Well they still got their divekicks while Cammy’s divekick will/seems to be useless…
if you follow this thread, you will know alot of players want to which to Yun or Yang if cammy doesn’t have low dive kick anymore.
Just wondering what you can do with canon strike if it is only possible on max height? Isn’t that move even minus on hit?
Buffing recovery frames on her normals DOES NOT make them better normals… They just made it easier to combo with but still NOT GOOD for footsie pokes. Her normals, outside of her lights, are mediocre due to long startup and short active frames. To make her normals better, they need to tweak the startup and active frames in conjunction with the recovery frames.
Ryu’s cr.MK (one of the best pokes in game)
5 startup, 5 active
Sakura’s cr. MK is also quite good
5 startup, 4 active
Chun’s OK cr.MK
5 startup, 3 active (less active made it not as good as Ryu’s)
Cammy’s slightly below average cr.MK
6 startup, 4 active (that startup pretty much made it inferior even to Chun’s version).
With the above example, you can see, buffing recovery just made it easier to combo with but NOT better in terms of footsies. If you CANNOT land the hit to begin with, what good is it to have a “better” recovery?
List of SSF4 Arcade Edition changes for five cast members : News : EventHubs.com
? Close and Far Standing Light Punch recovery time decreased.
? Close Standing Medium and Hard Punch recovery time decreased.
? Crouching Light and Medium Punch and recovery time decreased.
? These changes give Cammy more frame advantage with her Normals.
How about some speculations?
Let?s say that every normal mentioned gets +1 (the minimal change), so that means the following 1 frame links might be possible:
- Far LP into crouch MP
- Crouch LP into crouch MP
Important 1 frame links become 2 frames instead:
- Close LP into close MP
- Close HP into cr. LK
That?s if the normals just get +1. However, they might get even more frame advantage.
You are incorrect here. Recovery in SSFIV actually means almost as much as startup. And when poking it actually means more (especially hitbox on recovery). I know it sounds stupid, but that’s true. I don’t have time to explain now (I’m working), but I will either till the end of this or maybe next week.
Ryu lost active frames on his cr mk poke btw.
how to fix “overpowered” tkcs: remove abel from the game
cannon strike has a minimal height to be activated… Does this mean Cammy can’t dive kick until she has jumped past a certain height or that she can’t dive kick at all if its not above the height restriction? i.e. fake empty jumping into delayed dive kick
i’ll refrain from strangling sako until i’ve found out what this minimal height is…
…i was joking about abel
Because that poke was GDLK in footsies, so Capcom want to nerf it a bit (and we don’t know how many active frames will be removed, i guess is at most 1 frames, so it would be 5 startup, 4 active). This proofs my claims about what is consider to be a good normal.
Ryu’s cr. MK is GDLK because of HUUUGE range for a 5 frame cancelable low high-priority move and fast recovery. One less active frame wouldn’t change that much. This isn’t CvS2.
That’s the bit of information that most of us are holding our breath for. Unfortunately, yet again, there’s no specifics on how exactly Cannon Strike is going to be. If only we had a Cammy player from the community who lives in Japan who could get to a loctest and personally test it out…
Somebody posted on this thread who played the location test version. He said that he could only do canon strike at max height and that other players tried it as well and were pissed because it did not work.
Edit
Here is his post:
wait wait,
he said he cant TK strike AND cannot low strike AFTER peak jump later in the arc… so the dude empty jumped and before landing he tried to Strike? right? and this didnt work for him.
DAMN! so no low strikes are possible, the last trial is not possible too
low strike, cl.hp, cs, fadc, cs , fadc, ultra 
so the height restriction is not only early on the jump arc **BUT ALSO **low at the end of the jump.
thats what i understand from his statement. remember english is not even my second language… but this what i can make out of it…
please someone clarify or confirm the meaning of what he said. if i am right or wrong.
my question remains, can we combo from this strike? is there a followup to it?
Di,
Capcom you guys suck ass… I bet they have no real skilled testers or so whatsoever. If they keep nerfing what scrubs tell them to nerf this game will only get worse.
You are right about not being able to strike after “coming down” from a jump, at least that was what Chunner was saying.
So if they do not change the properties of canon strike you will have frame disadvantage even on hit and I believe you will be at such disadvantage that you will get hit by 3frames moves? Don’t even want to think about what ppl can do if they block it… free ultra for some? At least they won’t srk you from the air then because blocking it will net more damage >.>
Ryu - 1.380 range
S-5f | A-5f | R-12f
Unquestionably the best c.mk if you’re only looking at the normal in itself, however Ryu needs EX to put the fear in people of getting it by it, and even at that point the options he has from that isn’t as good as what Cammy or Sakura gets from their meterless confirms due to his okizeme being weaker than theirs. One more point of notice is that while it has the most range, it also places Ryu’s own hitbox closer to the enemy than for example Sakura and Cammy’s does, so while being easier to poke with it’s also easier to get counter poked/whiff punished from further away.
Cammy - 1.335 range
S-6f | A-4f | R-12f
Calling Cammy’s c.mk inferior to Chun’s is just bias, I would GLADLY trade her c.mk for Cammy’s.
Unlike Chun and Ryu it gives her a meterless knockdown that is very easy to confirm in c.mk x SA, it also opens up a chance for her to put her pressure on, which is basically what Cammy wants to be doing all the time. If you’re strictly comparing Cammy to Ryu she also has a much better poking game than he does since she has better pokes to compliment her c.mk with, like st.hk/st.mk/st.mp. Another perk with Cammy c.mk is that it’s only -2 unlike Ryu and Sakura’s that are -3 on block, so against Fuerte you don’t have to stop using it as soon as he’s got u2 since he can’t punish it on block with it. Also out of all c.mk’s, Cammy’s leaves her own hitbox the furthest to the back from what I could tell in the hitbox videos.
**
Sakura - 1.331 range**
S-5f | A-4f | R-13f
Sakura’s c.mk is most likely the best c.mk in the game, the range, speed and hitbox of it are all very good, though not as good as Ryu c.mk, but what really puts it on top of everything else is that it’s easily confirmable into hp sho which gives her a 200dmg knockdown poke that is only -3 on block, if she has 2 bars she can fadc the hp sho and end up at 440dmg~. When I’m playing against a Sakura that can do this I’m much more scared of eating c.mk than I am from eating Ryu’s.
Chun - 1.275 range
S-5f | A-3f | R-11f
Chun’s c.mk sucks in footsies, the range is too short for her to be able to use it, the range of it is very comparable to her c.lk. What it’s used for is that it goes under certain pokes when you’re close enough (like some c.mp’s).
The only matchup I know where c.mk is the go-to poke is against Viper, and that’s because it goes under almost everything she does and leaves Chun on neutral while Viper doesn’t have any 3f normals.
Basically if you’re not doing well with Cammy in footsies it’s not because her footsies are weak, because they’re far from it, it’s because of your own weakness as a player.
c.mp/c.mk/st.mp/st.mk/st.hk gives her a wide spectrum of pokes to use at different ranges. Saying that c.mk is too slow to use in footsies just doesn’t cut it since I and many others for example can react to Ryu c.mk with Chun and punish with c.hk which is 7f.
From what was told in the Yang dev blog Rufus is also getting a height restriction on his divekick (we’ll see if that’s true on next weeks dev blog). So what they’re changing Cammy is from using divekicks up close to using really good frametrap setups to stop people from teching, and she’s still retaining ex dive which will have a higher chance of connecting in AE than a dive up close does in vanilla due to the fact that it will be more unexpected and she has more options to mix it up with all in all up close.
Besides we haven’t seen what the height restriction on it is like yet.
While not being able to input it qcf,uf and get it out low you might be able to input it uf,qcf for example and get it out at shoulder height or something which is the most effective height for divekick to be used anyway.
No… her footsies are actually weak. Sweeping whiffed cr forwards is what you do with footsies in general unless you’re playing like Bison in which case I’m not sure if that works or not… feel free to correct me on that one. When Ryu uses cr forward os fireball even on block it pushes the opponent back into the ideal mid range for ryu to start his nonsense. Cammy on the other hand gets pushed out of her ideal range. Cr and st strong are both slow and short range, in comparison to Ryu who can mash cr strong and have it combo as well as stop attacks, and then there’s chun li’s which I personally think is the most godlike poke in the game. St mk is alright but doesn’t work well since you can’t hit confirm and you’re moved out of your range again. st roundhouse has to be used perfectly otherwise they can move in and activate the close version which is a free punish on block, but the range works alright as an anti air. That’s how I see it anyway.
Connecting with divekick at shoulder height doesn’t give enough hitstun to combo, does it?
It doesn’t unless it’s EX.
I could be wrong, but you have to hit your opponent basically below the belt to get enough hit stun. At shoulder height, Cammy is pretty much free.
So now, Cannon Strike is a peak jump move? Wow. That even makes crossing up with it more restrictive. But why make it a peak jump attack? I mean… really… where’s the pressure in that when you’re up against characters with DPs? It has pathetic block stun at that height. Why make a killer bee prone to being swat when she stings to kill?!
I didn’t say connect at shoulder height, I said activate at shoulder height.
You guys are just too salty to listen to reason I guess.
This made me lol cause it’s more like salt just got into people’s eyes.