than actually trying to hit/grab them with the wall dive. And if they just sit and block, you’re still safe. But use this sparingly against good players. If they see it coming they can meet you as you land with a fireball or hurricane kick.
I hope that helps! :wgrin:
Chun’s jumping short does indeed have a ridiculously good hitbox. At the same time, although Sagat’s tiger uppercut has a strong hitbox down low, it isn’t actually invincible and has a really weak hitbox on its top and top back. Most characters have ways to beat Sagat’s uppercut, like Chun can do jumping short, Gief can do close jumping roundhouse/forward/splash, Honda can do jumping roundhouse, Blanka can do jumping short, etc.
You shouldn’t be getting thrown after blocking lightning legs, it doesn’t do enough block stun, Chun doesn’t recover fast enough, and she has to walk up too far for that to be working. If this works on you on XBLA, I’m sure you can chalk it up to lag.
Claw’s claw normals always go through the opponent if you’re too close, so either do them from a little farther away or do a crouching short or forward, which never go through the opponent.
Thx for the help it’s good to know chuns j.short really is that good and that it’s not my own inability to punish her jump in lol that’s been annoying me.
Ok so with claw bait dp’s with “safe” walldive and punish with slide and use “hit n run” tactics sounds good but if they come towards me theres only so much space in a stage when i’m cornered what do i do? In ST his cr. mp is godlike because it’s fast and has great range and most of his other normals are really good too but in HF outside of j. rh/fierce none of his normals are that good so what is “safe” to spam? In general should i be playing offensively or defensively?
^don’t forget that you’re playing on xbox live, therefore jumpins will work at times where they won’t work offline.
Claw never really plays defensively in HF, he’s more of a zoning character. Don’t play runaway, because if you get cornered you’ll die against most characters, but make sure to keep your opponent at a certain range. This range varies against different characters; for example, against Gief you wanna stand at max slide distance where you can slide and antiair his jump-ins with standing jab or strong, whereas against Honda you either want to be at a distance where you can jump and punish whatever he does or be just outside his headbutt’s invincibility range, and against Guile you want to be where you can annoy him with crouching strong and crouching roundhouse.
You can’t really spam anything with Claw, he’s just not that kind of character. You have to place your pokes carefully because the damage they do is nothing compared to how much it hurts to eat a random dragon punch or flash kick. Crouching strong, standing jab, crouching roundhouse, and standing fierce are your best pokes.
Casuals at my house on 2-16-08:
Honda HF players: How do you handle Vegas that really know the match well? I’m usually pretty good against them, but there are a few peeps out there that really know how to kill my charge (since Honda isn’t very useful in this matchup without his headbutt and SS). I keep trying to unleash a jab HB in the middle of lockdowns, but it never seems to go out and I get a foot in the head. And nothing beats getting grabbed out of mid-air when you are in the middle of a special move >:|
Do the Sumo splash as late as possible. It works better as AA against Vega because of the wierd angle on his jumps and how quick and low to the ground they are. If you time it right you can get two hits on a roundhouse SS AA, which will almost always dizzy Vega (try a deep Roundhouse SS when Vega slides as well, it will usually two hit for a dizzy also).
Look put for him to use the Wall Dive off the wall behind you, causing you to lose the charge for your headbutt. If you catch it early jump back and roundhouse or strong punch. If you get caught on the ground try a SS (you should be able to keep your down charge) after he bounces off the wall. A standing Fierce works well if you have good timing. Also if you switch the directions that you are charging at the exact same time that Honda turns around you’ll keep your charge at be able to suprise him with a headbutt!
Do everything to get him into the corner and you can chalk it up as a victory.
I try the fierce SS a lot of the time, but it seems really good Vegas can literally grab me out of it! The only thing that seems to be a saving grace is to use the jab HB (which can’t be grabbed). I’ll try a jab SS next time to see how that fares.
Agreed! Back in the early 90’s, when I used to play against some very solid Claw Players, the best Claw Players, zoned the snot out of you. Since I played Ryu, Claw always gave me trouble (the good Claw Players).
Simply because of that stupidly fast yet, short jump, making me space with my projectiles difficult. His excellent poking range which well…out zones me in practically all of my best pokes, and his sheer speed.
If you play Claw right, Guile gets pummeled badly by him. Claw’s C.fk>>>>Guile’s SB, even on trade off, simply because Guile gets knocked down, while Claw can gain positioning.
Spamming Barcelona’s and Izuna Drops are a No No, with Claw, learning how to space is where his biggest potential is at.
Your doing the SS too early. Using the short SS may work for you because it will force you to wait to use it because it doesn’t travel as high. Actually for Anti-Air I usually use the Forward SS, I usually only use the roundouse against certain characters or to try and cross-up opponents. It seems that the Foward SS has more priority on the upward slope than the Roundhouse (I know it def. does in ST, not sure about HF, it may just be the angle makes it better for AA).
Well the Claw should be jumping straight up with back/toward+fierce/strong option select, so that if you aren’t close to him in the air it’ll just be a jump kick and if you are close it’ll be a throw. And which butt slam you decide to antiair him with and whether you should antiair him at all should be a decision based on how close the Claw is to you, because if you pick the wrong butt slam you’ll get kicked or thrown. As Honda, I generally don’t bother antiairing him if he’s not jumping at me, because if he’s a little in front of me, he has the advantage if I try to attack him. Even if
Note that I’m talking about offline play, where Claw can usually see a butt slam/headbutt/etc coming well enough to press kick at the necessary time and where you can reasonably react to a random Claw jump-in. Online, yeah, try to antiair with a butt slam that’ll hit the Claw on the way up.