Just out of interest, how can you judge a player’s level by their posts?
I think this is somewhat similar to a stockholm syndrome but on crap characters.
Somehow the idea that their characters can be more useful and have safer options is a total betrayal on how the character should be (ie. Vega should suffer 50-60% damage everytime Vega does something wrong).
I guess some folks just like having really crap characters to see how far they can go with one and use that as an excuse when losing (or to boast when winning).
Of course, I’d like to think most people would like the options to be able to use Vega reliably and not suffer his horrible crapness, but who knows? Maybe that’s just me.
i dont think flip kick should be an invincible reversal, vega should be buffed in other ways. it just doesnt fit with his design imo. st vega getting the flip kick was always weird and it still is, it’s like bison getting a dp or something.
Flip kick being invincible will be the easiest fix to a lot of Vega’s problems now, hence why a lot of people are pushing that.
If not, then Cap will have to play around with a lot of his normals to make it much more safer and have faster start-up so that he can actually pressure people with his pokes a la ST.
Ok Guys serious question what if Capcom made ST have invincibility what would be yall reactions? :smokin:
Personally for me i really wouldn’t care i haven’t been having been having any troubles with ST 
but i am getting kinda frustrated getting normaled ou of my EX FBA that’s my #1 concern iv’e been reading all about ST and not caring about what they do to that move 
I just hate seeing a really good EX move getting normaled :mad:
theres like 3 or 4 pages debating about ST lol
Remember guys 3 months away still in (Tweaking mode)… i think 
Capcom still fiddling with characters and fiddling with them twice (don’t ask me where i got the word fiddling)
I like Vega pure and simple, the way he looks and the way he plays…
Even if he was the worst character by a million miles, I’d still play him and take wins where I can…
News on mask/claw loss would be nice right about now. Something about reducing the stamina drop to 10% instead of 25%, yeah? Or only taking damage to equipment loss when you take chip damage or normal damage, instead of blocking, teching and building gauge via FA? Also, info on how players can tell how close they are to losing equipment would be pretty cool.
The man spoke.
And Mycah, your posts sure DO sound like you suck ass. Believe me.
Also, I don’t understand why reversals are still discussed here. Vega will have good reversal Ultras in SSFIV. Fix the backslash, and that’s it. Isn’t that enough already?
No. Claw as a pure poking character needs to have better or equally good pokes than Chun and 8 frames is too much. The recovery is also ridiculous.
Because it sucks and has no use!
Which game mechanics exactly? The backflip? Its still useful when baiting SRK/reversals, dodging fireballs, and dodging ultras. Backdashing? Focusing? I’m pretty sure ALL charcters with reverals would rather use the reversal instead of taking their chances backdash or focusing. So based on your logic, all reversals should be removed because they take away from the usefulness of mechanics such as backdashing?
Or maybe a character shouldn’t have an anti-air special if they already have an anti-air normal? The following is a list of people who have both AA normals and specials…
Ryu - SRK, crouching FP, Standing HK
Dhalsim - EX upwards yoga flame, B+MP, B+HK
Ken - SRK, crouching FP
Akuma - SRK, crouching HP, Standing HK from a distance
Bison - Standing HK, EX Psycho Crusher
Sakura - EX SRK, Crouching HP
Dan - SRK, crouching HP
Sagat - TIger Uppercut, Standing HK
Balrog - Headbutt, Standing MP, crouching HP
Zangief - Standing HK in some situations, Lariat, EX green hand
Rose - Crouching FP (i think), EX soul smash whatever it is
Rufus - crouching MP, EX messiah kick
Gouken - Couching FP sometimes, EX Flip (has startup invul frames)
Or just give Vega both an AA AND an AA reversal with invul startup frames like everybody else? You say you want Vega to be unique in his playstyle. I don’t see how making him helpless in the corner (and yes, you will be put in the corner sooner or later) with no way of getting out, other than an opponent’s mistake, makes him unique in a good way.
When sasaki said
That is absolutely true. He needs his standing MP from ST. Amazing reach and looked cool
About Vega’s pokes. How can he be known as a speed characters and have slower pokes than ryu, an “all-around” character?
now, again, not to sound conceited; you have to realize that i think the same way. I agree that you can tell where someone’s at with their vega when they post; personally, i think this way, because i doubt anyone in this thread knows SF4 vega better than i do. hell, the only ppl who probably know vega better than me are tatsu, bebop, and the japanese grandmasters. I’ve got vids and tourney results that prove where I’m at with my Vega, and there are tons of people who have played me who can agree that i’m the best vega player they’ve seen; i can post the ranbat standings from my city and you’ll see i’m at 76% win rate, i’ve won 4 ranbats out of 9 i’ve attended this season, i’m ahead in points by like 28 right now, i have an 80% win rate on live not that it means shit anyway, if live didn’t suck for vega it’d probably be 90%.
of course some ppl will think i’m an ass for saying that but that’s the way it is. i’m trying to assess every possible aspect of vega and in doing so i’m fully of the opinion that invincibility isn’t necessary. so i’ve kind of held my tongue on a lot of these posts because tbh, i think some posters in this thread need to learn up. all this talk about ST being a crap move is laughable, really. it’s easily vega’s best special move outside of EX. i also think that because i’ve never played sf2 my take on SF4 vega is unfiltered and has led me to be succesfful with ihm. i’m not thinking “should” and thinking about what vega should be like, but more juts using the tools the way they are… and that is the counter-attack style of play i think vega is supposed to have and the one i am most succesful with, in every matchup; cept vs vega =D that matchup is as bad as Abel vs Abel when one gets in, seriously
and I agree with Sasaki’s assessment of vega’s normal game. there’s a vid where I get punished by a balrog’s ultra, on reaction, for whiffing st. RH. what is with that? That’s what’s fucking bullshit, not the lack of an invincible ST… hell you gamble more using a ST. RH than you do an ST in most situations. i’m pretty sure they have near equal recovery time, but at least for an ST if you whiff you can get hit out of the air and be reset instead of being free combo’d. honestly i’m not going to play SF2 for perspective, cause it’s totally unnecessary. sf4 is all i need to have a perspective on sf4, how could it be any other way? Prof makes some strong arguments but i juts think SF2 has no point in SF4 discussions.
@ FoutsKazuya
dude from proper spacing vega’s AA normals’s trade with fucking everything. they never win cleanly, only in certain matchups with people who have shit jump ins like Abel (though even jumping jab ooooowwwwnnnns Vega). they’re pretty much crap which is what should be fixed. some people often beat the AA’s cleanly and combo the shit out of you, in that case why even bother? that’s why i run away so much and then someone punsihes a backdash like they always do and its all over… that’s the problem i have with vega
Vega should have the 2nd best L.p jab behind Rog WHO’S WITH ME!!! :rock: … anyone… wind blowing :sad:
Yep it’s true Jozhear is the best Vega i fought and he really knows his stuff about him.
I wish Tastu came in here and expressed his thoughts on what should be done about Vega that people been debating about so all of us can chill because i think we wouldn’t be able to have words about vega over Tatsu words about Vega
I wish i can put that into better words but my brain isn’t working very well
anybody change change it if they like too.
i agree, it’d be nice to have Tatsu or bebop come in and throw in their 2 cents. you never really here from Tatsu on Vega stuff.
oh and how was you match against Keeblerchips?
And when exactly did I state that his HK as an AA is useful/good?
All I said was that if they don’t give him invul frames on ST then they need to then he needs better hitboxes on his current normal AA’s (St.HK, Cr.HP)
@ Jozhear
I would love to play you to see how good your Vega actually is. My Xbox live gamer tag is my screen name on here. Care to play sometime?
Vega’s aerial game is probably the only aspect of his character that was done properly. It’s so good, even his neutral-jump jab has a use. Clearly, Capcom left him half-done. Here’s hoping they finish the job this time, eh?
I just thought it was funny how you start out by saying it would be a crap SRK, but in nearly the same breath, say that even a crap srk would be OP in vega’s hands. I’m not really throwing out any playground insults, and I only used like, ONE meme. Maybe two.
I disagree. I honestly don’t see how an all around buff (fulfilling both your suggestions and my own) would make vega OP. And history has proven me right, I think. I mean, exactly HOW good are you intending on making those pokes? Because unless you took that dhalsim range thing seriously, having those plus a little ST invulnerability doesn’t push him over the top.
Point was, dhalsim is a pure, 100% zoning character, and capcom saw fit to give EVEN HIM better reversal options.
Point was, you’re talking about invulnerable ST like it’s this alien concept, as if it would just be a copypasted lariat or something, when ST has been a reversal option since like…forever ago.
He had both in the same game once, AND better pokes, and STILL wasn’t OP. Just saying.
I’m not asking for a ryu SRK into jesus combo, or for enough invulnerability to go through fireballs. I just think ST should get enough invulnerability to be a viable reversal and a solid AA. I don’t want “good”, I want “better than it is now”.
@ Joker: I beat him 5-0. he’s pretty good but he flips WAY too much and he’s a little scrappy, he does a lot of strongs and jabs that work online but won’t work in no lag offline
@ Fouts: That’s my point though. Yeah, if no invincible ST is had, then the normals should be better. Obviously if we got neither we’d be boned. And I’d love to play you, I’m rpetty busy these days since shcool started again but just add my gt and we’ll get in a set.