SFHD - Fei Long: Strategy only, ONLY POST STRATS, STRATS ONLY

[System_1]

@1hitparry
Sorry, I meant reversal DP’s and the like, (somewhat) invincible startup, etc.
I did watch the 3v3s. But at the same time I kept thinking… damn I could do this easy… it just seemed to me that most of his opponents didn’t know the fei matchup and that’s where they fell. and that’s not a good indication of how great his fei is.

@Fulaani
ooo, thanks for pointing that out. I’ve never had a blank do st.lk against me, but i can see how this would nullify reversals. my only question is… if only his leg is invincible and blanka is point blank, won’t fei’s flame kick connect with this body as well? Trade? or just pointless thinking?

@zir
The “luck” part was specific to the honda matches he played in the tournament. I watched his casuals too, but it seems it’s only the latter half, the part where his ass was handed to him most of the time. perhaps not a good indicator of his fei, but that’s all i based my judgement on. note that my judgement of his fei isn’t based on the honda matches alone, but on all the fei vs. evo matches i could find on him.

it seems that we’re dragging out a debate on what should be my personal humble opinion on matchups, so why not call it a day? we both agree that honda/claw are horrible match ups, we just disagree on how hard (or is frustrating is the right word?) the matchup is

[Aqua_Snake]

His ground normals will stuff Fei’s ground moves.

That’s not completely true.

Some of his ground normals like st.HP, st.HK, and cr.HP will either trade or beat Vega’s Ground Normals and Rolls. Since Vega along with Sim gets dizzied faster than the rest of the cast, it gives you an added advantage.

Still a fustrating matchup though. :xeye:

Maybe you can check out my post on the third page regarding Vega on how I deal with him. You probably already did though.

[Fulaani]

@Fulaani
ooo, thanks for pointing that out. I’ve never had a blank do st.lk against me, but i can see how this would nullify reversals. my only question is… if only his leg is invincible and blanka is point blank, won’t fei’s flame kick connect with this body as well? Trade? or just pointless thinking?

It only works when spaced right, being point blank is too close.

[System_1]

1. You try to approach -> headbutt.
2. You try to jump -> headbutt.
3. You try to CW -> headbutt.
4. You try to walk forward spamming st.hp -> well-timed headbutt.
5. You try to walk forward spamming st.hp and block the well-timed headbutt -> you’re back in the corner, honda is too far away to react to.

So damn fcken right!!!

To see more of Sirlin’s strategy, watch the video below (his “How To Lose” matches):

[media=youtube]mgasSD1FS5U[/media]

…and more from his match with EAmegaman @ TheloTheGreat.

[Agamemnon]

That’s why I say fei should back himself into the corner and make blanka do something about it.

And spam st. hp… that’s a good tactic if you can react well to jump ins.

for neutral jump lk, fei can just walk under and uppercut for free. for all other jump ins, AA will at the very least trade, in fei’s favor.
slide is also punishable if blocked i think, and you’re correct, slides beat rekkas, however, rekka has a faster startup time, so unless the slide is preemptive, it loses. also right that cw should be unneeded against blanka.
reversals are troublesome for every character, not really match-up specific. and i dunno what that meaty s.lk is, but reversal beats any meaty unless it has some special property.

About reversals, you are right, but I said Fei has a worse defense against crossups than others chars, cause you can hit him at nealy any range, he’s fat, and he has no side independent reversal. This is matchup especific. I dont know what happens if Fei uses CW to escape, tho.

And a Fei never AA’ed me out of my j. lk… I’d like to see it. I dont know how would be the lag between us, but we can try put this in practice.

And I think Fei can have an slight advantage in that fight, but not 7-3, this is like the DJ matchup, or maybe Chun. Fei is definitely easier. 6-4 or less.

On st.lk, blankas entire foot is invincible so if spaced correctly you either block it or your reversal flame kick whiffs right through it begging to be punished.

little tidbit on chickenwing, if the blanka player has good reaction time he can cr.mp which will make chickenwing whiff and get a free bite.

This!

Edit: I want to add that Blanka can use that to tick throw Fei (after he learned to not use flame kick wake up), or to setup mixups with whiff ball > bite ( Fei likes to block balls cause he can punish, hum?) or just the threat of it and punish. Both leads to the same game again and so on. Blanka can kill Fei from one bite or knockdown.

[System_1]

just fyi, fei doesnt need to block the ball to punish, he can take the hit and punish just as easily.

[Coth_X]

And spam st. hp… that’s a good tactic if you can react well to jump ins.

You don’t need to spam st.hp though, if you block slides, he can’t ball cause of punish, leaving dash/ball > throw and jumps. I’m confused why you would risk st.hps? Do they beat slide?

[FreshOJ]

@Fulaani
ooo, thanks for pointing that out. I’ve never had a blank do st.lk against me, but i can see how this would nullify reversals. my only question is… if only his leg is invincible and blanka is point blank, won’t fei’s flame kick connect with this body as well? Trade? or just pointless thinking?

It only works when spaced right, being point blank is too close.

This is why it pays to read all of the character threads. I remember many top Blanka players mentioning this several months ago. There are particular attacks that don’t have blue vulnerable boxes on the edges of them. If you don’t want to become reversal bait fodder, you’ll pay attention to what they are.

[Agamemnon]

just fyi, fei doesnt need to block the ball to punish, he can take the hit and punish just as easily.

I know it, but the balls arent supposed to hit Fei anyways. But Fei should try to always stuff Blanka balls so he never would fall to whiff ball tricks.

You don’t need to spam st.hp though, if you block slides, he can’t ball cause of punish, leaving dash/ball > throw and jumps. I’m confused why you would risk st.hps? Do they beat slide?

st hp stuff slides. If you do nothing, you’ll have to guess between whiff ball > bite or whiff ball farther> punish counter. The same with hop> bite, hop>bait, hop > up ball. Vega beats Blanka like that, but Vega has two advantages over Fei in using this tactic: he has more range and he can react better to jump ins ( cause he is a charge character).

[SimpleKiss]

Was having some trouble with the Sagat matchup? What are some general good tools against him?

I was playing a pretty good sagat who was able to bait my chicken wings into eating a tiger knee to the groin. It hurt alot. I was then baiting tiger knees myself but I couldn’t think of anything to do other than block. St.HP doesn’t stuff knee I don’t think, and I was too scared to try it.

Someone also said that if you space correctly you can duck a high tiger then hit him on recovery with rekka, I haven’t had the chance to try this either.

[Aqua_Snake]

Was having some trouble with the Sagat matchup? What are some general good tools against him?

I was playing a pretty good sagat who was able to bait my chicken wings into eating a tiger knee to the groin. It hurt alot. I was then baiting tiger knees myself but I couldn’t think of anything to do other than block. St.HP doesn’t stuff knee I don’t think, and I was too scared to try it.

Someone also said that if you space correctly you can duck a high tiger then hit him on recovery with rekka, I haven’t had the chance to try this either.

j.LP, and Neutral j.LP stuffs Tiger Knees. Also if you anticipate a Tiger Knee and it hits you pretty deep, make sure your crouching so it can put you in a better position to throw them. The second hit misses a crouching opponent if I’m not mistaken.

Sagats like to throw out j.LK to advance on a Fei player knowing you can’t hit them with flame kick. That’s why you have them land on cr.HP. You may even link it for 2 hits. This also works on Sagat’s j.HK.

Whiffed or blocked Tiger Uppercuts can easily be punished by Rekkas.

This matchup isn’t too difficult.

[SimpleKiss]

j.LP, and Neutral j.LP stuffs Tiger Knees. Also if you anticipate a Tiger Knee and it hits you pretty deep, make sure your crouching so it can put you in a better position to throw them. The second hit misses a crouching opponent if I’m not mistaken.

Sagats like to throw out j.LK to advance on a Fei player knowing you can’t hit them with flame kick. That’s why you have them land on cr.HP. You may even link it for 2 hits. This also works on Sagat’s j.HK.

Whiffed or blocked Tiger Uppercuts can easily be punished by Rekkas.

This matchup isn’t too difficult.

Good Information, Thanks!

[FreshOJ]

I’m pretty sure that I haven’t seen this mentioned at all…whether in the old thread or this new one…so I’m going to throw this out there.

How much do crossups factor into Fei Long’s game?

Most of you know that I wrote the HDR Cross-up, Link, and Combo FAQ that’s on GameFAQs.com right now and that I’m in the process of redoing it. Here’s the “more detailed” crossup information that I have for Fei Long.

(Begin quote from FAQ)

Cross-ups:

Jump short: (Standing) Crosses up E. Honda, Chun Li, Guile, Cammy, Fei Long, Dee Jay, Claw, Dictator; Misses everyone else; (Crouching) Works on Blanka, Zangief, Claw, Dictator; Misses everyone else.

Jump forward: (Standing/Crouching) Works on everyone.

Forward RekkuKyaku (Chicken Wing) (d,df,f,uf+kick): Crosses up crouching opponents if they are only hit by the third hitting animation with the proper spacing. (The same way his jumping roundhouse crosses up in Super Street Fighter 2.)

Roundhouse RekkuKyaku (d,df,f,uf+kick): (Standing) Won?t go over Zangief, T. Hawk, Boxer, Claw, and Sagat; Connects fully and crosses up on Ryu, Ken, Akuma, E. Honda, Dee Jay, and Dictator at point-blank range; Crosses up everyone else, but proper spacing is required to not end up vulnerable upon landing; (Crouching) Same as Forward RekkuKyaku.

Most reliable cross-ups: Jumping forward, Roundhouse RekkuKyaku

(End quote from FAQ)

So…after all that…the bottom line is that j.:mk: is still his most reliable crossup (as we all pretty much already know. Okay…so…why am I posting? I want to know…has anyone here tried using the :hk: RekkuKyaku (a.k.a. Chicken Wing) as a crossup? If so, what were your results?

I’m just trying to see if there’s a usage for this move that we haven’t found yet…especially given the fact that it has been discovered that if you hit an opponent with this while they are crouching, they get put in hit stun longer…which allows for Vanilla ST-like combos like good ol’ cl.:hp: XX :hp: Rekka Ken (x3) after hitting with a Chicken Wing.

So…lemme know somethin’!

[moocus]

so if you can confirm roundhouse chickenwing hits while they’re crouching you can combo fierce xx rekkas x3? must try this out

[Aqua_Snake]

So…after all that…the bottom line is that j.:mk: is still his most reliable crossup (as we all pretty much already know. Okay…so…why am I posting? I want to know…has anyone here tried using the :hk: RekkuKyaku (a.k.a. Chicken Wing) as a crossup? If so, what were your results?
I’m just trying to see if there’s a usage for this move that we haven’t found yet…especially given the fact that it has been discovered that if you hit an opponent with this while they are crouching,** they get put in hit stun longer…which allows for Vanilla ST-like combos like good ol’ cl.:hp: XX :hp: Rekka Ken (x3) after hitting with a Chicken Wing.**
So…lemme know somethin’!

so if you can confirm roundhouse chickenwing hits while they’re crouching you can combo fierce xx rekkas x3? must try this out

Boohiss to both of you!!

I spoke about this on the first page!!11!!! :arazz:

[FreshOJ]

Boohiss to both of you!!

I spoke about this on the first page!!11!!! :arazz:

I looked and…yup…you sure did!!!

Well…I guess I’ll have to give you credit on my FAQ. Boo…hiss.

[moocus]

must check first page…

BOOOOOO!!!

[System_1]

for honda, xup cw, cl.mp, cl.hp xx rekkas work really nice. getting honda to crouch and landing a xup is another story entirely.

[Coth_X]

Ok, I’m not whining, but rather, I’m asking a legitimate question.

http://www.sirlin.net/articles/street-fighter-hd-remix-fei-long.html

Lk chicken got a buff and added recovery to balance said buff.

However, the other two chickens got the same nerf to recovery and no buff just because sirlin didn’t like the lock down?

So how often does anyone use the mk and hk chickens?

[Aqua_Snake]

Ok, I’m not whining, but rather, I’m asking a legitimate question.

http://www.sirlin.net/articles/street-fighter-hd-remix-fei-long.html

Lk chicken got a buff and added recovery to balance said buff.

However, the other two chickens got the same nerf to recovery and no buff just because sirlin didn’t like the lock down?

So how often does anyone use the mk and hk chickens?

I use HK CW quite a bit. I only use MK CW on command grab characters since it puts you out of their grab range when done at the correct distance.