@VHSCless , someone actually brought this up to me and I thought it was a good point - why not just use Ryuenjin assist now since you probably won’t have Sougenmu up when you level Frank? I think typically the level up process will use Rekkoha, and that means only one Hadengeki for the assist, which seems like it’s very unreliable for converting into a full combo. That and it’s really low durability; Ryuenjin assist would give you a really good Crossover Counter that could probably be cancelled into Lightning Loops, and you can use it as a really easy extender/save your ground bounce during Frank combos.
I’ve already started thinking up combos for volume 2. Got some more hype stuff in there.
@Fuzzykips Hmm, that is a good point. I know Ryuenjin assist is really good with Dante, but idk about Frank. Plus, What if i’m in a situation where I can’t Rekkoha because of hitstun? I’d be forced to do the Sougenmu to DT Skydance to level up and lose advantage of the double Hadangeki assist. This would mean no Object Toss + double Hadangeki confirms, a good neutral assist to get in with, and i’d lose some combo capabilities. I’ll test out Ryuenjin in the lab and when I play against some of the Indonesian players over here first.
You may be able to do other such confirms and you can definetly set up jump loops and tools L loops with it. Both of which are very nice.
I havent tested it specifically with that assist, but I assume you can do the confirms as follows:
Level 1: cMsHxxQCB+L with Zero hitting in between to link the sH to the QCB+L (I do it with Deadpool in my video)
Level 3: cMsHxxSRK+L with Zero launching them then TK QCF+L QCF+L jMcMS > whatever
Level 5: cMsHxxQCF+L with Zero making them airborne before the QCF+L then do the loops
Should work. Its a great way to build damage with Frank.
Not exactly to the point of the conversation, but I was under the impression that Rekkoha xx DT, teleport, Skydance, hard tag was immune to HSD? I don’t play Zero though, so I could be wrong. Only suggesting that because you said you do Rekkoha, DT, tag, Knee Drop and that seems kinda rough in certain situations. I’m assuming Rekkoha’s like SoV where Teleport --> Skydance always does a hard knockdown regardless of character size?
That’s too bad about the Sougenmu delayed sj.S --> tag…I guess it wouldn’t really give you the team order you’re looking for anyway, but still. Was hoping that worked better 
I do kind of agree on the Ryuenjin call just because I can’t see Hadangeki being a great assist outside of Sougenmu…and that is the problem with running Zero/Dante/Frank instead of your original order. Personally, I think Jam Session is so good for Frank that you don’t need the projectile assist. (I say that having swapped Nova for Magneto though, so maybe I can’t talk :P) It would, however, change your playstyle in ways you might not appreciate, but having Ryuenjin for blockstrings, extensions, and most importantly crossover counters seems like a pretty solid situation IMO. The CC aspect could turn into a pretty important asset when it’s clear that even breaking Frank’s pressure and forcing him to block can get an opponent opened up.
I probably Crossover Counter more than most people here with just Frank/Cart, and even thait completely changes the way opponents have to approach locking my Mags or Dante down (with the exception of a few matchups obviously). That shit’s definitely underused, and since Zero can convert without XFactor he’s an excellent candidate for it.
Still, I understand wanting to keep the projectile.
EDIT: @theCape I’m with Fizzy…I don’t know why, I don’t know how…but seeing Deadpool/Frank tech is just fucking hype hahaha. Gimme moreeeeeee!
@Slippaz:
I’m taking notes for part two. Already have about ten things I want to put into it.
@VHSCless:
Can you do the Sogenmu sjS setup into a Dante hard tag, then do something like SRK+M~M (call Zero Ryuenjin) fH(BC) jQCF+H then tag Frank? That would give you Frank, Zero, Dante which is a strong order. I might have to try that if I get some time this evening.
Ryuenjin and Jam session serve similar functions in neutral. Hidankegi give Frank better ground control from mid to full screen. Frank combos hit hard no matter what; I’d personally prefer an (even stronger) neutral game.
Good points here. So its basically do you want a strong XCC or do you want a stronger neutral game? Frankly the Sogenmu powered
Hidankegi is kind of like Spitfire twice but on a better character.
@VHSCless obviously has the best insight on this since it’s his team, but the question I’m asking myself thinking about which assist is “how often do I even block/need to escape via crossover counter when I have chainsaws?” By the time Frank gets in with chainsaws and the opponent’s point character dead, I find he’s almost always the oppressor and rarely the oppressed.
@Slippaz Oh, no. I’m sorry about that Slip. I made that seem very unclear. There are some combo conversions where there’s too much hitstun to do M,M,H,S into Rekkoha (If I do it early in a combo, I would only get like 14-15 hits before rekkoha). So i’m forced to do H,S, sword dive into buster lightning sougenmu unless I have Dante assist available. Plus when you get a combo with Zero, you’re mostly going to take them all the way to the corner. So, I might as well do the sougenmu DT method since i’ve been pretty consistent with it. And yeah, it’s too bad I can’t use the sougenmu s hardtag as much. You have to get a hit confirm near, or in the corner. 
@TheCape I’ll try to see if that works tomorrow. It’s like 4am in Indonesia right now haha. The thing is though is that the sougenmu s hardtag is situational, which I don’t like 
@Zansam @Fuzzykips Yeah, I prefer having the having the hadangeki assist even without the sougenmu power-up. Even without the clones, it still helps him cover the neutral a bit more. I’ve done some tests in the lab with ryuenjin assist. I can still do most of the same combos as I could with hadangeki assist (Although, I can’t do some of my other really cool, optimal combos anymore. :[ ) You pretty much sum up nearly the same damage in combos with the ryuenjin assist as you could with hadangeki assist. If you get clone ryuenjin though, you have to change up your combos a bit. You can also get free confirms off of ryuenjin as well. And I also found out that you could use ryuenjin for the snapshot ffc guardbreak, just like how you can do it with jam session.
[quote=“TheCape, post:311, topic:136808”]
Editing now:
[/quote]This is exactly what I have been missing. Thank you so much! Hitting training mode as soon as I get off work~
About the first point, IIRC can’t you cancel Zero’s air S with Buster? I think you could do d.H, S xx Buster before it connects, then nose dive. But I mean if you consistently get the Sougenmu xx DT level up, do that, haha.
I see what you mean about Hadangeki, even if it’s not optimal it’s still something to cover the ground against characters like Wolverine or Spencer. I think it’s just all up to personal preference.
I wouldn’t go that far; optimal and personal preference have some wiggleroom but there’s instances of a clear difference. I for instance prefer Log Trap over spitfire, but there’s certain matchups where either assist is clearly superior to the other. A good example would be something like Magneto/Drones; spitfire borders on useless (can’t get through drones or disruptor) but logtrap shuts down a lot of the team.
@Fuzzykips Ehhh I think that S makes them fall too fast if you try to hit them with buster after. I’d have to test that to see if it’s true.
@Zansam Oh yeah dude, even though I personally prefer hadangeki, I think I might switch to ryuenjin for some certain match-ups. Even though Jam session and Ryuenjin serve similar neutral purposes, it has a faster start-up than jam and it has a little bit of invincibility on it’s start up as well (Please correct me if i’m wrong on the invinicibility. I’m not sure if it does, but I think it does lol).
All right I tested some stuff out that you guys wanted me to try out.
@Fuzzykips I was right about that, you can’t cancel the buster after you do s in a launch combo (In other circumstances, you CAN buster cancel S if you do it outside of a launch combo).
@TheCape The sougenmu s rawtag into Dante volcano beehive into level up Frank works. But, it ONLY works on the biggest characters in the game it seems (Tron, Nemesis, Hulk, and Sentinel). If you try it on the regular sized/small characters, the volcano beehive only hits them a couple of times and drops them out. I could try to do a quick dash into volcano beehive after the sougenmu s rawtag. But I imagine it would be really, really tight. So maybe it would be a bit impractical.
@VHSCless, something I did with Dante to Frank is called the Deadpool assist to help me link df+H~HHHHH into fH. Can you call the Zero Assist to help that link? Might make it work on more people.
@VHSCless Oh, I meant like… can you cancel the startup of air S into Buster?