It’s not an assumption. It’s a statement of fact. Many does not equal all/most/none/the majority/the minority/etc. Many is an intangible number. It’s not five, it’s not five million. It’s a number used to represent a group. And I promise you, there are people who won’t use Sanwa buttons given the option. There are literally many people who despise Sanwa buttons. It’s not an assumption. It’s a fact. The point of the stick is to be easy to mod, correct? So, to add additional work to the load doesn’t exactly scream ‘easy to mod’ to me. It’s not difficult by any stretch of the imagination, but it is an unnecessary three steps added just to change my buttons, when it could have been as easy as disconnect, pop out, pop in, connect.
Also, **I **didn’t make any assumptions about your experience with sticks. I was merely rewording his post. Now, if you mean ‘you’ as in ‘people’, I could say that he also meant ‘you’ as in ‘people’. Personally, I greatly prefer Seimitsu buttons, but I’m using Sanwa in my stick because I got them free from some dude on ebay when I got my JLF and I’m sure there are a lot of people using Sanwa buttons right now simply because they have heard the name and have no experience with Seimitsu buttons.
I agree, many doesn’t necessarily mean any of those things. That’s why when it was stated that many people don’t like Sanwa buttons, I agreed. I was commenting on how meaningless it is to say “many” like or dislike anything. “Many” doesn’t mean anything. Also, I agree that people dislike Sanwa buttons. People today dislike Sanwa buttons on T.E.s, custom sticks, etc but they still buy sticks that come stock with it (and if they’re not, then this thread isn’t for them anyway since they’re probably buying customs). If they want to mod this stick, it’s really not that hard to but QDs, cut, and crimp. If I were Razer, I’d 100% be willing to add inconvenience to 10% of my customers to convenience 90% of my customers. Am I missing the point of the Sanwa QD harness thing they have in this stick or is it going to make life easier for people who want to switch out Sanwa buttons for different Sanwa buttons? I can tell you I’m not a fan of having to grab a screw driver everytime I want to switch buttons or risk messing up my QDs/Buttons because they’re on too tight and I’m trying to gently pry them off with pliers. Also, was it ever stated that the purpose of this stick was to be easy to mod? I’m sure that’s one of their goals, but I didn’t know that was the point of the stick itself. Either way, I’d argue that the Sanwa harness thing makes it easier to mod as long as you’re in the majority.
As for the second part of your post, you said:
I’m obviously arguing for Sanwa buttons so the only way to interpret this (as you know I’m arguing for Sanwa) is to assume I don’t have experience with anything else.
And I’m willing to agree that a large percentage of people may prefer Sanwa just because that’s all they know. HOWEVER, they still prefer Sanwa. If people aren’t willing to buy Seimetsus for their T.E.s now, what makes you guys think they’ll be willing to buy Seimetsus for the Razer arcade stick when it comes out? People either prefer Sanwa or are happy enough with it.
If there was a way to make a harness that does Sanwa and Seimetsu, I’d be all for that. I’d just rather not go back to QDs if what they’ve developed is easier. I think the way they have it now benefits more people than QDs, but obviously it’d be better if they could do Sanwa + Seimetsu.
not for nothing but how hard is it to actually cut a wire and crimp on a qd. It is not something that needs to be learned. but something anybody with an adequate set of tools should be able to do. I agree I don’t know why razer wouldn’t use qd’s that are not universal; but really, stating that it takes an expert modder to test these sticks is a little ridiculous. I had no knowledge off modding before I bought my first two arcade sticks and was able to change my omicron switches for happ switches just by browsing forums and applying basic skills. Cutting and crimping is not something that really needs to be learned, it is a basic skill that anybody with should be able to do with the right tools
I don’t think* anyone said anything about the difficulty. Only the fact that it has to be done at all. It’s not even a skill. If you have the tools to do so, it’s entirely intuitive. There’s nothing to look up or ask about. If you look at the tools and bits in front of you, you can clearly see what needs to be done. The fact that it needs to be done, is the only issue.
well look at it this way. lets face it, madcatz HAS the market right now and what are the general complaints about the TE? there really arent any. It is the default, the standard. If razer gives itself the use of the weird QD that only works for sanwa, it automatically eliminates a market of consumers that like seimitsu parts. Razer to even make a dent or profit in the arcade stick market, they have to do something different or better than madcatz and I personally dont think limiting options will help them encroach in the arcade stick race.
if an average consumer had a choice between the razer and madcatz at the very moment what do you think they would chose? i personally think the madcatz because theres nothing wrong with it and its the default choice. we have to think about it also in a way that benifits razer and make it stand out, i personally dont think “limited to sanwa parts for upgrades” helps it stand out, it might hurt it
i do agree with you on the fact that there shouldnt be a discrimination against average joes though, they have just as much right to have an opinion as modders, but do you think they should have equal weight? i think thats the main issue/question we should be asking ourselves. i mean here in america we do have the electoral college system for a reason
i personally think razer would only be helping themselves if they stood out by making their case even compatible with happ parts, thats a huge untapped market because none of the other manufacturers are doing it. i know it is possible because i have worked with happ parts and all you really need is a universally compatible joystick mount and maybe a little bigger thickness in the case for the buttons/stick to fit in. i know there is a custom stick builder (i dont remember his name) who makes this extremely large metal plate mount that is compatible with sanwa, seimitsu, happ, crown, etc. the buttons are absolutely no problem because sanwa/seimitsu have the largest holes at 30mm and happ buttons are actually smaller than that so they would fit (albeit not flush). the only issue would be QDs, and they might have to have a custom QD/clip thingy that is large enough to connect to happ but tight enough to clasp onto the smaller japanese parts
They should switch to the quick disconnects used in a Hori VLX. Never had I had a quick disconnect that balanced being on tightly and securely yet easy to remove as those on the VLX
The ones used on the VLX are (I think) official Sanwa SR-110 quick-disconnect “sleeves”. They’re pretty damn cool and I believe are also used on some of the official Sanwa cabinet wiring harnesses.
I believe that price may be a factor. I can get 100 of those plain red QD from lizardlick for $10, but if I get the 100 sanwa quick disconnects and 100 sleeves from akihabarashop it comes out to be about ¥4,000 or $50, and that doesn’t include shipping.
I hate the QD’s on the HRAP V3 SA, too. Probably the same sleeves they’re using on the VLX, too. I just don’t believe the sleeves protect much better than naked QD’s. At least naked QD’s are easier to pry off!
Those QD sleeves were the single biggest issue I had with my V3 SA when I was swapping button colors out.
Hate hearing this looks to be an issue with the Razer stick (which I have no plans on getting because “No PS3 support = No Buy for Me!”).
Let me guess that they don’t have a universal mounting plate option for joysticks, either??? So you’re basically stuck using JLF’s and Mad Catz JLF clones, eh?
Contrary to what some believe, I really don’t think there’s a huge market for Happ/iL parts, either. Unless you’re trying to recreate an arcade scene that just doesn’t exist anymore for 95%+ of us.
The Japanese parts have so swamped the fighting game scene that it’s near-suicide for a manufacturer to come on market without an option to support those parts.
I am puzzled though that Razer seems to be securely in the Sanwa camp. There are enough of us who do use Seimitsu parts that it makes sense to build support into the case for them…
Inside of that plastic casing is a regular quick disconnect. Gotta be careful with them still, especially removing one for the first time. When I first got my V3-SA, I broke one of those off. I had pulled straight, then tried wiggling it back and forth. What ended up happening is that the plastic wiggled back and forth while the hard-stuck QD sat in place, causing the white QD casing to break. I ended up removing the others the same way you’d remove a regular QD, but they did work better after that.
I don’t know what kind of QD’s these would be called, but These are the BEST. All you have to do is squeeze the tab a little bit and then the QD just slides effortlessly on and off.
Idk where exactly I got it from. I just know it came off a speaker. I believe its .187
