Well shit. I mean idk.
I don’t SPD too much with Gief but the range buff being unoticeable is lame
I pretty much knew people were exaggerating. A few pixels CANT make up for no footsie KD’s.
dont take daigo’s words as laws
He once said Zangief’s only bad matchup is Sagat in SF4.
You think that’s true???
LOL
when japanese say bad matchup it usually means 7-3. Can’t be so sure what they are really saying unless you understand japanese yourself
I think learning to use U2 to punish holding up back is going to be really important in AE. If people are just holding up back after EX hand you have to be reliably punishing it, and that seems like the best option.
Surely you can punish that if they do it everytime. That is in no way a free get out of jail free card.
From UltraDavid’s twitter:
Gief sucks though dunno what Daigo is smokin
I just saw that and was coming here to mention it. I must say that I trust UltraDavid’s word a little more when it comes to Gief. Plus my own intuition it that his buffs aren’t going to fully make up for the EX Green Hand nerf.
I can’t even tell that the range on LP SPD has been buffed. I’ve seen it whiff when it looks like it was just BARELY outside the normal range, so it must have been increased just a tiny, tiny bit. But I can tell that the damage has been buffed, it seems to do about 190 now, maybe even 200.
I’m curios to know how much does now HP version,i was thinking 240 (is 230 in SSF4),but somebody said that now is “awesome”… 250? O_O
I can only find 1 HP SPD in the current footage and as far as I can tell it’s at least 240. I’m trying to find out by the looking at the life loss that it causes on the life bar, finding the percentage of the life bar, and then multiplying that by the total life of the character getting SPD’d (also taking into consideration damage scaling for when a character has less life). It sounds way more complicated than it is, it’s mostly just copy/pasting a few images. It’s kinda hard becasue the cameras are kinda shaky and it’s hard to tell e
Anyway, the most conservative estimate I can make is 243 damage. Since that’s obviously not the exact amount, I’d say it does at least 240 and very possibly 250.
Also, I think (but I’m not sure, again it’s hard to tell) that EX Green Hand damage increased from 130 to 140.
Hard to tell from what since it’s Zangeif, player might have been throwing out few too many sweeps.
[media=youtube]ZyxOJ-rTM-4[/media]
ex green hand knocking down on counter hit
The jab SPD range I saw in that video looked like that of a far reaching sweep. Looked at least a full square in training mode (used to be a bit more than half?). If it really is that good, imagine the empty jump possibilities…
PS. Is he supposed to get his knockdowns by doing random-ass punishable EX Hands?
New SPd range is dope
It does look like it might be SLIGHTLY more. I believe it is currently 5 small squares (1 big square) away. So maybe it’s 6 small squares in AE? I think everyone needs to readjust the way they play gief now in that instead of just getting that knockdown, you need to push your opponent into the corner. That’s why you can fully apply pressure. If they gave gief his sweep from ST as his regular sweep that you can combo into from jabs, that would have been sweet… If they wanted him to play more like old gief, that’s what they should have done when they took away KD with EXGH.
Currently it’s 5.5 small squares in my experience, and when I say a full square I mean a big black outlined one that’s the size of a character space. The 5 small squares line to me is a half-square.
Look again at 0:29 and 1:15, pausing just the moment before the SPD animation begins to see the distance he is grabbing from. It’s big. Looking again myself; a full square was an over-estimate, but it probably isn’t far off from 7 (give or take) small squares.
I noticed that (it’s about 1 minute in for anyone wanting to see). Do we know yet if it’s techable or not?
Cr lk to cr lk link seemed easier, but I dunno man, some days in Super I hit that easily and some days I have trouble, so it could still be 1-frame links and I just happened to be on my game. Hope the links are easier.
Ryu couldn’t punish far st mk on block. It doesn’t look like st mk is any faster to retract though, so that might be more due to changes to Ryu’s dp than to Gief’s far st mk, like maybe it has less range or something. Would be sick if st mk was safer on block in general. Other normals seemed the same.
I tried u2, but the one time I used it, I landed it, so I didn’t get a chance to see what they meant by saying you can control it.
But screw that. What are Gief’s most important moves? Ex green hand, spinning pile driver. And they’re both way worse.
I want to scream that ex hand sucks, but I have to remind myself it doesn’t suck, it’s just way way worse than before and even now it’s still pretty decent. Sigh. When you buffer lp/lk into ex hand in footsies, the ex hand will still hit, but it leaves you so far away from the opponent that you literally can’t hit him with any of your quick normals (sweep probably hits but… whatever, sweep still sucks) or grab him with spd. Obviously, that’s terrible, it means Gief’s footsies are much less threatening than before, and it means opponents won’t have to be as cautious when playing against Gief in the midrange game. It does knock down on counter hit, but since it’s still very unsafe on block, you’re still not gonna be throwing it out there randomly getting counter hits too often. And when you combo into ex hand, which is the only situation where you’re in mixup land after it, sure, you get some limited mixups. As we all expected, those mixups are much worse than the ones that were available on knockdown.
Spd is also worse. But, the damage and range buff, you say! Extra damage is nice, we actually didn’t notice it but I assume it’s there. As for jab spd range buff, I had my opponent crouch block and I did 3 low jabs, jab spd. It worked… but it did before. Then I tried 4 low jabs, jab spd… and it did not work. So whatever range increase jab spd got it, it’s not all that significant. The real issue is that after spd, land, jab green hand, you now have almost no frame advantage. Gief waits so much longer after landing from spd that I missed my jab hand timing the first few times I tried it, the timing is that different. It seemed like my jabs/shorts were coming out at the same time as the opponent’s. In fact, it was so obvious that I had Ryu try a reversal dp just to see if I could even block it (I could). In some vid I saw Zangitan do spd then dash toward, and I was like, why dash toward instead of jab green hand? Well, because jab green hand just doesn’t leave you in a very good position anymore. So man, frickin spd better do more damage, because without those post-spd meaty mixups you’re effectively losing out on a lot of damage potential. And that sucks.
I think Daigo is 100% wrong about Zangief. I still don’t think he’s bad; his design in the 4 series is too strong for that. But he is obviously, noticeably worse. It’s great that his bad matchups got worse, but considering that Gief got worse too it’s kinda hard to say whether Gief will actually do better in those matchups. And since lots of his good matchup characters got better, he’s not gonna have as many good matchups as before anyway. Might be kind of an uphill battle for Gief players, guys.