This argument has been used again and again. It’s sort of a catch 22; we’ll fix it when you guys play it, but you guys won’t play it if it’s broken, so we won’t get the money to fix it. The other option is:
Play for free at someone’s house, with WORKING sticks, cool atmosphere, conversation, snacks, and sitting space. That’s where it gets to be an issue. Honestly, it’s not our responsibility to subsidize a business that doesn’t believe us when we tell them that fighting games should only cost a quarter, because every other decent arcade in California has fighting games that cost a quarter. But whatever. I’ll be there tonight.
How many tournaments do the 707 guys have to throw for Scandia to get the picture that we’d like to support them more?
Wasn’t it Kris and Dan who threw together 2 tournaments at Scandia this year within a month or so of each other? We could’ve easily put something together ourselves and done some sort of console tourney. Instead we went ahead and gave Scandia our trust to help our community. If turnouts for all the tournaments Kris, Dan and the rest of the 707 guys put together at Scandia doesn’t demonstrate our want for an arcade to support/chill at, I don’t know what will?
As Alex mentioned, why should I continue to support an arcade that doesn’t understand our basic necessities? I’m not saying a tech’s job is easy or that repairing the sticks/buttons is a cake walk, but in essence that is all we are asking. Maintain the machines and we will continue to come as a group/crew and bring everyone else we know.
Don’t you think as a business they’d fix the sticks if there were still a large flourish of people coming even on broken machines? Maybe, but there is no way to really know. It’s getting to the point where I am just saying to myself and other people I know, what else can we possibly do to get them to understand?
Well, maybe sound down the horrors a little… I went there, and although Alex was the only other guy there, I was pleased to see that the left stick on MvC2 has indeed been replaced now. So maybe somebody’s paying attention after all. It was a brand new P360.
So… Marvel players of the north bay, there’s no more cause for griping about Scandia. (No, they’re not paying me… I’m just trying to gather people to play because I like arcades in general, I’m old school…) I won’t be able to make it next week because if all goes well I’ll be on vacation visiting family back in Portland, but I’d like to see some people there the next time I go.
??? I remember asking, like, 4 times, who was coming this Thursdai. And the thread kind of just died after that.
StiltMan… I don’t know how long you’ve been going to Scandia, but it’s been a while for us. We’ve tried it all.
Granted, Scandia has made some moves to make things a little better, but it’s never where it counts. They had some PHAT crowds when they first brought in the FGs and you could always expect at least 4 people on just Marvel at any given.
Howevert, lack of maintainance and high cost started hurting.
When they revamped the locations of the fighting games so we could actually have room to stand and, you know, play, things were looking up. Some tournies were thrown, there was some turnout…
But sticks deteriorated and would be left for weeks. And they were STILL charging DOUBLE the price of other more successful establishments that had more to offer in terms of games, options and players.
It’s hard trying to support a place that calls me an idiot every time I put two coins in a third strike machine. I keep saying… what they’re doing now isn’t working, so why not try, you know, not charging me twice as much for things?
Honestly, that’s my BIGGEST problem. It’s insulting. There are free alternatives. And the frusturation of a broken or even just kinda off stick is heightened by the fact that I payed double the usual price to use it. It makes it harder to shrug off.
I don’t know… I don’t know how meeting at my house is going to pan out with everyone kinda just disappearing this last time. Scandia hasn’t taken off in all the time it’s been there and it wants ME to pay them extra just to show them i’m serious which is just another way of calling me a moron…
So I don’t know. Maybe I want Scandia to prove to ME that they’re serious.
The whole post about being called an idiot by scandia is almost too true. Especially with Omega Tony GGPOing from there and all those DDR kids having run of the place. I say good riddance… once I get my stick.
In house meetings will start to work better, Spring Break is just a bad time to count on people. Everyone’s on vacation and such. Things will pick back up.
Okay, I’m going to apologize in advance if this turns into a mini-rant, but I’m really not happy with where this conversation is going. (And I’m a little tired and possibly/probably cranky from lack of regular and well-rhythmed sleep the last few days/weeks, so I apologize in advance if that makes this more acidic than it needs to be…) I mean nothing personally to anybody here, but this is honestly bothering me, and making me think that the reason there isn’t a stronger fighting game community at Scandia has very little to do with anything Scandia is or isn’t doing.
I like arcades. Okay? Everybody got that? I. Like. Arcades. I like the competition of taking on all comers, expected or otherwise, in order to fight to hold control of the machine. I’m more comfortable with the control set-ups. They’re a public place, which I’m generally more comfortable with when I don’t know who I’m playing against. Going to somebody’s house is not a substitute, nor is it an end goal towards which I am working. I like the arcades, in and of themselves. None of this is going to change any time soon. If and when arcades fail across the board, my fighting game career is most probably DONE. I’ll miss them, I’ll be disappointed, but right now the only legally released game on the horizon for which I’ll trust the network is STHD, so unless a lot more happens like it to account for the changing times, when arcades go, I’ll probably just stop playing other fighting games. There should be absolutely no mistaking these points.
I know people are out there who play the games. Regardless of what else may have gone on in the past, there two sets of sticks on an MvC2 machine up there that are better than what I usually expect from MvC2 arcade sticks, for the moment. Scandia is closer to home than Fairfield Tilt on weekends and stays open later on Friday nights even though it’s farther from work, so that I don’t have to try to blow out of work well before 8 for it to be worth going at all.
That I am apparently having to actually argue with people to show up is a very, very bad sign to me. I don’t have to go to this much trouble. For the effort of getting away from work after 8 hours and a few text messages, I can get people to show up in Fairfield largely whenever I want. However, I happen to like finding new arcades to play and more people to play in them… but I like to keep it in the arcades, for the most part. I’m going well out of my way to try to find, much less develop, another fighting game scene here. And frankly, what I’m seeing here is not convincing me that the majority of the reasons there isn’t one at Scandia are actually Scandia’s own fault.
The sticks on MvC2 work. I don’t care whether they worked three months ago. I’m not there three months ago, I’m there Friday nights now. Stop complaining and give the place a reason to keep them working. If you treat them like a first step towards getting people to come over to your place and never come back, that’s not a reason for them to keep them working. End of story.
You’re outraged that it costs fifty cents a game, which is the same as every other commercial arcade has charged for a current-gen fighting game for the last fifteen years? Get out. No, really. Get out. Fifty cents a game there is still cheaper for you than driving clear into San Francisco on today’s gas prices (to say nothing of parking nightmares) for whatever some university-subsidized arcades might charge. If this bothers you, then you’re digging for reasons to complain.
I see Scandia taking a lot of steps – that a lot of arcades don’t take – to foster a fighting game community there. They’ve put a bunch of different games that aren’t easy to get into good cabinets (no, I don’t care about CvS2) and they’re fixing obviously broken sticks. Hell, right now the sticks there are better than Fairfield Tilt’s. Most of the signs I’m seeing from them are pretty darn good. What I’m seeing from you guys blows.
So that’s really the big question. Do you want to play, or do you want to bitch? If you want to play, you know where to find me most Friday nights (although I’ll probably be in Portland this coming Friday). I’ll stick it out a few more of them, but if I wind up playing against the computer hoping/waiting for someone to show up many more times, I just won’t come back. They want you to show up there and so do I. If you can’t be bothered to go to an arcade that’s in your back yard that’s going to the amount of expense I’m seeing from them to find games you want to play in boxes you want to play them in, then I’ll just stick with Fairfield. I really shouldn’t have to go to this much effort just to get you guys to come out and play games.
I don’t mean to sound like a jerk here but here’s my counterpoint:
I don’t play Marvel.
The Guilty Gear competition is usually horrible. The best matches I’ve played are against Nick… not sweaty DDR kid or Beer Breath Hispanic.
CvS2… lol.
HnK is gone
Still waiting on Super Turbo
Yeah! Third Strike!!! Wait… I play that at Nick’s… against the best competition in Sonoma County… for free.
Yeah, the sticks are nice, but some of the guys in this thread are used to Keystone quality. Comparing Tilt to Scandia is fine, you can pull that argument off, but compared to the nicer arcades, Scandia is nothing to write home about. It’s close, that’s what it has going for it.
Fifty cents a game IS cheaper than driving to some random San Francisco area. Fifty cents a game is NOT cheaper than driving ten minutes to someone’s house and chilling for a few hours. Let’s think about it this way.
Gas $3.55/ gallon
Typical night at scandia
$5-10 tokens
In my Honda Accord, it takes me about a gallon to get to Nick’s house and back. IF I decide to stop for food, then I spend about $6 in total. At Scandia, I spend money on tokens and gas (even though it’s not ALOT) Usually upwards of the $10 range. Because I don’t play Marvel seriously, there is no reason for me to drive to Scandia instead of someone’s house. This point is equally stressed with the absence of CvS2. Their Guilty Gear is not up to date.
In closing:
StiltMan, your points are fairly valid, no question. The only way they fall short is the perspective they’re coming from. I like arcades too, but you and I are a completely different breed of arcade goer.
I would rather hang out where the best players are playing, and when it comes to the games I’m interested in, that Nick’s. I don’t need to play in an arcade in order to gain satisfaction. If Scandia invested in some sort of Japanese exchange program, I would love to play Daigo, but until that happens, I’m content getting schooled by Sonoma County’s best. Not to discourage you from trying to kick off Marvel over here, but the Tilt guys play Marvel and we play Third Strike. I’m not saying we don’t want to learn. I’m saying that’s where our focus has been.
firstly, a lot of us have dropped a lot more money at scandia and spent more time there than you, stilt. no offense is meant on that, but that’s truth. it doesn’t deny your points, but spanky is right when he says that it gives you a different perspective. we’ve met nearly all of the players that go there, at one point or another, and chances are we’ll see those same people again and again. paying 50 cents a match against someone i know and see regularly blows harder than paying nothing for that same match. yes, it changes things the situation when you talk about new and different competition show up, but having gone to scandia somewhat regularly for a while now… we’ve found that that happens very rarely.
that being said, sonoma county isn’t the best for marvel. the best players around here, besides you, that could even be possibly considered aren’t even from here… they’re from san rafael or farther. i don’t think many people here deny that. so i mean if it’s your desire to foster a highly competitive marvel community in this area, you’re not talking about a whole lot of people.
but you’re right. you shouldn’t have to go to a lot of trouble to find comp, when you could just otherwise go to fairfield. you’re absolutely right. no one’s trying to be unwelcome to you here… nick has extended invitation to you, and respectfully accepted your refusal.
so if the question is “do we want to play, or do we want to bitch?” who says people here aren’t doing both?
yes… because, i’m sorry to say, none of us have been going to scandia at all for the past few years… :sad:
seriously though. no one’s opposed to going to scandia. most of us want to. but most of us already have been… regularly. and most of us end up seeing the same people, and pay 50 cents a game. and some of us would rather console for free. or some of us go elsewhere for different comp. is that really so bad?
I think it’s best if I don’t say anything regarding that post. Everyone knows how I feel. Dan, Kris, Nick, Anthony, Sam, Rival, and the rest of the real 707 Sonoma County crew. I don’t want to muck up the thread anymore with pages and pages of arguing over who’s point is right.
All I have to say is Nick and Hoax…I warned you didn’t I?
Well spoken but all moot and based on largely uninformed conjecture.
This backlash against scandia is the RESULT of trying to deal with Scandia for over a year. MY point is merely yours from the other direction. Only based on actual occurances. You’re coming in late and seeing people move away from Scandia. Check the topic and note the date of the posts for when Scandia first got a decent number of fighting games. We’ve been patronizing that establishment since then. This anti-Scandia sentiment is the result of months of shoddy experiences.
I don’t know about you, but Scandia is the only place i’ve EVER paid 50 cents for Third Strike. Ever. When they are informed of that, i’d like that to be taken into consideration. instead of just “Make us money before we have competitive prices!”
Wait… I take taht back… there was one place in emeryville. Same deal. 50 cents, less than average quality sticks. If i’m paying 50 cents, I want exsquisite sticks. Nigh GOLDEN sticks.
I don’t know about you, but two working sticks on Marvel NOW doesn’t make up for the year of consistent garbage that persists for weeks before being acknowledged.
I don’t know about you, but I find that when someone says I have to make them money before they’ll charge normal prices for things and FIX THINGS I get a little worried. That’s far more disconcerting than anything we’ve said.
What you’re also not seeing is that we go to arcades when we can. Just not Scandia. So we’re not afraid of the arcade setting. We travel far to get to KS2, SVGL, MGL, SFSU and others whenever it’s feasible.
Scandia just isn’t good. We’ve shown them people will show up and play. They had good crowds for a solid couple of months and we still got broken sticks and overpriced machines.
They rearrange the place and things look up and we come back for awhile, throw some tournies and it’s soon back to the old.
I’m not going to run their business for them. When they show ME they’re serious, i’ll patronize. I’ve already done my part.
Don’t forget we’ve all been going there for awhile. This sentiment is a new one based off of old experiences.
Bull. I’ve been poking in there for about a year and a half. My frustration at not finding anyone there is not new.
Check the date of when I first posted in this thread myself. The first time I went in there was shortly before November 22nd, 2006. I lucked out and managed to find some people willing to play at the time. Other than when hoax has shown up just lately, it’s basically never happened since.
My “where the hell is everybody???” sentiment is the result of months of shoddy experiences, too. I’ve seen very little from Scandia that’s dramatically worse than anywhere else I’ve ever played. When I first got there, it was probably below average; right now I’d consider it middle of the pack or a little better. The best place I’ve ever played that was just consistently good was Lloyd Center Tilt up in Portland. Both the manager and most of the employees there are gamers themselves, so they get it. Fairfield Tilt is pretty good for people but the sticks have been pretty brutal on my Cable play since day one, although they’re not a total loss. The sticks on MvC2 right now at Scandia are frankly about as good as I’ve ever seen in California.
I have not seen a commercial arcade charge less than 50 cents for a current-gen fighting game, ever. I’ve seen a university arcade charge 50 for start and 25 for continue back in the halcyon days when Street Fighter 2 (yes, two) was new and current.
Yeah, I think I know the place you’re talking about. Public market, right? That closed down over a year ago, I believe. It kind of looked like a dive to me, too, really…
From where I’m coming from, I have much the same sentiment, except that the main problem I’ve seen has always been that I just can’t find anybody to show up. The place isn’t golden, no, but it’s serviceable. I’ve seen a lot worse, but I’ve seen better. Right now, there’s two working sticks, and I’ve got basically no use for grudges against the place. I figure, play 'em until they break again, and if they don’t fix them again when they break, then fine, I’ll stop going then. (Although it’s true that if the stick on the left had been as bad as it was two weeks ago I probably would be reconsidering showing up for a while.)
See, here’s where I frankly think your reality check is bouncing. “Normal” to you frankly doesn’t seem to exist anywhere else I’ve ever seen in the last fifteen years. Alex tells me there’s a few places down in San Francisco at some of the universities down there (probably subsidized by the schools or being used as a loss leader for other things in the same complex) that charge 25 cents instead of 50, but at commercial arcades, that’s pretty much the norm and always has been. Scandia is 50 cents for MvC2. So is Fairfield Tilt. So is every arcade in the greater Portland area from Lloyd Center Tilt on down the food chain. So was every arcade I’ve seen in the Seattle-Tacoma area from Tilts to Silver Coins to Lanwerx. So was the UCLA arcade when I was there for Evo 2k2. So was Birdcage in Sacramento. I’ve been to SVGL only once, but it was the same there (and frankly the sticks there were nothing to write home about either and the machines were crammed together so tightly that I’m not at all sure what the fuss is about). Springfield in the Eugene area, Albany in central Oregon, the whatever-it-was in Kennewick, Washington… all 50 cents. The Memorial Union arcade at Oregon State University used to charge 50 to start and 25 to continue back when Hyper Fighting was actually a current release, but from Super onward it was 50 altogether, as was the EMU at the University of Oregon.
Maybe – maybe – there’s some place down in San Francisco where it’s 25 cents, and I’ll believe it until I see otherwise, but that by no means leaves me considering it “normal”. That’s frankly rather mind blowing to me.
I’ve been to SVGL once… I don’t know, I just didn’t see what the fuss was about. I might go back eventually, but it’s a good two hour round trip to get there, and I’ve heard it’s not what it used to be anyway. Haven’t been to any of the others yet, but I don’t personally like to go into San Francisco in general. Just not a big city dude. I might go by the Metreon Tilt one of these days, but I haven’t yet. It’s a half hour just to get barely across the Golden Gate Bridge, much less to any place decent. Unless I’ve got a really fantastic reason to bother, I just… don’t.
Anyway, you get the idea. The general point is, we could go on and on and at the end of it we’ll probably have to just agree to disagree. On the other hand, if you just really hate Scandia and aren’t even willing to let people suggest jumping in there without massive hate being thrown at the place (even if they DO have a pair of working sticks, which is about all I care about) is there some place else up at this end of the bay we could try out? Is that Video Bob spot in San Rafael any good? Metreon Tilt? (I’ve heard mixed things about it, but based on this I’m kind of taking it with a grain of salt until I go there myself…) What’s left? No, your house is not an answer to me.
I kinda like Metreon Tilt, but it was better before it was “Tilt.” Back when it was the “Airtight Garage.”
I don’t know Scandia is cool because it’s close. Nick’s is cool because it’s close.
I enjoy both places, but from a $$$ standpoint alone, Nick’s wins GGPO.
From a quality perspective, Home gatherings win, GGPO.
From a competition perspective, we miss out on the fact that Scandia may get some random 1337 scrubkillers every four months, but consistently, the matches at Nick’s have been better. The competition is good and it’s free, so Nick and Rivival can beast us 100 times and teach us 100 things, whereas we would only learn as far as our money went.
Though it seems to me Stiltman, that your entire philosophy lies behind supporting arcades. In your most recent post, you yourself ditched the idea of supporting Scandia, as long as we go to another arcade. You contradicted a previous point by saying it’s BS to drive to SF when Scandia is so close, but then you tell us to try Metreon or Video Bob?
we should all be happy that we have 2 places now that we can have legit matches and competition, scandia and nicks pad. all this has been drawn out way too much. I can understand where stiltman is coming from, i prefer arcade as well. however, i have gone to 9 arcades all over cali, from regency to sunnyvale, and scandia, not the worst, let the mvc2 machine stay broken for more then 7 months at one time. But now, stiltman says the sticks are good, and i heard from joe that the sticks are good again. north bay needs unity, not all this back and forth…
The tilt is trash… no one goes, sticks suck… closest and best place for you would be SFSU… get off the bridge and drive down 19th… Really not a big deal if your not a city person… alot easier and less costly then going to Met tilt…
I find it funny that your so wanting to play at a arcade rather than goto where the comp is… I mean you got some good players out that way, go play them… anyways, from what i see you post, your last hope is SFSU, cause all the GOOD marvel players, play at each others house’s from what i understand…
And for the 50 cent, i know me, rival and nick have been to almost all arcades around here, yes… scandia is the only one charging 50 cents… not only that their sticks and buttons lick balls.
i will admit sucks everytime i goto rosa theres not one to game with… but rosa has always been like that…
