"Survey says!" Oni Match-up Thread

Abel

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]

Adon

Spoiler

Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming soon)
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[]B-MP, Gohadoken (behind his attacking foot), F.HP stuffs non-Ex J.T. and trades with Ex. J.T.
[/LIST]
[LIST]
[
]S. Hp stuffs non-Ex. J.T. and loses to Ex. J.T.
[*]Punish HK J.T. with HP DP, if tricked into MK J.T. then punish with Ex DP
[/LIST]

Akuma

Spoiler

FBs:
[LIST]
[]Don’t Use them in this Match ever
[/LIST]
Offensive Tips:
[LIST]
[
]Play extremely patiently only pushing for damage using blockstrings and hit confirms.
[]Chase his teleports with Dashes and Demon Slashes (Plz test this)
[/LIST]
Defensive Tips:
[LIST]
[
]Be paitent and remain within mid-range if needed jump & dash to create space.
[]Above all avoid being knocked down
[/LIST]
[LIST]
[
]Use Hard/soft reads to dismantale their Demon Flip Methods
[]Don’t FADC or Srk his Dive kicks.
[
]St. HP can be used in countering Demon flips
[/LIST]

Balrog (Boxer)

Spoiler

Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)

Blanka

Spoiler

Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[]Lk.Stomp crosses up U1, however be sure to block correctly
[
]Punishing blocked blanka balls with Fwd. Fierce
[]Lk. Stomp trades with wakeup electricity
[
]Cr. lp stops blanka balls
[/LIST]

C.Viper

Spoiler

Close Combat/Footies

Zoning/FS

Dee Jay

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
Dhalsim

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[]Get a knockdown then rush him
[
]lp. srk will beat yoga sniper

[/LIST]
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[*]B-Mp Kills most pokes
[/LIST]
[/details]
Dudley

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
El Fuerte

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[*]SRK when he comes back from a wall jump

[/LIST]
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
E. Honda

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[]Don’t use ANY FB while he has U1 it will miss him
[
]nj.mp stuffs headbutt.

[/LIST]
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming soon)
[/details]

Evil Ryu

[details=Spoiler]play completely SAFE
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[
]Use st.short>fb to stuff his cr.forward
[]E.Ryu U2 can punish a blocked Ex. Demon Slash
[/LIST]
Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[
]Don’t use F.Hp vs his fbs
[/LIST]
[/details]
Fei Long

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[]St. Hp Stuffs all chicken Wingz
[/LIST]
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[
]St. Jab of block Rekka
[*]St. HP punish ALL JUMP INS
[/LIST]
[/details]
Gen

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
Gouken

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
Guile

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]

Guy

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
Hakan

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
Ibuki

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
Juri

[details=Spoiler]Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[]Punish Mk,HK,Ex pimwhieel with st.short>HK Tatsu
[
]Most of her jump ins are punishable with cr. Fierce.
[]Poke with safety (That’s what she said)
[
]St. Hp stuffs divekick
[/LIST]
Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[*]Bait Divekicks with fbs
[/LIST]
[/details]
Ken

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[]KEEP HIM THE FUCK OUT
[
]Zone with regular fbs only
[/LIST]
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[]Don’t try to attack him on wake up.
[
]Watch out for the Fwd. MK AVOID IT AT ALL COSTS
[/LIST]
[/details]

Makoto

Spoiler

Coming soon

M. Bison (Dictator)

[details=Spoiler]Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[]Vortex bison while he doesn’t have meter Ground Pound. If he has meter then be cautious.
[
]If you block a scissors kick then retaliate with either St.Lk or B-MP. On Ex Scissors kick use TC2>MK Ground Pound.
[]Punish Ex. Psycho crusher with fwd. fierce or Ex Slice
[
]Neutralize the headstomp by blocking first strike which on second it SRK, Jumping Lk. Tatsu or Jumping Mp.
[]Ground pound kills Drill, scissors kick, slide, HK, etc
[
]Bait stomp using Lk. Srk
[]Mix slice into blockstrings to kill charge time
[/LIST]
Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[
]Make bison come to you using fbs then reset.
[/LIST]
[/details]
Oni

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming Soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming Soon)
[/details]
Rose

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming soon)
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[]Most of her normals beat out Oni’s
[
]Attack her weak wakeup
[*]Rushdown down her defense, but zone her offense.
[/LIST]
[/details]
Rufus

[details=Spoiler]*Dp on reaction
Zoning/FullScreen
(Coming soon)
Close Combat/Footies
(Coming soon) [/details]

Sagat

Spoiler

Full screen/zoning
Avoid Fb wars, but if needed get involved with them only when Sagat doesn’t have meter.
If you choose to fb war then pressure Sagat in to either jumping or wasting meter

Close/footies
Respect his srk when he has two bars due to his followup
Use c.mp -> target combo 2 -> HP DP to punish or end with HK tatsu

Vega (Claw)

[details=Spoiler]Zoning/FullScreen
Coming soon
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[*]Sky high claw can be punished by Fwd+Hp
[/LIST]
[/details]
Yang

[details=Spoiler]Hit&Run, Dp on reaction, mostly the same as yun Matchup
Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[
]Don’t fb too much, because rolling kicks will punish you
[/LIST]
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[]Hp Dp kills Foot Dp
[
]Dp will kill Palm
[/LIST]
[/details]
Yun

[details=Spoiler]Dive Kick Counter- Cr.MP, MK, or St. Hp
Dragon Punch on Reaction
Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[
]Only fireball on his palm attack .
[
]Use Electric fireball to shutdown palm meter building
[]Zone with projectiles and pokes
[/LIST]
Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[
]RH Demon Palm on Yun’s Wakeup
[]Dragon Punch stuffs Lunges and Shoulders. Same for ex Lunge ,but Ultra is the most powerful option.
[
]Wakeup Dragon punch or Ex Dragon punch if he tries to palm your wakeup
[]Grab mistimed Dive Kicks and blocked non-ex Lunge punches
[
]Lp. Stomp or Ex Stomp predicted cmd grabs
[]St. Lp stuffs divekicks and nonex lunges
[
]Use Pokes sparingly

[/LIST]
[/details]
Zangief

[details=Spoiler]Close Combat/Footies
[LIST]
[]Use Hadoukens and Normals to zone and mix in air dashes.
[/LIST]
Zoning/FullScreen
[LIST]
[
]Make him fear your lk. Stomp on his wakeup lariat
[*]Mix in throws and blockstrings when he starts blocking or dashing. (Up for argument)
[/LIST]
[/details]

Who or what is Servey?

It’s a cult. I’m currently a level 5 Laser Servey. Join us!

Excellent post. I’m glad more people are getting in on the match-up conversation.(Where are all the other Oni’s?)

Anyway. Let’s see…

Your first B scenario. You said that you could neutral jump or ex.tigershot to neutralize the non-charged 2 and 3-hit fireballs, right? Well that’s exactly what you want Sagat to do.

If sagat neutral jumps, then he’s allowing Oni to move in. If Sagat ex.tigershot’s then he stops any forward movement and he also stops the 3-hit fireball, but he ends up losing meter. So, as you see, Sagat either has less breathing room or less meter.

But to be honest, i haven’t played any fireballs wars against sagat’s recently. All of the seem to choose to avoid it. Even when i was watching the recent Team Spooky 3v3 (or 2v2?) that same thing seemed to happen when Sanford’s Sagat and ChrisHu’s Oni fought. It seems like it might be a problem for both players and choosing to avoid it might seem like better route. Any thoughts on that?

I fought a few sagats again and can semi-confirm that. it seems like, if you go in right at the beginning its less likely that they start a fireball war, in case they can get space between you and them. you can provoke a fireball by walking back a bit (like max range of HK tigerknee) and net a nice jump-in combo. i doubt experienced players would fall for that though.

Ok so…Makoto. Tough. Very tough. Getting bodied. Consistently.

Can’t seem to counterpoke anything. Having a hard time AAing her axe kick and breaking her various cr.LK xx LP Hayate pressures. Anyone making any progress with this matchup?

mpdp and hpdp should work for AA, not sure what part of AAing youre having trouble with though. i know you said axe kicks but i didnt think it was too bad.

also st.lk xx hk tatsu midscreen OS is good in this matchup. they try to dash in and get clipped. her low fwd beats your st.lk but you may be able to whiff punish the low fwd.

Got you. I’ve been mostly trying to use my normals to AA. I’ll see how I fair with DP. And I’ll work that OS in along with putting some attention on the low forward. Thanks dude.

My bad, didnt see my thread up there so i ended up makin another 1,West is there way a to delete ur own thread

How does he fare against Yun? I figure his high damage and good normals should give him possibly the best match out of the shotos.

I’ve been using Oni lately and after the initial joy of using him, I hit a rough patch where I was having a hard time in most of my matchups. I feel like I’m doing better now and this is what I found.

The most important part of his game is patience. I want to throw fireballs and use Zanku to get in but those options are semi-easily read without a great payoff. Also, the EX slash game is next to dead for me, I need to spend some time in training mode and get the meaty timing down, but even then, I feel like people have been hit by it SO much that it will simply become less and less effective over time. I have found some success using it against fireballs.

Otherwise, you simply have to outfootsie your opponent. He gets great damage in close from cr.lp hit confirms, and has two great midrange normals in f.hp and f.mk. Once they start to focus them, approach with lk slash, or mk slash if they focus backdash. Once you have them in that situation where you have broken focus and they just wait, then you can open up his fb game. If you’ve mindraped your opponent enough they will feel lost because in their head it was expected that they were just going to punish bad fireballs and whiffed dp’s all day for an easy win.

Great input here peeps!

Here’s my contribute regarding Dhalsim Matchup.

If u want to win on this u have to adapt really quick, u have to test how the dhalsim player plays that matchup and very important…STAY COOL! Dont go madly chasing a Dhalsim, it will hurt and u’ll crack, hence, doing mistakes which will cost u the match. Play it cool, u need patience to win this one.

I often start the round with a c.lp, c.mp or l.srk, both of those options beat the fastest of Dhalsim’s limbs: s.lk and c.lp. Then see how he reacts and act accordingly, using c.lp a lot at limbs range always makes the Dhalsim player to think twice before stretching them out. Dont play the fireball war with Dhalsim, ur’s have slower startup and mediocre recovery, letting u open to a s.hp CH, so stop throwing fireballs within Dhalsims s.hp range.

Your objective is to slowly push Dhalsim to the corner, block those fireballs while moving forward, use m.slash to pass through(dont abuse this or u’ll get punished), jump over if its safe to. Another key point is to use Focus really well, srsly it helps alot to pressure dhalsim and making him afraid of using the limbs, Yoga Sniper(j.hp) - which u can focus > dash forward > f.hp to punish it. If u r able to focus crumple an air limb dash forward and l.srk it. Condition the best u can the Dhalsim player, a Dhalsim who cant throw limbs at his will is a Dhalsim falling into defeat.

In this matchup i try to knock the Dhalsim down the minimum possible, even hard knockdowns, because even if u OS on the Dhalsims wake up u prolly wont guess the teleports direction right, which can lead to a wiff punish from the Dhalsim part, but this imo ofc. So i use a lot […] xx l.slash (use OS CrouchTech after the slash to prevent getting thrown), it keeps the Dhalsim on his feet, decreasing a lot his chances to teleport safely, if he does teleport punish with s.hp/focus/srk - i prefer s.hp much more realiable. In the corner he’s preety much done, if u condition him real good in the corner there’s not much he can do, by punishing the teleports he’ll try to mummy/drill out of the corner, punish those attempts. If he manages to get out of the corner, repeat the process till he’s in the corner again.

If u have the life lead SEAT ON IT! Let him come to u, he’ll be forced to take risks and u can manage to punish/stop those attacks from him. When safe - by safe i mean out of s.hp range, if not u’ll be punished of ur way down by s.hp due to the recovery of j.214MK - use j.214MK over the fireballs to build some meter or neutral jump.

If u get caught on the throw > dash forward > ultra1 setup u have two choices(u can also ex.srk but most of the Dhalsims are aware of this due to ryu and company ex.srk escape):

A - ex.slash through it, but this isnt safe, because u can get the slash stuffed by a c.lk/s.mk, but if the Dhalsim player is not experienced with the match up u may catch him off guard leading to big dmg inc, or if u feeling lucky go for b.mp xx h.slash reset(i do use this quite often :P);
B - if u dont have super bar/have hp to take the chip and dont want to expose urself…u have the good ol’ block option. Its important that u get these setups down, so u can block correctly and prevent eating with the ultra dmg.
Setup#1 - c.lp/L.slide > Yoga Sniper(j.hp) - block it low then high;
Setup#2 - Yoga Sniper - block high;
Setup#3 - j.forward.lp - block high.

Of course these arent all the options they have to break ur block, but so far these are the most common, but now u know some setups u may have to face and u can react accordingly to the situation.

Hope i’ve helped someone, i know many of this stuff by playing with a great Dhalsim player since SF4 vanilla days, we lvl’ed up together. I could be so much better if i stoped being a “jack of all trades” a while ago, thank god i have Oni now :stuck_out_tongue:

Remember, play this match cool headed, u have the comeback factor, Dhalsim does not. Life lead = sit, let him make the mistakes u want, pressure bit by bit, in the corner dont knock him down and u probalby will have the upper hand in the end. Good luck tho, these out be memorized in a slap of fingers :slight_smile:

Anyone else finding Makoto to be one of his tougher matchups? I can usually keep her out for awhile, but once she gets in I feel like Oni has limited options.

I swear I have trouble with dan, am i the only one? some help on this matchup’d be appreciated

what problems do you have with him?