The Official Sonic the Hedgehog thread

General Discussion
1441

I’ll give you that the Power Slide feels way off. Hell I never used it, even on like Mazuri Day Act 2, which is designed for it. I found it far easier to just take the corners normally and still got an S too.

Other than that the controls are fine. I don’t know what you are talking about. Jumps are consistent, moves work right, fuck they even fixed the Homing Attack. I had it glitch maybe twice the entire time I was playing the game. And that’s been a common problem for the series since it went 3D.

I have no idea what you are talking about with the Crash comparison either. You don’t lose controls or abilities beyond the ones that obviously only work in 3D (like Power Slide and Quickstep). The transitions are actually done really nicely. All around, those day stages are quite impressive and a lot of fun.

I get you on the Werehog having too many moves. I use maybe 1/3rd of the arsenal at it’s disposal playing those levels. Even so, I still have fun playing those levels. If you don’t though, that’s your thing. I can see why not everyone does.

I hate the hub worlds enough as is. IMO, making them even bigger would be worse not better. I don’t want to do stupid side quests or run around looking for levels. I want to actually, gee I don’t know, play the levels. This was something Heroes hit right on the head. Barely any story, no map areas, just levels and bosses. Even the tutorial is completely optional. Do that again.

1442

Sonic has a heavier jump period. You probably just got used to it but there’s a difference from all previous Sonic games. And I really didn’t mean to say that the 2D to 3D transitions were bad but just not as tight as say Crash Bandicoot.

And I really would like to hear your opinion about the other examples of good game design that Sonic Team were inspired by. Have you played those games? What did you think? How did everything feel to you?

And maybe I should make things a little more clearer about my hub world idea. It helps if you’ve played Shadow of Colossus really. In that game you get a horse and you go full speed towards the area that the next colossus inhabits. Part of the joy of that game was getting to explore this big world and finding the beast. That’s all the game was about. No side quests or anything. Just exploring and killing.

Now in a Sonic setting the horse is replaced with Sonic’s speed. I’m sure you are picturing what we’ve already played in Sonic games but think about like a desert or the great plains in America. Big open spaces ya know. Sonic goes stupid fast even before he hits speed pads or ramps to jump from. So going from point A to B won’t take forever. Scenery and small but noticeable level obstacle will change as you get closer to the next zone. There isn’t any visible signs of loading. You just keep moving and you are there in this new place. A story bit ushers you into the start of the level but there is still no loading. Now you go and run through a traditional Sonic level and complete the two acts of the zone and fight a boss at the end. After a boss fight there could be a warp point to get you to the center of the hub world again and/or a new path opens up that links that zone to another on the map. A short cut if you will. And still with continuous loading. No pauses in the action.

Now if you were to revisit a level there would be no story bit to usher you in. A warp point to the start of act 2 and to the boss area/hub world warp point would be sitting there to cut down on time. After you beat the game you would unlock a quick level menu to warp all over the place if you tire of running around.

But the main aim of this idea is to keep you moving and exploring. You stop to jump, hit a switch, and move on. If you think about the one place in the Sonic world where this is possible you’d get soooooo many brownie points for it. It makes too much sense.

1443

Yes, I already admitted that DMC and GoW have much better designed and implemented combat than the Werehog levels in Unleashed. Nonetheless, I still had fun playing the Werehog as well. And it’s not like I sat at the game store and had to decide between DMC4 or Unleashed. I’ve already played all of them too.

I also have to point out that, while despite other games of that type having much better combat, I think the Werehog has better platforming. It is much more consistent and reliable than GoW’s downright annoying platforming bits.

I do think that Sonic Team should focus on getting the style of gameplay that the day stages presented to 100% first, before even trying to implement any other type of gameplay. Personally, I would like to have just that kind of gameplay. But it’s a growing trend within the industry as a whole (especially the platforming genre for some reason) to incorporate multiple types of gameplay into a single game.

The bottom line is this IMO:
I had fun playing the game. I don’t feel like I wasted my time.

Yes, I understood your idea the first time. I don’t want to explore anything. I want to go straight into level after level. Heroes game progression model >>>>>>> any variation of a map. I can live with loading screens (as long as they aren’t a minute long and have to be done 4 times per level like in 2006).

Then again this relates back to something that was discussed earlier in this very thread. One major problem with the Sonic series now is that everybody has a different idea of what the perfect Sonic game is. Personally, I want something that has nothing but levels using the gameplay style of Unleashed’s day stages, and some boss fights. Minimalistic story with no hub world, just level to level to boss progression (like Heroes). Make the entire cast of the series playable, but do it like S3&K, where you don’t actually have to beat it as anyone but Sonic to see the whole story and get 100% completion. Conversely, you do want a map/hub type area, no loading screens, and only Sonic playable. We can’t both be happy.

EDIT: I’m guessing your ideal map area is either
A) Green Hill Zone. Run around an expansive grassy field with small hills and a few trees, big loops, a bit of water, etc. etc.
or
B) Hidden Palace. Use those giant Chaos Emeralds as the warp points to get from here to there faster?

1444

First off I’m going to say that…I’m glad i’m not the only one who was thinking of a better way to do the hub world and in fact you’re pretty close to the way how I had imagined it. Sonic running no holds barred around in an area to get from place to place would be awesome…though i wouldn’t not have completely nothing along the way. I’m thinking something more close to what I’m going to say the ‘Hyrule’ set up. Going from place to place in a zelda title didn’t get boring (unless you really hated Wind Waker…) most of the time because there usually was always something around the area to explore or there were hidden things to nab. This type of design would be PERFECT. The problem though lies in production. Mario and Link have hub worlds where they can really stretch out their legs and still use most of their abilities (especially in 64/Sunshine and Oot/Majora’s mask) but how big would the hub world need to be for Sonic to stretch his legs out? Are we talking completely Shadow of the Colossus style large or something bigger? I couldn’t even begin to imagine how long it would take to build that area PLUS the 10 mile long stages for him to go through. I’d imagine the environment team would have to be working in overtime 24/7 to get the game out at a decent amount of time…that or just hire a lot of people. The closest Sonic game that came to doing something like this was Adventure which I thoroughly enjoyed running around without having some type of limit on my speed like 2006 or Unleashed. I’d like to see it happen and it could be done if Sega decided to just pull a Nintendo and just go into hibernation in the background for a few years to get things straight without being bothered.

As for the perfect place to do this in within the Sonic Universe…I almost want to say Angel Island since they had 3k revolve around that area…(either actually on the island or in some sort of area hovering or within it). I’m unsure though because during SA it looked like they had retconned the size of the island a bit…but I suppose that doesn’t matter and could always be fixed.

Sega’s always talking about roots this and roots that…if they really wanted too they could have the game take place where it all began on South Island. There’s plenty of places I wouldn’t mind them re exploring and going back too…Station Square included.

And don’t feel bad FC opinions are opinions…and it ain’t a secret that the games have been less than stellar…At least you’re fleshing out your reasonings and stating how the game could be improved instead of being a troll lol.

Edit: They could use chaos control as the warp device for the game…

1445

Reminds me of Jak and Daxter (the first one). There where clear “Zones” or “Levels” but they where integrated into the logical geography of the cityscape and locations. Everything felt like it belonged. I could live with a Sonic game that was like this. It would be very cool. Don’t make me collect 500 billion items and shit but being able to just run my ass from location to location with neat interesting fun obstacles between “Levels” to keep things fun and interesting. A meld of Jak & Daxter and SSX3’s mountain.

1446

Yeah I see what you mean about the Zelda hub world thing but because you followed up with basically the level designers working overtime 24/7 to complete the game is the sucky truth part.

The question that fans should ask themselves if they think that the Sonic series is worthy enough to be once again in the same leagues as the Mario series. If the main Sonic games were given the same long and intense development time that the main Mario games get things would be a lot better. I don’t see why Sega doesn’t treat it’s property better. Like who here really expected Sonic Unleashed to come out in the same year it was announced? I sure as hell didn’t. And if a few more months were given to the game I wouldn’t have minded one bit.

I really just want Sonic to be good again. To both critics and fans.

1447

I think Sonic deserves the same treatment Mario gets. Hell i wish he did because i honestly like his better.

1448

The werehog platforming in SU feels pretty good. Holding down the grab button is a life-saver. As for the camera transition from 3d to 2d(day stages), it was done very well IMO considering the speed of the engine. In Crash bandicoot, you are not going 300 miles per hour in long, highly detailed environments. Considering that sega even managed to pull it off is already an achievement. The hedgehog engine is not perfect, but it’s a good platform for more cool things to come when sega tweak that engine even further.

1449

In all honesty though I really think Sega tried hard with Unleashed…I don’t think that’s the issue with that game so much as the amount of time that is spent to make the game. They built a new engine for the ground up for the new game and it works really well…the only glaring problem with it was the were hog sections which it seems starting with BK they’re just going to be having something closer to the daytime stages and that’s it…no completely alternate way of playing. Remains to be seen for how long it’s going to stay that way though.

On the real though…doing a good sonic game isn’t impossible…it’s just going to require a lot effort. Mostly to the environment and where sonic is going to be running around since he’s covering ground so quickly…which Sega themselves have complained about and probably have been trying to avoid for the longest time. They’re gonna be completely serious and make game perfect they’re goinna have to sit down and work on it for at least 4 years…and that’s only if they’re planning on working at the pace that they have been and not moving people around in the division where it needs to be. It can be cut down depending upon how they have everyone set up.

1450

and now…for something completely different…

[media=youtube]KRo-1vDlJPM&feature=related[/media]

(if you do click on the link…i suggest turning your speakers down…)

1451

Been meaning to ask, what’d you guys think of the music in both the USA and Japanese versions of Sonic CD? I know GameFan pissed and moaned about the USA soundtrack, but I really enjoyed it. I actually dig both versions of Sonic CD’s music. Few games get two dope scores. Funny that Sega never released an official OST for either version.

1452

Why the hell would you link this? For serious lol.

I like both myself but i do prefer the JPN tacks. They are easier listening. Sonic Boom pretty cool but the goofyness and catchyness of Toot Toot Sonic Warrior makes it better. Plus that Asian chick is beltin it while channelin Aretha Franklin and that’s just dope.

1453

FC, are you going to tell us what area you have in mind for the central, hub section of your ideal, interconnected Sonic world is?

1454

Oh, angel island.

1455

On a related note to death egg:
[media=youtube]EyjJvorbgvU[/media]

and related to my video:

[media=youtube]X0WAn8qEkOU&feature=related[/media]

1456

Sega did the the seperate sound track thing with Sonic Cd (Eng/Jap) and 3d Blast (Gen/Sat). My cuz likes the japanese version better for cd but I like different things from both ends. All things considering though I believe I like Eng better…especially Sonic Boom.

WOOT! I guessed right.

1st one ALMOST works. 2nd one is awesome.

Rioting Soul sent that to me among a bunch of other stuff and I found it entertaining.

1457

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/44488.html Sonic and the black knight trailer.

1458

Looks fun. Sword combat appears to be quick and not game-halting.

1459

I had just finished watching that trailer and was going to post it. I literally screamed out ‘YEEEEEEEEESSSSS!!!’ without any mentions of things being delicious when I saw that the sword play was quick. Looks like there was some Onimusha stuff going on in there with the Slash, pause, slash pause thing. Now I just hope that the controls follow through and it’s set…PLEASE DON’T FUCK UP…PLEASE DON’T FUCK UP…PLEASE DON’T FUCK UP…

and I guess the new girl is Zel-…er I mean Merlina

1460

It looks like Sonic Unleashed minus the whole “Unleashed” aspect, so to speak…

Let’s see if reviewers put their money where their mouths are…after all, a game like this is what they wanted right? All the speed, none of the hog.