OK, if we want a preliminary list, why not select a representative or two for each character and have solo matches, 10 fights between each character (total of 70 fights for each person), have each player comment on their character’s strengths/weaknesses against the opponent and average the W/L ratio, then have at least a matchup chart from which to derive a tier list?
If we’re doing this, I vote for KhaosMuffin and myself to represent Fortune.
Lol i still think everyone here is on some shit about parasoul… Also, dont see how people can not say double is the best character in the game. I have current prepatched double at damn near s-tier. Parasoul is mid or high mid. Painwheel is high mid or top… Fuck it my list though i cant be fucked to provide a thorough explanation of every character:
A+ Double: has probably the 2 best assists in the game in hk bomber and lk bomber, i personally use lk bomber as it isnt duckable and is basically an invincible cerecopter plus its current knockdown property is much easier for painwheel to convert into damage, which means that it would actually be easier for most characters to convert into damage… On block you get low/throw mixup for free and this is from an invincible move. An example? Lk bomber is like a completely invincible akuma tatsu that is even easier to hit confirm.
Hk bomber i save for the parasoul and peacock matchups… Invincible beam assist that reaches full screen? Lets go!
Supers, i firmly believe double has the games best supers, hands down. Cats are a safe on block dhc, car is one of the most invincible supers in the entire game, and doubles lvl 3 is one of the most damaging supers in the game and as scrubby as it is any version of hornet bomber into lvl 3 is a game winner many times… This is a no skill combo that does mega damage from an invincible move cause the invicible move does mega damage and since it only does 3 hits pre super the scalong is minimum, plus no otg is sacrificed here so double can add on to the already ridiculous damage. On point, double has a good space controlling fireball that can be hitconfirmed into cars and she has a very fast jumping fierce that comes complete with its own on block mixups as it can be canceled into a wiffed j.hk into throw for a very easy to setup tick throw. Also doubles throw is easily hitconfirmed into huge damage… Though since this isnt double specific it doesnt really count toward her score.
For the record double and parasoul are like 2 sides of a different coin… The non palette swapped versions of ryu and ken if you will. As teammates they do almost rhe exact same things as the other (safe on block super,comboable lvl 3, invincible assist) i just think as of pre patch double brings alot more to the table in the second position than parasoul… Double certainly has a hell of alot more derp.
A
Painwheel: its my opinion that once painwheel hits you she basically becomes an s-tier character. There are to many reasons to list specifically (ive listed most in the gameplay discussion thread anyways) but suffice it to say that painwheels resets are so varied and can come from so many different points that it isnt like shes actually even a reset character… Shes more like an easier execution higher probability of hit sf4 vortex character. Without the hp and execution and movement handicaps.
A-
Parasoul: the great all around character herself. Can do good damage, has decent resets, has superb assists. What doesnt she have? Not much, though no airdash/special air movement restricts her a bit (doubles hornet bomber can KIND OF be considered an air based movement… After all it is airborn) parasoul is a good character there is no doubt about that.
A-
Bella:
Bella has great air moves that are ridiculously fast (j.hp is active in 7 frames? WTF…) bella has a command run into run stop for ground positioning behind an assist she has a semi flight that cancels into a 7 frame air to air. She is one of the few if only command grab characters in any fighting game with spammable 50/50 on air and ground command grabs. She has a running overhead, a running cr.lk, a run into command grab, a run into left/ right. Plus she does stupid damage. Has suspect matchup issues with good peacocks and parasouls though. Also has arguably the 3rd best assist in the game in cerecopter and after parasoul has the most versatility in assist having many all around good ones in excelebella,cerecopter, big hand ranged command grab and even her sweep or command normal
Valentine: awesome movement options, great run for converting assist otgs, good resets, good damage the only thing suspect about this character is her shitty blockbusters and not so great assist options… Solve this problem with val on point and its a non issue. A very good character.
Ms.fortune:
Head owns shit up. Most fortunes that i see are still running her solo… I’d like to see her with some assist that really take her head into perspective. But it may be awhile till we see this. Her and val are the biggest sleepers in my book, val more, but a somewhat distant second is MF.
B+
Filia:
Great resets, great offense. A bit unsafe but easily mitigated via assists. I dont see this character as low tier at all. Also has varied assists and can be a bitch to pushblock well. Damage without meter is her most suspect virtue. Still, this charcter can run through opponents.
B:
Peacock
I dont think peacock is all that weak and do think she still has room to grow, but lets face it… She seems to be close to her ceiling. She has ok assists her best probably being georges day out… But that assist needs a good amount of protection tp be called and many times doesnt do anything TO substantial once it is out… Still it is a good option which is more than mf, painwheel and val can say. I still see peacocks concentrating on bang bang bang, but i think thats going about it wrong… That move is very air to ground suspect and therefor needs more thout than to just be spammed. Its probably best as a combo from otg. Other than that i think peacocks need to stay away from this move in neutral, unless fullscreen. Peacocks most important moves are gdo hp item drop and teleport, bang x3 is requires finesse to use.
So there thats my tier list. Its just my opinion.
-dime
I’ve found her fireballs to be pretty lacklustre personally, save for being a slight nuisance at full screen. The recovery is quite long so if you whiff it can be dangerous unless you’re willing to burn meter. Compared to Parasoul’s zoning options, titan knuckle is the only real advantage Double can claim. j.HP is pretty good for lockdown, a bit like Parasoul’s HK, but Double doesn’t have a move analogous to Parasoul’s or Val’s j.HPs to help get air dominance.
Dime… to call Parasoul’s reset game “decent” is probably the greatest understatement I’ve ever heard from you. With two standing overheads and an insanely dirty cross up, among having outrageously good lows, not to mention her great air grab. I would have to say she’s the best reset character in the game. And you yourself stressed (and basically convinced and taught me) that Skullgirls is about resets. As for Double, I feel she’s an excellent support character (although her assist IS getting nerfed), but on point she has a lot of trouble getting in, certainly far more trouble than Parasoul. Parasoul by far is the character to fear the most when you are in the corner, and that’s a big deal. She creates the most problems for incoming characters.
I just dont like ground based resets. They are to mashable and come from a position that is to predictable for me… I mean mash super will kill your overhead option as will it kill your low option. Jump back plus invulnerable assist call will probably kill either option as well if you mistime it and looking at the resets that you were doing against fox, many of them had big holes… Lol man i aint putting you down at all, it just seems like some major pain in the ass work to keep her resets tight to mashes… Meaning that against defense mashers you will have to bait or hold a much higher execution threshold, only to STILL get your stuff mashed on.
Also, just because parasoul has two overheads… Doesnt mean a whole lot. (one of which isnt even cancelable into the other of which has to be canceled into cancelman outside the corner)… I mean if number of overheads means alot then painwheel has SIX!.. And 2 of painwheels overheads can be flight canceled into more overheads before she even touches the ground… In the corner or against a standing hurtbox midscreen painwheel can combo 6 overheads in a row and yet go low anytime she wants… And painwheels reset game is completely obnoxious midscreen and needs no lockdown assist to start it. Seriously im not downing your girl man, im simply comparing her stupid to the better stupid and what i come up with is “decent”
Fair enough?
You dont have to agree, but you mit be served well to perhaps educate yourself against exactly what parasoul is going up against when we compare reset wars… To me you saying parasouls resets are great is like me saying painwheels fireballs are great… If you get my drift…
LOL hope we still coo 
-dime
Of course we’re cool, lol, what about Double having more trouble getting in than Parasoul, or Ms Fortune, or Valentine, or maybe even everyone but Peacock. Isn’t that a problem? You don’t think Parasoul has a good air reset game?
The Painwheel fireball analogy is extreme, but I get where you are coming from, although I disagree, I would love to see you deal with Parasoul and Cerecopter in the corner, shit might be the most difficult thing to deal with the game, lol. She’s really got so much stuff going on, would you say she’s among the most versatile characters?
See this is what im talking about… First you setup the BEST possible situation for parasoul (corner and BLOCKING a lockdown assist) to prove your point, yet you fail to think about… What if painwheel were in the same exact situation? Have you tried to block a painwheel at point blank that has you covered by a lockdown? I give it up that were i ina situation that bad against ANY of the games characters… Im probably screwed. But painwheel needs no corners, in fact she prefers to be midscreen… Now let me posit you a question. You are midscreen against painwheel that has just opened you up? What on gods green earth do you do? Try and react? That will get you nowhere as probably 70% of painwheels resets are completely unreactable. You will generally be forced to guess or mash which is also a guess but when you ate playing against a charcter that can:
What option do you possibly have to predict her? But thats also best case scenario like the one you posted to me, the difference is that it is EASY AS ALL HELL to do any of those things. The biggest problem ive found doing this stuff is that e resets come by so fast and quick that the combo seems to never stop and i fuck up and get hit by ips cause i forget where exactly i am in my combo. And also lets not frget that painwheel does some really nice damage so generally even if im not using my max damage into resets i only need 2 resets to kill. And if i got a really good opener i only need one. (2v2)
As far as double is concerned, i havent really found it that hard to get in… Afterall she has an invincible move that goes fullscreen and blows through basically any attempt to keep her out. But i play double weird, i have basically zero respect for the character and therefor dont bother to learn her past scrub mode which for some stupid reason is completely to effective. Other than that, i just jump around with j.hp variants trying to engineer a yomi bomber or a blocked/hit j.hp or a dash. And if i have meter to blow… The most obvious choice of all… Activate catellites and get in for absolutely free… She can backdash do fireball cancel into catellites then just do damn near whatever she wants … Even her car super becomes safe
Yeah i havent seen double to have problems getting in… Shes the epitome of braindead… Possibly more braindead than viper and rufus… Possibly.
-dime
Good analysis, especially about Painwheel, I think the difference is, Parasoul can open people up more easily than Painwheel, so while Painwheel has good reset options, Parasoul can preform resets more frequently because she gets openings more. I haven’t really played a good Painwheel yet, but her openings seem more predictable than Parasoul’s.
I overstated the fireball a bit… But its the heit at which the fireball goes that is mainly what im talking about… Not about doing fireball x 2 or 3 just doing one fireball to potshot people and hitconfirm into car if they were doing someting that obviously will get them hit.
-dime
You could be right about this, but i think its one of those things that is player specific. I throw all damn day with painwheel and any throw = blender time (offline) also… I love painwheels throw… Goddamn that shit looks like it hurts.
I SAID STAY DOWN BITCH!!! LOL
Also i dont know if parasoul has this, but can she chain a standing or crouching light into a cr.lk? I ask because charcters that can have a ridiculous 50/50 from either weak attack into tick throw or weak attack into delayed cr.lk. … Painwheel has it.
-dime
Nah, she doesn’t have that, even double checked to make sure, that would be pretty insane. But I honestly think her pressure is almost too cheap, she probably has the best non Peacock projectile in the game too which is huge. She is a major force to be reckoned with.
It was a trick question… Parasoul has it. Its just that what she has it from is different but the concept is the same:
Cr.lp throw
Or
Cr.lp slight delay cr.mk xx hpx2 gives you what i am dubbing a tickset… Ahhh me and my kookie names.
Remember that the cr.lp and the cr.mk cant combo inorder for it to work as a reset and it may not be as powerful with parasoul as it is with characters that have it from weak attack to weak attack, because for it to be truly powerful it has to beat both tech throw attempts AND upback.
-dime
Who good is using oarasouls crouching lp outside of combos? Hitbox isn’t good
You’re actually trying to hitconfirm doubles gun into car super? Why take a risk like that when you can cancel into cqtellites?
And parasoul does have a good air 50/50
But its more the combination of all her dumb pressure tools that makes her the best
you are supposed to use it “inside combos” thats the purpose of the reset… it would depend on the player but yeah you could use it in a blockstring, whether you’d want to use it during a blockstring is anyones guess… player preference i would guess. also the hitbox as bad as it might be shouldnt be a horrible problem since you would be using it offensively and therefor can control your range to the opponent. but yeah, i wouldnt go on to say that people should be using it just that in combos they can as an alternative reset.
if you know how to hit confirm it isnt a risk… (hint the hitconfirm is the same kind of hitconfirm where in streetfighter you jump over a fireball and know you will hit the combo and can therefor go for a jumpin combo straight into ultra/super) ie you look at there animation and know they will be hit before they even get hit… how do you think the good guys are doing it? thats the way i do it. not much risk… not particularly doable online in a laggy connecton unless you are that godlike.
as far as not wanting to go straight into cats:
i like running people over? plus the hitconfirm looks l33t to the uninitiated… they dont call it the swag wagon for nothing.
cool, what is it?
we have a difference of opinion, it isnt the end of the world. i do readily admit that she has good pressure tools.
-dime
I just realized it the other day. After you launch with cr hp you wait and either airgrab or jab, fierce, otg. True 50% guess unless they mash (this is deceptively simple and…realpy fucking good. basically had a nerd orgasm when I realized this simple but awesome reset) same idea as granberia’s double air 50/50, most characters probably have this to some degree
And yea that hitconfirm is cool but I usually wouldn’t try it unless its full screen, if I have 2 meters just in case I mess up to make it safe, or if itl chip anyway.
My short Skullgirls general tier list for fun, we are only going to have the pre-patched version for a short time anyway, so there is no way you can have a completely accurate tier list.
S- (Complete characters)
Double, Parasoul
A+
Valentine (After watching some Japanese player abuse her green vial, she can pretty much TOD anyone easily)
Peacock (fuck what I said earlier, with the right assist, this bitch is a impenetrable wall)
A
Painwheel (great damage, mixups) Ms. Fortune(Solid damage) Cerabella(solid damage) Filia (has potential to rise)
Peacock is still garbage and the worst, anyone who disagrees come play me on PSN.
Also Painwheel isnt higher than Parasoul because painwheel can have a hard time against certan characters, peacock can fuck up painwheel easy if they don’t make mistakes parasoul zoning can also body painwheel free.
S: Double
A+:Parasoul
A-:Painwheel
B:Valentine, Cerebella, Ms.Fortune
C:Fillia
D:
E:Peacock.
I think of Peacock the way most folks saw Spiderman when UMVC3 was new-new. She has SERIOUS potential as a trap fighter considering she can attack from most places on screen and her attacks are mostly direct(A la Screwball Cannonball, BANG![invincible start up for the L/M versions], Bang, bang, BANG!, etc) Timed(a la Shadow of Impending Doom L/M/H [when followed up with a punch button]) Not to mention ‘The Hole Idea’ which allows her to dodge across the screen. Aerial-wise, she retains that zany cartoon antics with moves like 'Buzzin Buzzard and ‘Bear Trap of Seville’. The latter move attacking on the ground in the case that her launch missed; which allows a follow up with Buzzin Buzzard. ‘George’s Day out’ is good in the sense it can be seen as a moving trap and doesnt explode when Peacock is hit much like ‘Lonesome Lenny without the friendly fire effect.’
All in all, y’all underestimate Peacock. Heck one could say she embodies Wesker.
She’s still easily the worst character.
It’s not like she’s unplayable, hell, there are only 8 characters. I think the general consensus is that, she’s just… the worst out of the 8.
EDIT: Wesker is overrated. Anyone who’s playing Marvel right now knows that. So, that’s making me question your general knowledge on FGs.
I suppose. But I still see her better than Double.