Mix things up and throw off his FB spam rhythm.
Use light soul reflect, it gives you meter and go happy EX soul spark.
Jump/slide/FA the FB when they expect you to reflect, it throws their timing off, don’t let them sit in their spamming comfort zone(I mean mentally).
Throw your own light soul spark.
EX reflect, it comes out really fast and can reflect both normal and EX FB.
Should help a little…should work against Ryu, I doubt it works on Sagat.
BTW, s. mk s.rh eats shoto sweep for free, but loses to their c. fp.
What i do is do an anticipatory reflect close/mid range, because if you do it on reaction, you’ll eat it. it’ll force shotos to change their timing around. and that’s when you can get inside a bit easier.
I’ve played against DS’ Rog and a few other good Rogs, but DS is the only one who can consistantly win.
WELL…
-You’re jump in game is rendered almost useless thanks to headbutt
-You can’t thryo pokes out all willy nilly because of headbutt or c.rh. (c.rh WILL catch you if you whiff. Shit is dumb fast.)
-Turn punch and ex dashes hurt your fireball zoning game a lot.
-His blockstrings are long he has a ton of mixups from them sinde they’re so long
-His high/low/throw game is super good thanks to you not having a dp (learning to Super/Ultra on reaction is a MUST LEARN just because of Rog)
I’ll be back with how to deal with all this after I eat:rofl:
My jumps are pretty random but I see what you mean. I don’t jump in general against Boxer or most characters in general unless they are generally weak to jump ins. Other than that I don’t really jump.
Thanks for all that wonderful info so now I know what to look out for a little more.
Focus absorb and get away (only stalls my demise for the most part)
Low fierce if I spot it, or dash under then low fierce it.
Yeah, the matchup is a bit rough compared to my others.
edit: I’m not gonna EX soul throw just to escape a situation that comes out so many times in a match. Especially cuz it ain’t guaranteed.
The best I can do is use one of the options I listed then try and poke/jump on him in poking game to gain my potential damage that way. Zoning against this player was a no-no
Even though your fireball game isn’t as good against Rog as others, by all means still use it. If you know whay you’re doing, it’s actually kinda easy to beat a turn punch with a lp spark and theb pop him with a far hp or an lk drill or super/ultra.
-If you block the turn punch, JUST WAIT. Rog will try to catch your counter with a headbutt. Let him miss and them c.mp into drill.
-Your throw mixups and block strings need to be retarded to be a threat to Rog. Remember that BOTH drill and slide are UNSAFE on block, Rog WILL knock you down. Use these rarely. Ending your blockstrings with lp spark is your best bet special move wise
-Jabs beat dashes. This should be common knowledge, but this is so important that it made the list lol.
-If Rog tries to EX dash through one of your fireballs, lk drill him. It’s tight to time sinde the spark has a lot of recovery, but it can be done every time if he’s far away. Or super/ultra, whatever gets the job done.
-Getting in his face after a knockdown brings out soooo many reversal headbutts, use this to score your knockdowns/damage. Once Rog wises up, start the tick throws!!! If he has ultra, just back off:rofl: Reversal headbutt into ultra is TOO scary!
-If Rog gets jump in happy, beat his jumping rh with your c.hp. Cancel that into an lp spark. Anything else is too risky.(I know the meaty slide to throw is sweet, but the risk is sooo not worth it in this matchup)
-Once you have ultra, back away and use lp aparks to bait him into getting hit by it. (Hell keep jumping forward or try to ex through. You can catch him either way.)
-Like I mentioned earlier, being able to super/ultra dashes on reaction makes things sooo much better for you, especially if he’s doing them on your wakeup.(Fuck those overhead dashes)
-C.mp won’t save you in this fight. He’ll c.rh that shit all day and now you have more wakeup pressure to deal with.
Just got through fighting a pretty good Boxer. . .one of the most aggravating fights of my life. I have to try to WALK him down cause jumping is a no no (especially when he has an Ultra). His normals are just sooo good in this fight you just have to try and bait him into doing something dumb which isn’t even close to easy. Have to be careful how you finish your links or he’s probably gonna EX through and death combo you.
you can actually just do a normal soul throw to beat out his wall dive it works the same as anyone else who has an air throw but the timings a little different. i tested this out after i saw that reversal and air throw vid just to confirm but yes its guaran fuckin teed
What’s anyone take on Gouken? I just got through playing a set with one and it’s a pretty simple fight with her for the most part (at least for me it was). His FB seems easy to reflect no matter what speed (as long as you have good distance between you). For me I was easily out “footsies” him. The biggest problems was breaking and staying away from his back throw when he had an ultra.
And his counters can be annoying as well as his jumping FA attack or w/e the hell it was. And his dashing attack type move gets stuffed by s.FK, s.MK, c.MP (i thought it would jump the c.MP)
Well Gouken can and will rape you in the hands of a good player. Actually I got raped so bad by this Japanese Gouken player, I was inspired to make him my 2nd character:rofl:
Yeah the fireballs are easy to reflect, but good Goukens want you to get caught up in trying to reflect/absorb every time. While you’re reflecting, Gouken has enough time to fly over with his dp+k and nail you with a slide for free. Now he’s in your face and Gouken has a pretty decent crossup and throw game.:shake: And you hame to mixup your jumpins if you go so since his counter is good, fast, and gives him free revenge which means good Goukens can get 2 ultra’s in a mtach.:sad:
Also, be aware that his dp (thi move where he slides across the screen and hits you) goes through fireballs. Also, depending on which version/how far away hi is when it gets blocked, he’s safe (or at least it seems that way) and will throw out a counter to catch your retaliation or walk up and throw you, so be patient. (I know this works cuz I do it myself:tup:)
But the biggest thing about this matchup is picking your spots. SInce her fireball recovers so slow and reflects can be baited, he now has two main ways to use his slide to get in on reaction. I’ll sometimes upwards reflect, but I mostly jump over them. Learning how to walk up throw and not tick throw helps too since he can’t counter if you don’t attack.
Yea he was doing all of what you were saying (maybe not as well as you say) but I got around it pretty easily. A lot of the time I think he tried to go through my Soul Sparks with his DP but for w/e reason I would hit him out of it (so I’m gonna assume that I’m one of the luckiest people in the world)
I’ll keep a look out for more Gouken’s but currently I know 2morrow for the tourney I’m going to I believe he’s banned so I’m not to worried about it but I still want some experience against him cause ya neva know
I’ve been playing regularly against a really good Vega player, and although I can win some matches with some well-timed poke reversals and capitalizing on his (infrequent) mistakes with combos, that wall dive gets me if I don’t have time to react. If I’m already in mid-move there’s not much I can do except focus absorb and run, and if it’s with me near the corner he can follow up with a c. mp or slide before I can even get out of the way. If I’m standing there or recovering after a soul spark, I can often jump back & hp or mp and that will put him out of the air.
Someone said that you can soul throw him out of that, but I haven’t been able to do it at all, even with him right over me doing a jab throw. In fact, I once got air thrown out of my soul throw against him, and it was on the exact proper arc, too. There’s also the problem of getting even slightly crossed up, because the soul throw will go in the wrong direction every time, even if I try to input it in reverse to catch him behind me. I can escape sometimes with soul spiral, but it’s sometimes unreliable because he’ll steer back to me and nail me with the tip of his claw on the dive.
Sorry to be so wordy. Maybe I’m approaching the matchup wrong. Let me give a rundown of what he usually does:
If I throw a soul spark mid-range he will jump over it and combo into EX wall dive for a guaranteed izuna drop.
If I back up to throw sparks long range he will close the gap quickly and corner me.
If I advance he’ll begin the poking game, which are superior to rose’s pokes in priority and range.
If I jump over his pokes he flipkicks.
And in between he sporadically walljumps and ex sky-high claws me through my soul sparks.
Despite all this I’m able to wrest a win out of it 1 out of every 3 matches or so, but he’s still got me dead to rights. Not much I can do in this matchup that I can see, but I’m open to suggestions.
With the amount of control you have over the izuna now (which, imo more than makes up for the slower speed), I don’t think rose has ANY actual defense against the trap. Once its started, against a good player, you’re essentially dead.
You could only soul throw on the way up, and you’d have to predict exactly when he’s gonna go, and hope he goes your direction. I just don’t see it as a viable solution.
It sucks when your main has such a lopsided matchup. Gotta work 10x as hard to win, and even then it might not be enough. Hoping someone makes a mistake is a bad thing to count on. >_<
time the soul throw to come out the moment he hits the wall. when he touches and bounces off hell run into her grab. like i said its almost like throwing him with everyones air throw just have to take into account the time it takes her to get off the ground. i have most success doing it from midscreen but if he gets right up on you a jump back attack works wonders all the same giving you time to soul spark the reset to pressure again.
it makes or breaks the match in my eyes. i saw that air throw vid and decided i should learn all those counters in the vid with anyone with an air throw. you take that option away from vega hell think twice about doing it. of course you dont want to attempt soul throw every time he jumps off but if you get it two or three times successfully hell mess up his next attempts trying to decide on if he should attack or run to throw you off. with rose seeing as she is limited you have to take every opening given. thats why i also stated the jump back attacks so you can mix it up a little cuz if he decides to adjust backwards you can grab with soul throw all the more you have to take into account positioning and what youre doing.
(so I’m gonna assume that I’m one of the luckiest people in the world)