Cervantes please BITH, get the fuk outta here and go play soul calibur…
because nobody of those peoples play at the level where its about winning tournaments.
at low and medium skill level ryu is very VERY good. and capcom needs to also have an eye on those players, because its the 1.5 million low-medium skill buyers that make the money for capcom, not the few hundred at pro level.
ryu doesnt need a nerf, he is ok right now, but I still understand capcoms point if they do nerf him. ssf4 only has like half the sales of sf4, I’m sure there are people who didnt buy because they were tired of playing 10 ryus in a row online who seemed totally overpowered at their level.
^ LOL. Gamesplayer, epic response. i agree 100%.
@ trueSephiroth: yah, youre right. There arent many character that have absolutely no weakness and that can be taken to that level, I just wanted to clarify that its not just Ryu as I wasnt sure if that was what you meant or not.
OnGODS2 Day7 #1, GODS godsgarden on USTREAM. Video Game Marathon
daigo vs yhc mochi, dhalsim matchup is very difficult for Ryu but i really enjoy this match as a ryu player. Rose is probably the matchup I hate the most.
do you guys think daigo will stick with ryu in the arcade edition? he got spanked in GodsGarden 2. it’s a sad day when ryu get beat up so badly :(.
Make you think lot of match up are probably 4-6 for Ryu,
vs Dhalsim, Fei Long, Cammy, Bison, Guile.
I have the feeling Ryu is in big troube vs Feilong at the top level. Mago is an amazing
player for sure, but you feel Daigo has not much he can do.
Ryu has no safe way to open guard on a top player like Mago with his Feilong. Its always
a risk fishing for frame trap and what not since Feilong can reverse you at many point. On the other hand Reika can open
guard ( at 0% risk) pretty easely on Ryu even if Daigo has amazing defense.
For me its the story of this match, Fei long has a can opener and Ryu is working with his bare hands.
^ you need to be able to use FBs really well to beat a decent Fei IMO. C.MK is fine, but Fei has reliable pokes that reach further and of course the rekka is a bitch. I have to admit that I do think Fei has a slight advtange in the match. He can use rekkas to fish for hados upto a pretty decent range (2.4, thats half screen (this is whilst Ryu’s hands our outreached for the FB)). That can definately cause Ryu a lot of trouble with FBs, and then when it gets in close he gets safe rekkas, a sick overhead, the awesome C.FP poke (which is safe to everything but super when properly spaced - and the spacing doesnt even have to be particularly accurate. I guess Ryu does have a far superior ultra, but other than that I can’t really see why this isnt in Fei’s favour presuming the Fei spaces himself properly.
Still, if he is at an advantage, it isnt really that big a deal. Its not like its a terrible match-up for Ryu, just hard.
i wont be surprised (but i will be sad) if Daigo switches to guile or a higher tier. Daigo has always played a buff guile anyway.
yup. fei long is definitely one of ryu’s worst matchups because you cannot zone. using a fireball zoning game is just a complete waste when looking at what you get out of it. fei long never has to jump against ryu. on top of this, all of his pokes are better.
daigo didnt change his strategy since the first time they met up, and was just trying to turtle and punish any mistakes that mago might make. i thought mago could have easily won the first time, so him destroying daigo really wasnt a surprise.
the reason daigo is in the corner the whole time is because there is really no way for ryu to mount an offense against a good fei long. the same thing happens when you fight a really good adon because he can always push you back.
in my first post, i posted that the only reason people thought this match was 5-5 was because of daigo. any ryu not named daigo, is having a really hard time vs decent fei.
even the ryu named Daigo is having a really hard time against feilong, or any other char with strong shenanigans. Ryu´s best one is c.lk, c.lp, throw :p. Immo the SF4 series are all about shenanigans, the dudes with the more safes, ambiguous and loopables tricks will rape the others chars.
^ just about being safe, really. Ryu is where he is for 3 main reasons 1) C.MK is awesome, super safe but outreached by some other pokes 2) FBs can be a great tool, but Ryu’s FBs in Super are also a big risk, 3) Cause when he gets in shit he has a way out with SRK. You can say that all his normals are great, he has a great ultra etc, but at the top levels, where it really comes down to details, Ryu is placed where he is solely because of the strengths and weaknesses of SRK, FB and C.MK IMO. That’s the exact reason why Ryu has the bad matches he does
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Fei Long : He has good means of beating FBs, a poke which outreaches C.MK, a special (Rekka) that beats C.MK and just as good a reversal.
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Bison : S.MK beats C.MK, he has good zoning tools himself with DRs n shiz, and he has the safe scissors that will beat C.MK, but at least Ryu does get the advantage because Bison has no great reversal.
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Sim : Because his pokes beat both FBs and C.MK and he doesnt really need a reversal cause his objective is to keep you out.
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Guile : His FBs are better where it counts (inside half screen) he has awesome pokes that can beat C.MK, but like Bison, he doesnt have a great reversal.
uhhh… I can’t think of any other bad matches for Ryu right now, but if he has others Id be willing to bet they come down to w/e character it is having a) good means of beating FBs and b) pokes that beat C.MK.
Maybe Daigo is getting a little predictable with his Ryu. It appear to me hes not landing as many as ultra as before and his
SRK , FADC is often block. Seem best players have adapted to Daigo Ryu and he need to reinvinted himself.
^ you also have to consider the fact that he’s doing stuff that can only be described as scrubby. VS Mago he used Ultra VS a jump-in (when he could easily have walked forward a little bit and LP SRKd to ultra) and even through an ultra from midscreen when Fei was just standing there. I think he might be losing interest or something, dunno, seeing him do an ultra id expect a total noob to do is kinda weird though.
But, despite knowing the title of this thread, I wasnt basing my arguments around Daigo, but rather on Ryu’s fundamentals regardless of the player.
oh and my point holds for chun too : gets through FBs pretty easily, has longer reaching, better pokes, and yet again, the one saving grace is the difference in reversal, with chun having nothing (except super and ultra which can hit pretty much anything).
Rose, Adon, Balrog, Cammy, Abel.
I agree about those chars being good at dealing with Ryu´s masterpieces, btw. I dont even consider the hadoken a masterpiece anymore, its easy to deal with projectiles on SF4. Its main usefullness in the SF series was combined with c.mk, but its unsafe to use it from the c.mk´s max range in the SF4 series (people wasnt used to punish that in the past but everyone is used to focus/ultra/ex/whatever the hadoken after the c.mk nowadays), and its unsafe to get near enough in order to do the c.mk xx hado in a way the opp. cant focus the second. The only time i see Ryu with some advantage on those match ups is when he knocks the opp. down, but Ryu´s pressure game after the knockdown is waaay predictable. His strongers opponents also have a great pression game once they knock Ryu down, that are safe, ambiguous and loopables.
Ryu have the shoryuken , that i dont even consider a tool against these shenanigans, its not as good as its risky. Its not, imo, a viable option to keep guessing and throwing out shoryukens, against those guy´s tricks.
btw, Fei have 2 reversals, the cw that is a lot safer than the rdp and may end up in a combo, great to use against frametraps. His wake up game is a lot better than Ryu´s one.
Hmmm… trying to decide if I agree with the other matches you listed as being bad. Personally I dont think Cammy is too bad a match-up, Rose has a definate advantage, but again that’s essentially cause she can beat FBs (reflect) and has C.MP and slide. Adon Im currently a little uncertain about. Since I started using S.LP VS JKs the match seems more even. Abel is definately sick in Super, and Rog is pretty bad too.
i wasnt suggesting you “keep guessing and throwing out SRKs” btw. But it is a mindgame, an oppurtunity for escape, and should you get a good read on your opponent, a very solid tool.
Ryu’s pressure game basically just comes down to throws. he has great frame traps and it’s not unheard of to see like 4/5 throws in a row based off of basic mix-ups and traps. That in itself can be a very nice weapon, and whilst every character has a throw, there arent many that have as good frame-traps to keep the opponent guessing.
Deathgun,
i originally had: Sim, Rose, Guile, Bison, Adon, Fei Long, Balrog, and Abel as bad matchups.
you might be right about cammy though. seems like she really has the tools to mess with ryu. i would say this even or maybe 5.5 in cammy favor.
i’d also like to say that rufus is no longer in ryu favor because of his U2. that ultra is kind of a joke since it beats all jump ins and fireballs. even when someone does it randomly it can catch you. i’d say rufus vs ryu is even. say you are rufus with life lead and U2 - and you want to just win off of time. what does ryu do if he can’t throw fireballs effectively?
what i dont get is how people can say balrog vs ryu was even in vanilla and it’s still even now? balrog didnt change much at all. for the people in the ryu forum that think this matchup is in ryu’s favor - you need to go play some better balrogs.
also, i’ve heard people say that rose vs ryu is even. i just dont get this.
when i put numbers together based on ryu’s matchups i think he turns out about even with sagat (in matchups) - and no one plays sagat anymore.
if daigo stops playing ryu i expect a lot of people to desert this character.
Can yall elaborate why Abel is a bad matchup for Ryu?
Edit: A while back while thinking about it I thought you have to play Rose the same way you play Guile. Meaning the flow of the match is the same. So these makes sense to me.
Sim, Bison, Adon, Fei Long, and Balrog all have the same thing in common. Spammable “safe” tools. Reason I put safe in quotation marks is because nothing you do is really safe. If you can predict any of the moves you can punish them for attempting them. The problem is that is so risky so I can see why its a bad matchup.
I dont see how Cammy is a bad matchup. She takes the same risk Abel does and they have to put you pretty much in the same situations. So if you can please explain Cammy being a bad matchup as well.
^ Yah, I agree with TB. Abel is doubtlessly a very strong character, but I dont think he has a big advantage over ryu. Much rather use Ryu VS Abel that pretty much anyone else. I also dont understand why Cammy is bad.
Cammy bread and butter are a little too strong like s.mp, c.hp, c.mk xx SA. Dont tell me its hard to execute I can do it
90% of the time and I dont even play the character.
Having said that I dont think its a such a bad match up.
My thoughts on the Ryu-Fei matchup. Keep in mind I really dont know anything about match-ups Im really more of “on the fly” or “auto-pilot” kind of player but Im working on it.
Anyways after watching the Mago/Daigo set I went into training mode to see what is the optimal spacing Ryu wants to be at. All I could find was right in Fei’s grill. Anything else and it seems Fei is in a huge advantage.
Fei just owns the space of max sweep range or farther. At the farther ranges all Ryu has is fireball which is to slow to recover even on block. It doesnt really leave Ryu enough frame advantage for a follow up attack or to adjust your position.
IMO Ryu needs a buff to his fireball. Either in start up frames or in hitstun/blockstun. Not that I mind Ryu having hard matchups I actually like the challenge. That said, having good enough tools to deal with the hard matchups would be nice.