Actually I like Hakan’s footsies. Toward+lk buffer hp slide gives him a fast, damaging, hard knockdown footsie normal with a hitbox that beats Ryu cr mk etc. Crouch lp buffer lp slide gives him a similar kind of thing with a different hitbox that beats, for example, Dictator st hk. St mp, cr mp, and toward+mk are all also fast with good hitboxes too, and the super beefy hitboxes on st hp and toward+hp were made even better (although those moves are still pretty laggy). And when you bring in oil, Hakan does really well against any character with 1-hit pokes: focus dash through, dnc cr mk or toward+lk xx hp slide. Hakan’s dry footsies were just ok in Super because he had to use laggy cr mk and toward+mp for buffers, but now with cr lp and toward+lk that problem has largely been addressed. His problem is that he’s still crappy when on the defensive while dry.
The fact that Hakan always needs to oil up turns people off of him, in SSF4. His frame is pretty big so he’s easy to hit which is also a problem too. He has no anti airs other than U1, so he need to take hits, or just block. I think the unique aspect of this character made him weaker.
Hopefully in AE, he won’t suck as much.
hakan’s grounded AA isn’t anything special but he has the fastest air grab in the game + super buff air-to-air normals (which can lead into slide + press knockdown oki).
well u obviously dont know shit lol
I’d agree with you about Vega wholeheartedly, but the nerf to his DF+HK is a pretty big blow. Does it make him a worse character? Keeping the cr.mk buff in mind I can’t say for sure however, his rise in the tier lists during Super has been put on hold. Not to say he can’t be GOOD, but I Think I speak for more than just myself when I say that AE Vega is gonna take a while to get used to. I expect him to make some noise, but not now. Barring Makoto returning to playing or someone gdlk picks him up.
That’s why they need to leave the god damn game alone, so we can actually learn these characters. >____>
What happened to Makoto anyway?
He went home to be a family man.
Not possible. The time to have said such things was in Super.
With Cosmic Heel being this unsafe shit gone easy access to 250 damage is gone, and with cr.mk being 6 frames instead of 8 one his main footsie tools cr.mk - cr.mp xx EX FBA is gone now (used to be able to do it off a standing position). He is all defensive single poke character now, who is going to get big damage of players mistakes (And we are back to Vanilla Vega). Unless they fixed all of his hit boxes which I doubt it. His move the tier list was because Japan discovered (Mainly Makoto) the power of Cosmic Heel and the great fix they did on his beyond shitty hit boxes. The rest of the world believed Vega’s best move was cr.mp and he was a run away character (shit still makes me laugh).
Jai is right, Vega won’t be the same, but unlike him I don’t have my fingers crossed for Vega.
man I thought we went over this before. if you want to do cr.mk, cr.mp xx ex fba in a footsie situation you just do the cr.mk slightly later and it makes no difference but now you have a buffed cr.mk for other situations.
also gg earlier, I was surprised my meaty combo dizzied you, but I guess you had no mask.
Rememvber I said because of the wait it really is a 10 frame start up move, not 8. Unless they fixed his cr.lp and cr.mp hit boxes then I really don’t care for one more one frame unplinkable combo, but you know Capcom they nerf and buff the wrong stuff. Waiting 4 frames in front of your opponent at that range doing nothing is to much of a viability. As for the stun combo, I was counting stun, I did not expect for the counter hit to do that much stun. we should play again under better circumstances. GG’s though.
And is that Long Beach? Is it by the North, west, south, or east side? Im on the north side.
sometimes 13 stun makes a difference I guess. That combo does 310 normally though which isn’t that bad.
East side.
That’s cool. We should play more often.
Can anybody explain to me why Sagat is #7 on the list? I don’t see it. He got 1 buff on TU, and his TS game is still the same from Super. Is his position just based on his bad match ups getting slightly easier. Or is he up there because he really got something worth while?
Yeah, Sagat jumping so far seems strange, but I don’t know exactly who are his bad matchups anyway.
After playing AE earlier today, I think Rose would be low tier, possibly low-mid at best. AE is centered around offense, and she doesn’t really excel in that category. Actually, I think she’s more suited for playing defensively. She can pressure well with Spirals, but they have to be spaced pretty well, or otherwise, she’s going to get punished. With her U2 nerf, she’s very vulnerable to pressure as she was in Vanilla. Since more characters are designed to be for rushdown (i.e. Makoto, Fei-Long, etc.), she now has a harder time against a significant amount of the cast. I wouldn’t be surprised if some of her 5-5 match-ups in Super, are now uneven.
Perhaps Sagat was still very good in Super but not many people were willing to take the risk of saying so.
Now that the arcade edition is out and you’re seeing a reasonable number of Sagats reaching the top ranks…
sagat was around B rank in ssf4 console, which means hes pretty damn good and pretty viable.
all the charge characters got nerfed and he stayed pretty much the same, and hes good vs the twins and rest of team dive kick.
afaik, the tier for ssf4 console was akuma, team dive kick, charge characters, abel. then sagat, ryu, rose, etc.
being that sagat was like fringe top 10 or top 15 at worst in console - and characters dropping down such as guile, honda, seth, boxer, ryu - he goes up overall.
I am more surprised that no one talks about C. Viper being so highly rated (once again) by the Japanese. Top 5? I think for once, I might agree with them.
Although some of her bad matchups are still bad (think Honda, Blanka, Boxer) and she may have potentially more bad matchups with characters like Yun and Yang or those that received big buffs, a lot of her matchups should have become easier. For example Rufus with U2, Dictator and Rose. Damage nerfs on Abel certainly helps. Not sure yet about Zangief and Cammy, but these also look a little bit easier. Ken and Fei Long will probably still run over her once they get in.
Apart from that, well she is still the same. Still a shitload of damage/stun, scary mixups and mobility with decent zoning. I think she still goes even or flat out beats lower tier characters and has somewhat good matchups against Akuma and Sagat.
Do people agree with her being placed so high in AE? Of course with AE being a ‘faster paced’ game and favoring offense some more, it certainly seems like she may have a chance to sit in top tier, for now.
i dunno man but from what I’ve seen, your idea of how to play Vega and how Vega is actually played effectively are not the same
I think she’s up there, but I don’t think she’s gonna be top 5. Some of her bad matches got better (though I don’t think Dictator and Rufus are gonna be that much easier for her), but she might’ve got some new bad matchups. She might not do that well against Makoto now, for example.