because it is compared to diagonal jumping hp/hk, it is.
i’m glad you’re done, 2009 retards should be barred from posting in general.
Nah dude neutral jumping rh is tight. It doesn’t have an angled trajectory so often it’s quite abit safer to test the water with n.j.rh than jumping back/forward with whatever.
In my experience at least it also trades quite abit less, as well as the attack coming out aiming more or less up and forward, meaning that it’s alot easier to hit someone with this on reaction, and by the same token, allows you to activate the move earlier as you don’t have to be beside/above them for the attack to connect.
Yeah. You’ve done your research. It’s an amzing move, and coupled with jump straight up fierce, it beats almost any attempt at air-to-air against Vega if he’s jumping straight up. Ourobouros on the other hand doesn’t know fuck all except that I’m a 2009 retard. That in itself is ironic… a retard who knows more about the game than he does. Keep reppin the 2001 join date!
the only use for his neutral j.hk/j.hp is yet another air to air move. lemme ask, does he really need yet another air to air move? his air to air game is already above average. his 2 air throws are good, his jumping mp is good, so is jumping hp, jumping hk.
a good tactic in the old game where he had his diagonal j.hk/j.hp as a neutral jump was that you neutral jump hk/hp and empty jump up and down in the opponents face mixed up with throw attempts. this was good for baiting throws and and making opponents press buttons since his jumps were so high and fast. the closest analogy i can think of is akin to rufus dive kicks.
you can’t do this with the current neutral jump hp/hk, since there is no downwards reach.
scrub, go back trolling the sf4 forums.
i don’t know what i’m talking about? you’re one of those idiot that thinks the flip kick is fine and needs no improvement.
Put it this way. If you take away his neutral jump hk, you’ve taken away one of his tools to destroy a jump in fairly late in the arch. All Vega would have to fight jump ins are ‘head to head’ air attacks like the ones you listed. Neutral jump roundhouse should be your first option always as it can be activate earlier, is safer, does more damage/stun, and rarely, if ever, trades or is beaten.
The same cannot be said for his other air to airs, and while very good in their’ own right and in their’ own uses, neutral jump roundhouse has its’ own unique application in that it can stuff jump ins much later in their’ arch than the options you listed.
If you don’t use it/don’t appreciate it, you need to start incorporating it if you want to play Vega seriously.
And his neutral jump RH DOES have downward reach. You just have to activate it above their’ heads, perhaps a split second before you would land had you made an empty jump.
The hitbox on neutral jump RH has plenty of downward reach. Watch next time you use it. Vega’s body bends back behind his head and thus this can actually beat some crouching fierces, since Vega’s flipped legs are hitting their head, and the gap of where his back is is raised so as to avoid getting hit. It can still be used for this purpose; I still use it for this purpose. Obviously not against anyone with an SRK. You can cancel into some RCFs for chip and use your kara throw mix up game or simply get a chance at a confirm combo. It can be used both ways which is why it is good. Jump straight up medium is good for the same reason, you can use it as both an air-to-air and combo set up. Pretty much every time I connect with EX FBA is because of jump straight up forward kick.
Jumping strong is better used if you are jumping backward, but jumping forward kick will beat almost anything air-to-air if you space it right. Jump straight up jab makes Vega’s hit box really small so as to avoid some anti-air attempts as well.
My point, again, is not that Vega doesn’t need a buff, it’s that they can salvage the playstyle he has (which is hit and run to the core; nobody else can play hit and run in this game) by giving him a buff that helps his zoning game. If they just gave ST invincibility all of the hit and run stuff would not even be necessary. Then what would his playstyle be? ST has so many uses its ridiculous, and if they made it a defensive move Vega would have to change dramatically.
You call me a 2009 retard but I’ve been bringing in as many facts and evidence toward this debate as I can. Why discredit me when I’ve also contributed more to the Vega forum than almost anybody (sans Sasaki and Bebop)? I’m a ‘2009 retard’ who is actually aware of the aspect of community and respect (hierarchy some might say) that SRK has, and I try to bring that into this topic, citing an opinion different from yours, and you decide to call me a 2009 retard.
YOU on the other hand, came in here with a ridiculously long and unnecessary list of buffs, disparaging insults and a shitty attitude. And what have you done for the Vega forum? I’ve never seen you around. What makes you think that when you call me a 2009 retard I think … ‘shit… i really have been a retard’. No, it’s just stupid that you can’t keep a discussion going without resorting to expletives, and this is why there are those who joined in 2009 that think “Wow some of these veterans are assholes.” What’s wrong with someone joining the community? Alot, apparently.
Anyway this is my last post. Wasting a lot of time. I’ll be in the Vega forum.
+1 on Scarlet Terror ultra/Maximum Spider like Bloody High Claw/Regular/EX Scarlet as AA/Better CRF
Fix hitboxes on a lot of his special moves. Get rid of remove claw and mask all together. Just make them permenant on him.
he can use his flip kick or c.hp against late jump ins if only they made his c.hp and flip kick better as an anti air.
the downward reach on his neutral j.hk is not even worth mentioning. yes, you have to activate it much later, which gives opponent more time to hit him out of it, when compared to his diagonal j.hk which has twice as much downward reach.
neutral jumping has always been a big part of his game, both offensively and defensively. his old diagonal j.hk (current j.hk) covered a huge amount of space in front of him (both diagonal and horizontal). it was great harassing characters with weaker anti airs, it keeps opponent blocking in check combined with empty jump c.mk just watch any non sf4 vega matches and you’ll see the importance.
i’m discrediting you because you and several other 2009 retards here come in here running your mouth like you know everything. notice i’ve never personally attacked you also.
Oh, I thought we were talking about current Vega 
Hell no, those are like my favorite moves. Vega just wouldn’t be Vega if his claw and mask were permanently glued to him.
Ouroboros is a whiny bitch and pedoviejo still just jabbers on and on and on. This thread is getting damn messy and that tires me about before I even make my post, and that saddens me because Vega is my favorite character. Returning Vega to his ST state would be a complete change of pace for him, and that’s not at all what he needs. I’m probably one of the few people who feels he needs no real improvements, but I’m sure Capcom will change around at least a couple minor things. Here’s hoping they don’t take into consideration some of the ridiculous requests in this thread.
If you still have complaints about Vega when SSFIV launches, either shut up and play harder or pick a different character.
some characters can taunt, but only vega can say “you suck at this game so much i’m going to waste 2 ex bars and lower my defense just to prove to you that you’re nothing”
i like mask and claw removal from a style point of view.
i say buff ST, give him some invunerable frames. not going to change much of anything, and gives him a tool he desperately lacks. hell, make it only EX st has invunerable frames, i’d be more than happy with that.
as it stands, all of his current options (dash back, neutral j.rh, fa, ST, EX wall jump) are huge risks on his part, and even if they work rarely create enough momentum for the vega to reset his situation.
i would be personally overjoyed if he spent less frames stuck to a wall on a wall jump, but maybe that’s just me.
also fix the ultra, so at the very least he gets to the other guy in less frames. it would also be nice if you could control the angle. i think asking it to track is a little much, nobody else has an ultra that can’t wiff.
everything else seems pretty fine to me. i’m not one of those people who have a problem with playing a high tier OR a low tier character, i think these things would address the issues with his current playstyle, and his problem dealing with jumpins.
It’s like he’s the new taunt master after Dan.
His focus attack needs to reach all the way to the end of the claw. Right now, it only reaches to his hand, claw on or off. This should definitely change.
His mask should not fall off mid-combo, or damage changes shouldn’t be incorporated until the combo ends. When some characters have Ultra’s that do 20 some hits, it gaurantees that your mask will fall off during the animation, and you will take more damage than normal no matter what. That’s got to be a bit of an oversight on Capcom’s part.
There is a huge problem with the vitality system in the game in general. Most of the top tier have lots of vitality, and no real disadvantages to offset that. Most of the low tier have low vitality, and no real advantages to make up for it. Akuma, Viper and Seth are some of the only characters who’s low vitality is made up for with great offensive and defensive options.
Mh, slowly I’m getting the idea people are misunderstanding. I’ll adress some points:
First of all, watch your language. I don’t know how old you are, but about 60% of this forum, including you, totally freak out using all those four letter words. Behave yourself, man. Some of you have some serious issues, I swear.
Yes, HF Vega is not great. He’s not great in ST. But that doesn’t mean a Vega that plays similiar to him will be bad in SFIV. Those are two different games man, with two different mechanics. Also, please think that this game is also about fun. And to me playing Vega in HF was pretty fun and entertaining. Because he had some weaknesses and was not braindead like in ST, which obviously most of you guys want him to be. Heck, he was even softbanned in japanese tournaments, you know?
I’m saying EX flips would be a viable option for Vega, but really, I would be happy if he was improved a in general or in his offense so he actually had something more up his sleeve to cover his weaknesses. If I look at how Makoto even escapes Ojisanboys blockstrings I can confidently say we just don’t know jackshit about Vega yet. And I believe he doesn’t need a nice reversal to be good. Capcom should improve him other way, to make sure he still plays interesting.
Especially you guys who haven’t even played him for 3 weeks, then dropped him because you whined too much should keep your mouth tight shut. Especially those who… nj.hk… did I say something? I think people should start judging on the persons posts, not on his join date.
What’s for sure, I never would want FULL invincibility on EX ST and I wouldn’t want any invincibility on normal ST either.
My main man Sasaki with words of absolute brilliance. Whats that…? You want to keep up the Tiger knee trap…? STANDING ROUNDHOUSE BITCH!!!
If you can escape from that, you can escape from almost anything (aside from Abel) but most matches where you get eaten alive up close are offset by Vega’s zoning abilities (C. Viper can not do ANYTHING if you dominate the air) and, well, Abel has a hard enough time until he gets EX… WHY dilute his playstyle by giving something invincibility when you could capitalize on the ACTUAL gameplay he has going for him right now? I’ll reiterate; keep Vega the “invincible-less” character, there’s gotta be 1 in this game. It just adds to the whole that is SF4.
I like nj.hk.
I agree, SF4 Vega is a more interesting and stylish interpretation than either ST or SFA3 versions, and I’d like Capcom to keep his current flavour.
Invincibility on Scarlet just turns it into a crap DP, and it’s not supposed to be.
I have no problem with Vega being easily pressured as long as he can compensate in other areas, and they can do so just by tweaking what he already has.
Same goes for equipment loss - they’re part of Vega, and getting rid of them or making their effects so minor as to be irrelevant because they’re currently awful it a bit of an overreaction. Just tweak the execution and they’re not a problem.
Ive been avoiding this thread because i knew what would happen.
This division in the Vega community saddens me.
I love playing Vega, but if he isn’t fixed in SSFIV then I’m switching to Dee Jay.
Heck, maybe I’ll switch any ways. I’ve missed that dude.