I know one for sure. 
Yeah, Iām pretty sure when you get them to start blocking an attack without ACTUALLY making them block it, you somehow cause the throw-proof frames to get by-passed.
It sounds broken in theory, but in practice, itās not HORRIBLE. Butā¦ thatās when I was using Gief.
I would do a trick with Gief that, since all of his Low Kicks look the same, I would get into range when they were getting up that Low Roundhouse would hit and Low Short would whiff. When they got up, Iād whiff a Low Short and grab them right after the recovery. And it would grab them after they got up WAY faster than I normally could.
This was back in Vanilla ST, by the way, so it worked even then.
However, against Gief, people are so nervous and on edge, I could almost NEVER pull this off. I was almost always better off just walking a bit closer, trying for a REALY Meaty Stand Short into SPD tick. It just didnāt pay off.
When messing with Honda in Training Mode for HDR, I also discovered the trick that EAMegaman is talking about. I mentioned it to him and he told me heād been doing it for a while. I think itāll be WAY more useful for Honda tan with Gief. See, with Gief, you arenāt really scared. Thereās so many ways to foil the Low Short, and even if you didnāt, he hits you with a Low Short or something. Itās justā¦ thereās no reason to ever be scared to try and block.
With Honda, however, that Low Short combos into Hand Slaps which leads to Oicho. Which is scary as f*ck. So I think it becomes an actual legitimate strategy with Honda. I tried to use it in actual gameplay, butā¦ to be honest, I havenāt touched HDR in a while, which is why I donāt post too often anymore here (I lurk, but I donāt post because I donāt feel qualified to contribute anymore).
But yeah, I think this may become a legitimate strategy. We really should test it out some more and see just how quickly you can do it. Can you bypass the throw-proof frames INSTANTLY? So can you literally Kara Cancel the Low Short into Oicho and in those two or Three frames time it so that they occur RIGHT when they get up and grab them? If so, thatās kinda broken, 'cause even if you mistime it, you end up with the Low Short canceled into Hand Slap ANYHOW. I was doing that in Training Mode alllll day long.
So yeah, EAMegamanā¦ make that TWO people you know who can do it consistently. 
- James
^^ That is two, too many. :xeye:
I remember that! :lol:
Thatās where this technique shines. I love option selects. You end up pressing punch so quickly after the short that you get Ochio if the opponent is throwable, or meaty cr.:lk: XX HHS if they arenāt. Hehehe! Itās such an awesome, cheap, bunch of crap that it makes me giggle like a little kid every time I think about it. :bgrin:
Fuck ya dude! Thatās what Iām talking about! Every once in a while you should put down that SF4 and play the old man game again. I know Iām playing a lot of 4 lately, but Iām not turning my back on 2.
:shake: He grapples better than the actual grapplers.
That sounds pretty dangerous. According to T.Akibaās frame data you cannot be thrown for 13 frames after you stand up. So if thatās right then your opponent can stand safely for 13 frames (after waking up) and if you try to SPD them it will fail and whiff.
So by whiffing a low short deliberately and then going into an SPD you are giving your opponent a pretty nifty amount of time (13 frames) to get off the ground with a jump or to throw out an invincible special move (with non reversal timing) and hit you. Now if your opponent decides to try to throw out a normal move within those 13 frames of throw invincibility I wonder what effect that has on an attempted SPD. Letās say that you whiff a low short, then go into SPD, as your opponent is waking up. If your opponent stands there and the SPDās active frames overlap the 13 unthrowable frames then you whiff. But if your opponent tries to attack within those 13 frames does it negate the special throw invincibility after waking up? Does that throw invincibility apply to command throws? NKI are you reading this?
If you were to simply do a meaty attack (or meaty jump-in or cross-up) then you can go directly into SPD and you only give your opponent reversal timing (1 frame) to escape the command throw which I would recommend over difficult shenanigans such as doing empty moves into SPD for wake up games. Iām not saying that empty attacks into SPD isnāt a good strategy but not for wake up games.
But, technically, a sumo is a grappler. Heās just never had a special throw until Super Turbo. That always did puzzle me though.
I guess Capcom made up for that by giving his regular throws more throw range than anyone elseās.
Yeah, but his tools actually make him better at turtling.
Honda doesnāt really have to turtle. He has so many options. It just takes practice.
A point I tried to make when I first started posting in this forum and started posting many of Hondaās deadlier combos.
Then this other guy came along and started posting about how you could Ochio Throw after my HHS combos and everything went downhill from there. 
So what is your gameplan with fei?
Rush that shit down! Tick throw, knockdown safe jump & bait 'n punish as much as possible. I try to stay in opponents faces no matter what the match up is.
Thatās what I thought, since fei loses whether you sit there or not.
Ya well, I got my ass handed to me today a few times by Aqua Snake, Embrio and RightUpUrAlley (an all Fei vs. Me room ) soā¦ Maybe you arenāt doing it right.
And yes, thatās what she said.
Well, maybe its PSN and it wonāt give me my reversals, or let me use my rekkas properly.
Ugh, my boss at work says that all the time.
I prefer your mom jokes.
You would. 
Soon to be 3!
Now that I got the HHS combos down it will give me something else to try in practice mode, LOL.
Note: Itās VERY effective after a blocked sumo smash (charge :d::u::k:) - especially on Dhalsim! :wgrin:
Glad to hear youāre putting the combos to work too! I was beginning to worry all this stuff was going to pass most of you by.
DUDE!!! Cāmon now! 
Well, what did you expect me to do, keep that all to myself?