Nah man Snake Eyes only won cuz he had aluminnum bat assist. That snake eyes is a cheat, he would hit people with aluminum bats before he played them, he carries it around all the time for intimidation…I demand a ban on aluminum bats along w/ Akuma at least during tournament plays…
I guess I did have one sentence of comparison about Kuni. (So what?) I’ve played Kuni in his prime and Kuni is totally awesome. I talked about Kuni ahead of time to lots of people, explaining that more than anyone, if you make a mistake vs Kuni, you die. He’ll do some safe jump into tricky tick throw that’s hard to get out of, repeat somehow, of basically win off it. I know all about it and have faced it over the years, even on Japanese soil. When I played Snake Eyes, it seemed similar to that, but even stronger. So yeah I guess I did make that comparison, and so what.
One question that a lot of people outside competitive games ask me is “Is there ever a time where a guy from outside the tournament scene shows up and beats everyone?” And I have to tell them that it basically never happens. Partly because it takes going to tournaments to actually become good and partly because tournaments are like a strange beast, and even if you are really good, you can be thrown off by the format or the environment, being like some new guy to it all is pretty rough. There’s a long history of Choi winning stuff, or Valle, or Justin Wong, etc, but not of a guy new to tournaments. THAT is why it is surprising what happened. This kind of thing is super rare and kind of is a miracle. (Again, not even talking about Zangief here.)
I’m dumbfounded that Milo has a problem with my post. I still think you’re having a really shitty attitude Milo, and I don’t know why. I’ll get us back on track.
Point to be made: Snake Eyes is good, also congratulations.
Problems with this: none.
So it wasn’t valid. Dave, I honestly hate to belabor the point, but I think that’s really significant.
If you are going to compare one player to another (and you made a direct comparison), you had better make sure that all the other variables are more or less equal. I mean, you attended MIT, right?
[media=youtube]DFjZV1dnAxk[/media]
What’s going on here is that:
[LIST=1]
[]SnakeEyez (ZA) is roughly at DGV’s (RY) level of competence.
[]Zangief is really good in this game.
[*]Zangief beats Ryu in the character rankings.
[/LIST]
[media=youtube]MseoSZO7hAY[/media]
What’s going on here is that:
[LIST=1]
[]Valle (O.SA) is more skilled than Kuni (ZA).
[]Zangief is one of the worst characters, if not the worst character, in this game.
[*]O.Sagat trounces Zangief in the character rankings.
[/LIST]
That is a lot of really important stuff that is not even close to being equal.
Actually, I don’t have a big problem with your post, Dave. Maybe a little one, in that you were mainly just uninformed (about SnakeEyez’s abilities) and a little starstricken, and understandably probably a little biased, since the venue of competition was a game that you helmed. I’d read your post before Damdai made his remarks, and although I chuckled at your incredulity, it didn’t bother me much.
What gave me the impetus to chime in, here, was getting Damdai’s back against all these “how dare you impugn SnakeEyez” circle jerkers, who appeared not to see the unassailable reasoning in Damdai’s (admittedly inflammatory) post. That I had to make mention of the flaws in your post was just an unfortunate necessity of taking sides, here.
Dude…
Here is a minor mathematical formula I whipped up:
(HDR ‘Gief - ST Gief) + Snake Eyez skill + Practice + Good Matchups For Zangief - Other Contestants Not Playing HDR too much = MOTHA FUCKIN’ WIN.
Word, although DGV and Afrolegends do play HDR a lot – no need to diminish SnakeEyez’s skills, the guy is a straight-up beast.
So in some point did Sirlin really accuse Snake Eyes?
Or:
“I’ve heard a lot of people claim that SnakeEyes has to be cheating somehow…”
http://shoryuken.com/f280/how-exactly-do-cheaters-cheat-227165/
Hypocrisy much?
Damn you Damdai for ever posting in this thread. Really silly thing to do. Bottom line is that HDR is the “NEWER GAME” (compared to ST) and it’s not going back. So…if anything people that have been playing ST have had many many more years of learning strategy that can still be used in HDR. They should technically have the upperhand in converting their experience into this so called “dumbed down” game and should still dominate. If they choose to keep playing ST and keep hurting their HDR skills, that’s just fine i guess, but they have no excuse for sucking at this “dumb” game. If you want to move onto HDR, do it; if you don’t want to move onto HDR, don’t play it mainly only at tournaments and lose to people that actually play the damn game everyday. And then go explain how “he could never have done this in my cool as.s game ST.” Straight silliness.
congrats Snake Eyes, I think I played you on xbox. I think I even got some wins on you, but could be mistaken.
NHC baby, snake eyes is nhc for purposely picking a supposed broken character before they ban him. Hell yeah. I want to see TheGreatMole and snake Eyes fight. Let’s see it.
Haha Milo, you’re a terrible debater. O Sagat is a bad matchup for Zangief, O Sagat rips him apart. If you’re gonna compare R Zangief vs R Ryu, why not compare ST Zangief vs ST Ryu or ST Ken?
[media=youtube]ntZn4LPVRTY"][media=youtube]ntZn4LPVRTY[/media[/media]
[media=youtube]Cqo4hwBD3ec[/media]
Hmmm, seems like Snake Eyez has a lot in common with Jodim’s playstyle. Either way, they both give Ryu and Ken a tough time.
That was my point, smart guy.
Kuni worked Valle (perfect first round, near perfect second round, match over in a jiff) even though he was using the underdog character.
This, vs. the SnakeEyez/DGV match, where Zangief was the favorite (with respect to rankings). (DGV perfected SnakeEyez three times, I think.)
Maybe think it over, rather than jump in here and try to score brownie points for yourself.
So is this confirm that Zangief beats Ryu/Ken in HDR? I always thought it was even in HDR?
As for the Kuni vs Valle, that’s just one video…
Here’s another one
[media=youtube]8WbMnOo669I[/media]
I love how every single HDR based thread on SRK always devolves into semantic double speak, good job SRK!
Where is VF4 and the inevitable long winded post of BS?
*waits for the inevitable
Oh, and great job Snake, that shit was awesome!
You can’t really group Ryu and Ken like that. Ken’s no-safe-jump properties may well make the 'gief’s life harder, and Ken is probably another underappreciated character in HDR.
LOL You still don’t get it. Kuni did beast Valle’s O Sagat, but then what happened to Kuni in this EVO? All I’m saying is keep the debate simple: compare Zangief vs Ryu/Ken in HDR or ST, but keep O Sagat out of it (not only cuz it causes confusion, but also cuz O Sagat is a difficult match for Zangief, but Ryu/Ken are even or advantageous for him). BTW I don’t need/care about brownie points.
You don’t really want that, seriously. HDR got the 2nd highest turnout (300) again this year. If you take out all the people who don’t play HDR regularly but just enter HDR because they know SF2, I don’t know, maybe we’ll get 150 people tops? Top 8 would not have Daigo, Cole, Tokido, Valle…
It is unfortunate that we have two versions that fracture the community as a whole. These people enter HDR because that’s the only SF2 played in a major tournament.
Who cares? Kuni doesn’t play HDR.
I heard he was banned from the HDR section.
It might be true because he never leaves any chance to bash HDR, and he hasn’t posted yet. It’s like crack to him.
I can feel him though…
Lurking this thread… 
“You attended MIT, right?” Milo, cut it out, that is not an appropriate comment to this discussion. I know all about your amazing ability to flame and so on, but leave those comments out, thanks.
Next, being “uninformed about Snake Eyes’s ability” is neither here nor there. Whether I knew about his ability ahead of time or not, it’s still a miracle for anyone to win Evolution as a second tournament they ever attended. Knowing he was good before the tournament started doesn’t adjust the level of miracle. It also doesn’t change the level of amazingness of beating rooms full of good players, all straight in a row. (It was “winner stays and he went around multiple times.”)
But really, the heart of your complaint is my one-sentence, off-handed comparison. If you are really so interested in this, it’s not a comparison of anyone vs Valle or anyone vs DGV. It’s a comparison of each of the players against ME. I know full well how devastating it is to play against Kuni. He taught me that a great number of moves and tactics I considered fine were not really useable against Zangief. Things that are are either unsafe against him or at least give him a chance to guess right and turn the tide. I feel that pressure when facing Kuni and he’s nothing short of awesome.
And when I played Snake Eyes, I felt that same feeling except more. (I’ve played a variety of characters against both). Yes I know Zangief is better now. And yes I know Kuni is out of practice. Whether Snake Eyes pressured me more this year at Evolution, in HD Remix isn’t a question at all. It was like a super landslide in his pressure vs Kuni’s. As a sidenote, know that Kuni knows the changes, he knows about hop, he knows about running grab, etc. He has been translating my 60,000 word changelist or whatever it is into Japanese for the other Japanese players.
Anyway, then I thought about subjectively weighing like how pressured I was in the past when Kuni was more in practice. Answer: Snake Eyes was still more. Then I thought about subjectively factoring in that Snake Eyes has better hop and better running grab and so on. I still seems like Snake Eyes is doing something a bit more magical even in light of all that, but it’s hard to say because of the balance differences. It’s also not really that interesting to say, which is why I shared my thoughts in the form of an off-handed one sentence comment. It’s nothing to get bent out of shape over.
Even though kuni is amazing and awesome, there’s really no question that right now at this moment, Snake Eyes is better at HD Remix than Kuni. That isn’t an insult to Kuni or even surprising (one guy plays tons, other guy has not played much), it’s just kind of clear from playing them. And that is why I got them together and had them talk to each other and share tips and so on. They each have tons of knowledge. I think Snake Eyes explained his setups a bit, I’m not sure, while Kuni explained one of his combos and how he sets up a dizzy. Anyway whatever, carry on.
LOL. I respect VF4 but I have to admit this made me chuckle.
chuckle Was my comment more appropriate or less appropriate than claiming that I have a “shitty attitude”? If you want to have a purely civil discussion, then you need to reciprocate.
Like I wrote, I have no interest in belaboring this issue. If you want to call it a “miracle” when a dedicated player who has long demonstrated his ability beyond a shadow of a doubt wins a major tournament – using a souped-up version of a character who beats his opponents’ characters in the tiers – then be my guest, knock yourself out. As I said, I find that an amusing curiosity, nothing more.
As for SnakeEyez being better than Kuni at HDR, that’s unmentionable (as in, not worth saying). Kuni hasn’t put in one-tenth of the time on HDR that SnakeEyez has. Despite all the low signal-to-noise you’re typing up, it’s really as simple as that.
Duty calls, I’ve got to run. Cheers, all.