Pretty much my sentiments. With the assumed changes they are making to Oni, do you think he’ll have advantage on any matchups? Or is it all just flash…
Last I checked the only useful thing he’s getting is 50 health, if that’s still the case I don’t think he’ll be much better. I know they’re fixing his EX tatsu drop, which is great, but that’s just a bug and doesn’t show up too often.
He doesn’t need stomp crossups or fadc shoryu or better fireballs, either… If they aren’t fixing TC2 on crouchers, giving LP srk proper invincibility for anti-airs, helping out his hurtbox/speed on various normals, or fixing slashes then I don’t think he’s going to be much better.
For TC2 to hit crouchers, would change the game for me. I can live with his fireball/dp/stomp game as it stands currently. Being in love with Oni’s normals, I’d really like to see…
- f.mk even on block.
- cr.mk identical to akuma’s
- f.hp startup brought to 10 (currently 12)
- f.hk startup brought to 9 (currently 10. 8 would be quite generous of Capcom)
I want to use f.hk more. I’ve been getting better with it, but can be still slightly hard to connect even on a good AA read. :-/
In general, all of his footsies could really use some love. Except f+lk, that move is nearly broken… seriously. I’m going to make a video on that at some point, that move is seriously amazing. It’s a shining beacon of hope in his otherwise abysmal footsie game, hahaha.
I agree his fireball/stomp game is fine (fireball game should be bad), his DP “game” is fine mostly, it’s just silly that LP has no upper invincibility (or whatever it has that makes it nearly worthless as an antiair). F+HK I think is fine, buffs would be great I guess but I don’t think it needs them.
St. MK needs to do more damage as a poke / anti-air to fix his footsies. I agree that F+HP needs to be faster-- but it also needs to NOT be a projectile, because that just messes it up.
Seriously though, if you don’t already use f+lk for footsies, it’s amazing.
I would kill for TC2 to hit crouchers, would also love for him to have a better hitbox on f.mk. Of all the things he needs I would say a semi decent way to move forward would be nice since both his dashes are kinda ass.
Yeah, it’s just retarded how that thing is. But then I think about Bison’s cr.lk
I landed 6 consecutive counterhits into stun one time. Been using it more seriously ever since. Oni needs some shit like that though. Everything else he has is fuckery.
Ugh one of the biggest problems with Oni is that he can punish nothing, almost everyone has something that pushes him back too far.
You make me be curious now. Until now I cannot find any reason to use his f+LK because it cannot be cancelable into special or super, does weak dmg and builds little meter. So would you please to share your knowledge about this move ?
And about LP DP, I like the combo LP DP AA and f+HK but because the LP DP has no upper frame invi, it usually trade o_O. So I prefer HP, cr.HP and HP DP now. Hope Capcom will buff his LP DP in 2012.
I use MP SRK for my Anti Airs, it often recovers in time to get the F+HK and it has real invincibility. Would be nice to be able to use LP though :\
For F+LK, the short of it is that it’s one of Oni’s few moves that has a hitbox that extends past his hurtbox (I think the only other move is crouching HP?). This gives it amazing priority and it stuffs all kinds of things from a range that people are normally safe at. Basically it’s like his long-lost footsie move, and it beats (or at least trades with) almost everything except invincible moves. It even catches jumps really well.
50 damage is really good for how much you can spam it relatively safely, and it’s even more on counter hit. The fact that you can’t special cancel it actually doesn’t matter for the purposes you’ll use it. At first I thought that was stupid too, but then I realized how good it really was. Alternating with jabs, F+LK and F+MK can be really hard to beat with anything but a random Shoryuken, and if they do that you can start baiting it.
I’ll go more in depth with it in a lab video at some point, probably.
Actually Oni has a handful of moves that has the hitbox extending beyond the hurtbox if I am reading these images right. His standing and crouching jabs and strongs. Standing fierce as well extends a bit out which is why it is such a good AA move. A few other moves too. The problem is most of them have little to no reach.
You’re right, I should have specified pokes but mentioning cr.HP made that confusing 
His jab and strong do that, but I’ve never found them to have enough range to be very good pokes, really :\ F+lp is pretty good too, but it seems a bit too slow for certain things. The range, speed, and hitbox of F+lk make it really awesome.
Something small i noticed today, kara demon setups not working on cr Abel, could be me doing something wrong tho.
Is there any advice about Gen, Ibuki, Makoto and Sakura match-up ?
I had hard time to deal with them
man, thank you. I got bodied by a sim player at the arcade last night. this will help a lot for next time.
one thing I was having some moderate success with was the demon slam at mid range. with a little rhythm I was able to catch his limbs and get some wakeup pressure going, I was just too inexperienced to incorporate into an overall strategy, but I thought I’d share anyway.
I have a small noob experience when fighting against Dictator (Not sure if it’s still right in high level)
He usually uses LK Light Scissors Kick and after that crLK or stHK/MK to rush you and prevent you from jumping. However, Oni has MK Ground Pound and base on my exp it beat that mix-up very well and only lose by his ex head stomp). I will check more when I have free time but I played some games in Xbox Live and it suprises Bison player alot.(Bison in 2000-4000 BP range, not sure with higher BP Bison)
You doing that GP as reversal or late timed?
Reversal or a very slightly delay.
I checked yesterday (Only in 10 minutes because I was tired)
MK GP defeat crLK, stHK, stMK, can recovery and block Devil Revers, trade or win Ex Pyscho, lose to ex headstomp and sometimes trade with non-ex headstomp.
If Bison blocks MK GP, he will block in the earthquake range and Oni will safe
However, my input is not good. Need to double check by other Oni:)
Okay I could have sworn that this didn’t work but I’ll test it…
EDIT – there it is, standing LP messes this up. Oh, and so does walking back. We can never touch him >_< I hate this matchup.
After blocking LK scissors from Dictator, if he goes for…
[LIST]
[]Standing LP - All stomps lose, Oni gets hit out of the air on startup
[]Hold back (not down back) - Dictator walks out of range for the LK/MK stomps and can punish them as they both whiff. Will block HK stomp or avoid it as well, depending.
[]Standing HK - gets beat out by LK/MK/HK reversal stomp
[]Standing MK - All stomps seem to beat
[]**Standing LK **- LK/MK stomp win, HK stomp loses
[]Crouching LK / crouch tech - he will block MK/HK stomp and LK stomp will whiff. If he spams crouch tech though he will get hit
[]Crouching MK - depending on timing, stomps whiff then Dictator blocks or Dictator gets hit
[]Crouching MP - all stomps seem to beat
[]Crouching HP - all stomps seem to beat
[]Psycho - LK/MK beat, HK loses
[]LK scissors again - LK/MK stomps usually beat it, but may whiff trade depending on timing/spacing. HK stomp seems to always whiff trade
[]Block - LK stomp whiffs (and then can be punished). MK stomp should end up being spaced such that it is safe. HK stomp is safe of course
[/LIST]
[INDENT=1] [/INDENT]
Also keep in mind that this is assuming a fairly close LK scissor (off of a normal block string). I would imagine that this is all less effective after a far-spaced LK scissors. I didn’t have time to test that, though.
Regarding Dictator standing LP - This means if Dictator does standing LP after we block his LK scissors, he will hit us out of stomps. If we block, he can go into a LK scissors blockstring again. So basically back to square one for us and a crappy guessing game that we can only beat with extremely unsafe shoryuken guesses. So we just keep blocking and suffering against Dictators who know this. If they don’t know this though… seems like this could be really useful.
**Regarding walking back **- This is very likely, even low level Dictators will probably figure this out. Just hold back, the stomp whiffs, and then they get a free punish. Easy, free damage. If we do nothing, they are back in perfect footsie range and we can’t touch them again.
Still a terrible matchup and one of our worst, but at least we have the gimmick of knowledge at this point
Matchup list updated for:
Akuma
OK I need to know a few things. Is the wakeup for every character the same amount of frames (besides Adon) or all have different wake up frames?
Next. I been playing Oni more in 2012 cuz he is alot more fun and I love to combo his air demons. But here are some matchups I understand and some I need help with. But I mained Akuma since SF4 vanilla edition so I will use some of my knowledge using it with Oni.
First thing is what I understand then following up I dont understand per character.
Oni’s main strength I noticed is diagonal spacing. He has the best control in jump ins where he can counter with an attack that hits diagonally. Vertical counters he only has his cr.HP which is not much but its very fast. DP… ummm forget about doing the old Ryu trick of lp dp to combo cuz it trades always which is ridiculous.
Abel:
[LIST=1]
[]Grab rolls on reaction.
[]B.mp on reaction if he doing a full screen roll due to the active frames of his b.mp
[]f.Mk stuffs his wheel kick clean if you start it before he does the move and beats ex. clean but you are susceptible to cmd grab
[/LIST]
Guile:
[LIST=1]
[]If you can read a boom before it comes out. Whip out a HK Tatsu for a mid screen punish.
[]Mk Slash works extremely well but try to mix it cuz it will not always work and is an easy grab for Guile
[]Hp Srk beats flash kick reads clean.
[]Use Air Dash to Ex Tatsu over his head to confuse the charge of his booms but be careful of Flash Kick.
[]Force Guile to go in the Air for eazy st.HP counter. Trades with his HK so 50/50
[/LIST]
Zangief
[LIST=1]
[]Space the F**K out of him.
[]Use HP Slam only on his wake up and Jump back because -1 on block and beats Lariat clean.(Becareful of his forward dash under to SPD/Ultra or U2 wakeup)
[]Dont use F.MK easy SPD punish.
[]He beats a Jumpin HP which oddly Akuma beats his lariat clean. Dunno why…?
[]Mix up lk. slash to close distance making it whiff and grab and start a zoning game with FB and punish with f.HK to push him back to the edge of the screen.
[]Space right when he has EX bar. Green Hand is painful
[*]DONT GET KNOCKED DOWN!
[/LIST]
Sagat:
[LIST=1]
[]Mp. Slash on reaction for Fb for an easy knockdown to a mixup.
[]Never charge FB’s
[]Mix the electric fireballs to confuse Sagat to either waste bar, n.jump so u can close in the distance respectively.
[]cr.mk his tiger knees, it whiffs completely and then punish with target combo 2 or just do it SRK or a reaction with a Demon. (Havent tested it but from what I used from Akuma it works with his Demons)
[*]Try to close the distance so you can play close-mid screen against sagat.
[/LIST]
Ibuki:
[LIST=1]
[]Do not ex or mp slash her kunais! (They arent considered projectiles…)
[]Wait Ibuki out and use FB’s sparingly,
[]Mostly vortex Ibuki with Target Combo 2 to Mk ground pound. If you read her wakeup dp. Mk Ground pound for a safe whiffed cross up.
[/LIST]
T.Hawk
[LIST=1]
[]n.Jump mp is your best friend. (Just watch out when T.Hawk has EX)
[]Play safe. Punish Condor dives with F.Hp but do nothing but block and stay in position against an ex. dive.
[]HK Ground pound so you dont get SPD’d for an easy backdash or jump back( respect his U2)
[*]Watchout for Condor Spire. Beats most normals clean and ex spire trades with n.jump mp.
[/LIST]
Balrog:
In corner always do a punish with HK Tatsu follow up with a TK Demon.
Save bar in this matchup.
I dont know the rest its a hard matchup.
Now what I dont understand…
DJ?
How to fight an aggro DJ and a turtle one? What are Onis safe options?
Cammy…
How come her air canon strike crosses up Oni? Why does it look like a cross up but hits him forward? I react visually to what it looks like and its usually the opposite happening…
Rose?
Talk about #2 most annoying matchup for Oni after DJ. Should I keep blocking vs her soul spiral block string or is there a way to punish it? What is her frame traps so I dont stupidly attack after it and just cr.tech?
Chun Li…
What to do vs this matchup? Why does cr.HP whiff Chun in the air like she has no hitbox below her waist?
All I can say is Oni has bad footsies with his cr.mk. The hitbox is retarded small and most attacks hit him while other shotos are safe and make attacks whiff…
Other than that my Oni is solid but I do lose control of myself in patience and want to fight without fireballs or play full on in your face rushdown or get an in your face beat down by some other characters. Other than that yeah… solid…