OS jab uppercut will beat EX seismo and feints for sure. They have recovery. So if you mix up your OS the odds are vastly in your favor. Also you don’t have to OS every time if you know they have a ‘winning’ reversal. Make them do that reversal, then confuse the crap out of them when it doesn’t work how they want. Empty jump dp fadc is always good. DP FADC is great against Viper as long as she doesn’t EX Seismo at the same time.
Look for Seismo chains, I don’t think they’re real blockstrings and most Vipers just kinda do them. Good place to ultra if you’re gonna guess. Also just empty jump divekick if you’re out of her s.hk anti-air range.
You can OS ultra 1 there instead of lk legs, and cr.lp to cl.lk should make the OS easier/faster. You can also frame trap DP her backdash, it blows. Raw tanden or jumping are also ways to stop people from mashing backdash. If they don’t backdash, you do a divekick and if they do backdash you just do j.hk -> herp derp same situation. Most people won’t uppercut there. Obviously don’t rely on that.
Poongko does cr.lp xx tanden sometimes because it catches backdashes.
Also if you see them backdash, on reaction dash SPD them. It won’t punish. It will just freak them out. Dash SPD is ridiculous, I just figured out recently how unfair it really is.
No, I think it’s a combination of spacing, timing, whether she super jumps, and which version she uses. But you can see it. If she jumps into the corner when you’re knocked down, you should be looking extra hard for that crossup burning kick. I don’t give a crap how Viper executes it, I care about defending against it.
Viper can do just about as much dumb stuff as Seth but if you can just play faster than her you’ll do ok. I think >.>
Hello Seths. I want to learn this character hardcore in 2012 because i think hes really good and easily top three. His mix up game is soooo good. I play pretty much everyone in the game at fairly high level and want to start picking up Seth because hes so fun and has a stupid brain dead mix up game thats fun.
My big question is : Tanden Engine? What do i need to know about this move really? The version to use? It seems like i have to space this VERY well for EACH version.
What are some of his best mus?
Worst?
Why?
i dont need in depth answers. basics are cool. I can take it from there.
I’m not sure you know how Tanden works. Up close it’s BETTER because you have more frame advantage on block (obviously you can be hit out of it). Seth cancels the move as soon as the opponent is sucked all the way in, which means that up closer gives more advantage. It can be used to whiff punish pokes on a guess but that’s dumb because it’s pretty unsafe.
Tanden is a blockable grab, meaning it will catch Abel’s rolls and ignore armor, etcetera.
Seth can’t be top 3 because of his bad matchups. Anyone with a really good mixup and burst damage is a bad matchup for him. Viper and Fuerte are pretty bad. Characters with good reversals also hurt Seth’s rushdown ability.
While still figuring out technology for Seth, it’s hard to say who the match-up might favor. Finding a lot of character-specific information in both Seth or whichever character’s favors makes me feel inconclusive about how the tiers might stand. Especially when people who think of tiers might not know all the intricacies of the game, and can never truly say how another person might play it.
I believe in terms of execution and basic design standpoint, Blanka is the counterpick to Seth. Meter or not, he can give Seth trouble right from the start of the match. His balls R 2 B reckoned with. This makes him a character you constantly have to react to and who always has an answer for all of your mixups; and even zoning. The fact that some of his upballs knockdown, make it a more fair bargain for him to do it as a reversal as it forces Seth to turtle up against him. Anytime you miss a safe jump, it could be a free upball or electricity, or a variety of other counters (including normals) Blanka has, given the scenario. Seth’s SPD/SRK/jab mixup is still good though, just don’t be hungry for something too risky.
Seth’s real shining upperhand is probably in footsies and corner pressure. Most of Blanka’s designated pokes are negative on block, and easily focus punishable. When you see the opportunity you should try to focus crumple or dash in SPD/throw. Whiff punishing is a good idea too. Blanka’s slide is hella dumb though. Don’t try to EX legs it. His electricity is kind of hard to counter in footsies too.
In AE Seth beat Blanka in a hard 6-4. Ultra 1 still punishes any blanka/vertical balls that don’t knock down on hit. EX Blanka Ball is a free s.hp or ultra on hit still if he uses it to go through fireballs.
I feel like Blanka is the easiest match up that I consistently lose. It seems like most of his moves are punishable, but when they mix them up effectively it’s tough. I hate that stupid slide.
Spam cr.lk on Rufus wake up to stuff him, if he ex-messiah you only get hit twice then you fall out of the move. Enabling you to dash up and spd or punish however you want. It’s a glitch.
Seth is really hard for Blanka to kill, but when you’re online, that changes. If you see Blanka online, this should be your game plan:
figure out what kind of blanka you’re playing. there are virtually no good blanka players online, so you can forget about learning the mu here unless you find one. there are three types: the masher, the hopper, and the slider.
get ready to play lame as fuck. you can’t rush any blanka online. it’s impossible.
play like a dick (DP every time in the first round if you want, teleport > taunt on ANY connected knock downs unless he has ultra 2, style combos, teabaggan.) almost every blanka player online is a troll or an online warrior and they don’t handle getting trolled too well.
once you get all this down, it comes down to the blanka type.
the masher will press buttons at EVERY opportunity - electricity if no meter, balls if meter, jump whenever there is a fireball on the screen. jab or electricity if they’re in a block string. ultra “whenever.” let these players kill themselves. sonic boom full screen and nothing else until they get close enough for spd or get too happy walking forward (where you can fst.HP them to keep them honest.)
the hopper will turtle until he can get you knocked down. these players are typically the smart guys (read: idiots) who lag to varying degrees. they will hop to high hell and “mix you up” with untechable throws (lol,lag) and electricity for when you try to mash grab out (lol,lag.) this is easily beatable with jabs offline, but for some reason, this does NOT work online. so just don’t get knocked down, or mash jab anyway and hope you connect one into hyakuretsu so you can go back to turtling him back.
the slider is one of the more confusing types of online blanka players. they just like to slide any time they get to mid range. punish it hard and they’ll try every time you sonic boom full screen. as if you’re going to throw two sonic booms in a row. but they will NEVER learn this. so it’s usually pretty free. they like to risk frame trap ultras when they get you in strings.
against offline blanka, you can turtle or rush him down. blanka controls the mid-range game but you literally…just don’t do anything. very rarely, tanden engine him in. he will get impatient as he can’t do anything if you don’t. or so i’ve been led to believe by ves.
but really, when it comes to online blanka. 99% of the time it’s bullshit. you should try to take a little from the match if you can, but you can usually just disregard this character online and chalk it up to losing a coin toss. i think the blanka players know this because i tend to rq with power button when i run into multiple online blankas and they never send me messages about it. (and boy do i run into a lot of online bullshit lately. actually managed to increase my rq to 1% after being 0% for the entirety of AE/2012. i get way too salty over things i can’t control…)
if it’s in endless, you can usually try to adapt to player habits at least. but in a ft3, you can forget about beating online blanka consistently.
Seth is really hard for blanka to kill, but losing the MU is like a coin toss
All online Blankas are trolls, so troll them
All online Blankas are trolls, so i ragequit when i face to many of them.
& lol at the “Mix you up” in quotes, like it’s not really a mix up.
The ironic thing is, all of this can be coined on Seth, seriuosly, more-so even.
One random SRK = instigation of Seths grossly ambiguous mix-up game, Blanka can’t boast of such comeback potential
you’ve got EX SRK’s, let’s see if my HP SRK beats it? Oh look, it does.
you ball me on hit? let me Ultra you
Seems to me you just judge Blanka cause he’s the type of character that’s easy to hate, really good at laming it out, easily accessible to poor players, mashable moves & hard to evade cross-ups. Funnilt enough Seth is nion the same, i’ve had many wins which were off the back of pure guess situations on my opponents part. At least with Blanka they have to gain entry multiple times.
and you’ve seemed to miss the “online blanka vs offline blanka”
good job
like do you even know how blanka plays to begin with? because hopping blanka is NOT a mix up. not the way online blankas use it. and where did i say seth isn’t bullshit online either? why am i bothering with someone who can’t read? questions nobody can really answer so i might as well not ask them. you obviously lack experience with both online and offline players…offline, timing is much more consistent. the only lag you have to account for is monitor lag and it’s relatively easy. you can whiff punish many things and blanka has an incredibly hard time with seth. the only place he shines is at mid range. online is a different beast. the lag can be extreme and it will NEVER be consistent. you HAVE to mash tech against hop shenanigans online because you will NOT tech the throw consistently if you don’t (because the timing is always changing due to how the internet works.) this results in you eating random throws and CH electricity because you are mashing. you can’t whiff punish consistently. you can’t react to hops against many players online because of the lag. you can’t even react to jump ins occasionally because of the lag. you are playing rock paper scissors against blanka online. it’s just how it is. seth has the same problem against other members of the cast online. but this is the seth mu thread, and that’s what i typed my response to.
You’re an idiot who apparently has no experience what-so-ever and relies on ad hominems to look cool.
Online Blanka players have a very common habits which anyone who plays this game for more than an hour a day will run into. Doing hops is a legit mix up. But do you know what isn’t a legit mix up? Hopping back and forth on a knock down seven times while you’re getting up. This is beaten cleanly by a number of things offline: delayed crouch tech (blocks electricity frame traps and techs throw mix up attempts), mashing jab (counter hits Blanka if he tries to frame trap you), or simply…reacting and blocking properly! But when you play online, nine out of ten Blanka players abuse the fact that none of these will work online*. *Guess what? That means it’s bullshit - it’s abusing lag for your benefit. What you normally can deal with offline, you sometimes cannot consistently deal with online. This is a fact. Maybe you could put that in your guide. Because when you’re both close to each other in skill levels, 99% of the time against Blanka…if you aren’t living in the same town…neither of you are really outplaying each other. One of you got lucky. You can play a first to 50 if you want…it doesn’t matter. It’s online. You take certain things from it. But you don’t take everything from it for a reason. Just because I said “if you lose, don’t worry about it…” you think I mean it doesn’t work the other way around. Get some reading comprehension. It goes both ways.
And you know what? Nearly every Blanka online does suck. I have played the top American Blankas numerous times. They will ball you repeatedly despite getting punished every time. They hardly ever block teleport shenanigans. They rely on hop shenanigans. They jump around like they’re really from the jungle like their hero is. None of them even try to play footsies - they’ll slide at mid-range and get punished for it quite often. I’ll go even farther…nearly EVERY player online sucks. Does that mean they suck offline? No, it doesn’t…but online is a different game, and you should learn to accept it.
Finally, just because I said I RQ a lot lately doesn’t mean I automatically quit. Reading comprehension comes up a lot with you, doesn’t it? I’m human and I make mistakes. Sometimes I forget that online is bullshit and I let it get the better of me. Otherwise I wouldn’t be playing people who have over 3,000 points less than myself.
Your guide is trash too, but I don’t think I have to point that out when you’re recommending to beginners that Seth play the mid-range game with ANY character. Abel has VERY effective ways (namely, option selects) of dealing with your supposed “good method of dealing with step kick pressure.” Adon doesn’t deal much damage? Hello? Are we playing the same game? That’s like saying Yang doesn’t deal much damage (it isn’t true.) You probably consider DP FADC legit mix up too, don’t you? I mean, it works when you play online…
Hope you feel “pro” now, champ. Haven’t had to eviscerate anyone like that in a while. No hard feelings…
Spoiler
Feeling a little full of myself because I’ve had a 3 or 4 top players tell me now that I, at the very least, understand Seth and just need to put it into practice.
Destroyed me? listen dude i may be a sub-par Seth, but i’m a hell of alot better at arguing online. No hard feelins though
& don’t worry, i don’t mind if you don’t read the below, i enjoyed writing it, that’s the important thing. feel free to type “tl;dr” or “get a life.” Despite the below, i still say i’m at least one step up the social scale than the card/board game players. Not that i’ve got anything against them, but that’s a debate for another day
wow
[details=Spoiler]There’s no such thing as an online argument & “looking cool” we’re all in the same boat of sadness & there’s F’all we can do about it.
I don’t get how bitching about Blanka then saying it relates to almost every other match-up when Online comes in to play is progressive, nor do i see how Ragequitting is a “mistake,” it’s not like you slip & the plug falls out, hell it would be quicker to just let them win. & the ignorance of someone who does that to come out & say an entire character base of online players sucks is dumbfounding.
your match-up tips for dealing with blanka was everything i said above + “If you win it’s onlines fault too” Correct me if i’m wrong?
Also, i have to quote this for clarity. of your two recommendations. (Block properly isn’t really advice.)
mashing jab beats a frame trap? Am i reading this wrong? have i forgotten what a frame trap is? The only blanka Frame-trap i know is Close MP -> Far HK & i guarantee mashing jab will lose. Presumably, as you’ve been approved by 3 or 4 top players, you’re going to let me know of these frame traps that mashing jab beats cleanly. One of the first things i was taught was “never… EVER, mash jab on wake-up” By someone with considerably more experience than me, & it seems to be one of those fundemental rules to.
i think the rule of PP/BP has been debated enough to display that while it’s a decent baseline to predict from, (PP specifically) you can’t use it as a good measurement of skill. the top “anyone” online may not be the best, hell i’ve played the top Bison in England & the top Evil Ryu from a flag i don’t know, & while they were decent, i wouldn’t call them pro by a longshot. (& no, i wouldn’t call myself pro either)
& again you bring up lag, which relates to every match-up online, not just Blanka. if lag is what makes blankas online-scrubby mix-up so effective why isn’t Akuma a complete coin toss, or Abel, or Ibuki… don’t they suck too? because i must say, some of the better connections i’ve had online could’ve passed for genuine fights. Maybe the connections are crazy in America. But while some are bad here, others are very good, where my AA’s work & my crouch/throw tech’s work too, besides when i fuck up myself that is.
& yes i understand, it's onine accept it etc etc (This isn’t just about blanka it’s online in general, right?) but if that’s the case why offer meaningless advice that offers nothing to no-one, it just looks like a feable attempt at insulting a character you don’t like. Irrespective of whether online play varies to offline, there are still techniques that work. I mean hell, what possessed you to post the above besides some pointless character hate, let’s backtrack.
In fact why is Blanka’s so effective when you confess to saying they follow trends & are easy to punish, repeat the same mistakes & don’t adapt? they have to knock you down repeatedly to maintain this poor pressure. hop->hop->hop->throw or hop->hop->hop->Crouch HK does between 90-130 damage, they’d have to do this about 10 times before it’ll kill you. & Blanka punish combos are pretty dire, Close MP -> Electric or Throw if the player sucks
Now if you was playing Hawk, or Sakura then i might be inclined to agree with some of the points you brought up. but Seth? He can punish nearly everything blanka can do on block or whiff
Ball -> HP/Ultra on block
Up ball -> HP/Ultra or Hyakaretsu if you’re close-ish
EX Rainbow -> focus or HP if you’re expecting them to fake it out.
Tanden beats those blankas that like to annoy you with full screen hopping
Hell he can’t even chip kill you with Ultra 2 because Seth can Ultra 1 it
I don’t admire your credibility when original post basically consisted of “Online Blankas suck so i ragequit them.” & ragequit being a human error? it’s the equivant to a goalkeeper leaving a football game because he feels the pitch is to muddy. & seeing as we’re part of a pretty sad community that is the FGC (face it, we could all be doing better things with our time) it is pretty pathetic for someone to justify turning off a computer because either A) they don’t want to lose there points or B) That character sucks/is unfair. Character flaw… It’s laughable!
As for your dig at my guide? it’s for anyone who wants information on the matchup not just beginners… I’ve stated multiple times that i am not a paragon of information i don’t know every OS of every character, but if anyone wants to correct anything then i’ll look in to it.
which is what exactly, after a step kick Abel can EX Roll, which will beat HP SRK if he expects it & counters with Ultra, but that itself will lose to Random EX throw, not to mention give up pressure. if he does anything else HP SRK wins & if he blocks. (Or perhaps he can delay Tornado throw OS’ing a block, that might work but that’s me guessing) then you FADC backdash the second hit & you’re out of pressure
what’s this magic OS’s that beats that & only works offline?
you critisized my reading skills on multiple occasion, at no point did i say Adon doesn’t deal much damage, i said Adons are perfectly happy poking you out with Jaguar kicks & Stand HK & that his hit confirms & combos do relatively low damage. which they do. This is a fact!!!1!11111
no it’s a frame trap right? loses to Crouch LP spam.
[/details]
Lastly, yes, my original post was condescending… You could be Poongko’s apprentice for all i care, i’m not judging your skill level, i’m calling you a dick head because i don’t understand the logic in justifying being a sore loser while calling the other character shit. It reminds me of that hatemail you get occasionally when someone states something along the lines of “you suck, that shit would never work offline/play me at Tekken if you think your good” after you’ve double perfect’d them.
EDIT - Sorry, i’m tired now, & don’t really wish to prolong this argument. So while i do want to delete this post, i don’t believe in deleting posts, just seems like a cop-out to me. I also don’t believe in bullshitting my way out of arguments. With that said, if you reply with anything that dissents to anything i said, i will concede a loss here, i will accept that you were right & i was wrong about anything, & i’ll wank off your e-penis for the following 6 weeks, take that as you wish. i can’t say “i’m done with this argument” because that’s often used as an attempt at one-upmanship. Which, in the online argument world, means that i lose
^^Damn right… I just love it to much though, i swear in the days when i had the time for this shit i could go pages… Seriously 4 pages of argument as to why triple dash in DMC3 sucked^^
