You’ve forgot one scaling in your number, Darklight. Ultra lose 20% damage when used in combo. If you add the normal combo scaling to that, 300 damage of base ultra become really weak almost useless. The whole Cr.lk,cr.lk,ex legs ultra combo will do like 348 damage.
Who cares if its not that strong, it has many ways to combo into it, its a reliable consistent way to deal moderate damage - i rather that over an ultra that does a truckload of damage with nearly zero ways to land it (e.g fei long, akuma’s ultra etc). Ryu’s ultra wasn’t the strongest, in fact it was one of the weakest ultras in the game but the consistency it provided made it one of the best ultras in the game.
:sad:
You’re no fun.
-E
- 400 against the characters who eat 4 hits off of EX legs.
30 + 30 + (150*0.8) + (300 *0.6).
Unless they changed the way damage scaling works. Which we think they did. Or unless the 300 damage doesn’t mean what we’ve assumed it means. So yeah, complete theory fighter.
That’s what I said. I counted the 20% scaling after the Cl. HK xx EX Legs (which does 300 on some characters and 250 on others) so 80% of 300 base damage U2 afterward would make that total combo 540 or 490. I said that cr. lk setups probably wouldn’t even reach 400.
Nah You didnt get it. I said you forgot one scaling because there are TWO scaling: The ultra in combo scaling (-20%) and the normal combo scaling (-20% on the 3rd move of a combo, -30% on the fourth etc…) So for cl.Hk,ex legs,ultra> ultra will be scaled because it is used in a combo and scaled again because it’s the 3rd move of the combo (-40% total). So it 430 or 480 depending on the character.
Robotic > well I did -20% then -30%. Anyway if I use your method then it is 330 lol, dont forget that ultra is the 4th move (-30%).
^^^ tl;dr… numbers… parenthesis etc.
what hes saying darklight,
is that the ultra scales no matter what as 2 moves.
so hk and ex legs are 2 moves and dont get scaled. then the ultra pops in and gets scaled 40%… basically only hitting for 60% of its max damage.
-dime
^I see. My bad Kult.
But as a ‘2 move hit’ after 2 moves, the ultra scales but it doesn’t scale immediately to an additional 20%.
For instance her current ultra after a Cl. HK xx EX legs does 70% almost throughout the entire thing (but the launcher kick in between does 73%… weird).
For an ultra example that’s similar to Chun’s U2: Ryu’s ultra in a combo after 2 moves the fireball starts off doing about 71% for each hit of the fireball and then 66% on the last hit.
So for Chun’s U2 you’d probably have to do 3 moves before ultra to make it do only 60% of it’s base. Otherwise it’ll probably do roughly 70% of it’s base. The damage is not quite as good as I thought it would be after cl. hk xx EX Legs, but not too bad unless we do way too many moves beforehand.
Still, we’re going off of a number that I have no idea if it is the actual base U2 damage. =\
shows chun’s chip damage from a blocked kikoshou
[media=youtube]7STEj4mFQXg[/media]
hmmm… that vid is also good cause it shows how slow chuns kikosho is:
juri has an extended lk when chun activates kikosho, yet is still able to recover and block in time.
in other news i think that vid has given me a new sig!
-dime
Is it me or is EX.SBK much higher off the ground in that video than it currently is in SF IV?
I still say a comboable ultra SHOULD be low damage. You don’t really “earn” your ultra meter like you do the Super meter. It shouldn’t be a free hit just because you got worked and took some damage. If it’s going to be a give-away so long as you can hit confirm, then it definitely should be weak.
Hosenka - Hard to land, high damage
Kikosho - Easier to land, lower damage
That’s the way it should be. Risk/reward.
Maybe that the way it should be but it is certainly not the way it is. Rufus, sagat, balrog, abel etc all have an easy to land ultra that deals at least 450 damage of base full ultra. Chun must have something around that.
Bingo.
The precedent was set by Sagat and Rufus (and to a certain extent, Ryu). As far as ultras go, those two are the characters that the rest of the cast are chasing and competing with.
Oh, don’t get me wrong, I absolutely agree with you.
Believe me, I WISH they would do something about those characters’ ultras. I would much rather see them nerfed than see everyone else get freebie ultras. Unfortunately, Capcom seems convinced that nerfing anyone will piss people off to the point where they won’t buy the game.
Chun Li Vs Cammy from ruliweb
just looking at that i think we can asume kikosho dose more than 300 damage raw
'Looked like roughly 1/3 of Cammy’s health…
…
…
looked a abit more to me and it wasnt fully charged
Not fully charged but pretty close (about 85-90% in the second round).
Not saying the numbers are exactly the same as vanilla SF4, but since it’s interesting speculating (plus I’m bored… waiting on friends) here’s a quick breakdown of the damage Chun Li did outside of her ultra in the 2nd round of that match:
Before Ultra:
Lp Kikouken = 50 damage
cr. short (traded with Cammy’s cannon strike)= 30 damage
cr. fierce (2 hits) = 100 damage
cr. jab, cr. jab, cr. short, cr. short, EX Legs (2 hits) = 204 damage (it says 5 hit combo but the 1st cr. jab hits cammy while she’s absorbing so it’s not counted by the game as part of the combo)
Absorbed kikoken (gray health recovered) = 0 damage? :lol:
Then she does Ultra with about 85-90% revenge meter filled.
After Ultra:
cr. roundhouse = 90 damage
d/f roundhouse, cr. short = 130 damage
EX Legs (K.O. on fourth hit) = between 150-200 damage
So before the ultra she does about 384 and after she does at the very least about 370 (somewhere between 370 and 420). Total is approximately 754-804 damage. Unless Cammy got a serious health boost, it doesn’t leave a lot of room for Chun’s raw U2 to surpass 300 damage.
Not saying that I want U2 to be 300. 'Just saying we gotta be prepared to accept it in case it is.
im still guessing though that it has more damage than sakura’s ultra 2…
from the videos so far… rose’s ultra is the best one because no one can rush her down since her ultra are like shield protection to her… and it has quite a fast startup too.
anyways, chun’s ultra 2 looks like it has the same damage as ryu’s ultra 1 in sf4