He’s competitively viable, but if you’re talking about tournament play, you have to be so absurdly next level against anybody who has even a slight grasp of what Seth can do. He sort of loses to auto-pilot and can get baited hard (for over 60% of his life). His specials are great except that any bad choice of any one of them can also lead into game-ending punishes.
My style is I like to anticipate the other player and wait on jumps as like 75% of my strategy. Because the pain has taught me well enough that ANYBODY will jump on Seth at any time from neutral. Without saying too much, or getting my ego involved, I think this is one of the biggest weaknesses among Seth players is their anti-air games are shit; Poongko included. If you get jumped on, even if you block the jump, you have to suffer the other player’s pressure. Even if it’s just a tick throw, it means that much more that you guess right out of it. But again, your anti-air can get baited too if somebody empty jumps from too far away. IF SETH’S WALK SPEED WAS BETTER (roflthxcapcom) this wouldn’t be any issue.
His full screen game is amazing, but that just mean’s it’s about as on-par as Sagat, Ryu, or Dhalsim. If I’m full screen yet I’m down on life, I have to wall jump. Or pick my dashes/teleports right. I can’t just walk in on one of the aforementioned characters. And my fireballs won’t cover ground for me. Also having to watch the other player’s movement (if they’re walking forward to space out a jump) sort of predetermines my next plan of action.
If you want to check out my Seth, feel free to visit my youtube channel (link in my signature). I haven’t uploaded in awhile. Just some last hurrahs for AE2012:still alive edition. I’ll probably upload more once I get Ultra, but I’m burnt out of playing online. Lag gives any character a major handicap over Seth.
Oh lastly I wanted to say I’m glad this forum is getting some action again, even as something of a joke.
He did say that, but until he explains it in detail (potential tech) I would take that with a grain of salt. He was one of the few characters who got nothing new aside from maybe new combos where cr.mp is linked into something different from before, while having several options removed (and reduced stun overall, which I doubt the new combos would compensate for fully.)
He was also not the only tournament Seth, even if he’s definitely one of the best (I think I personally prefer Dashio as he’s safer, which I think is a better choice for consistency.)
I don’t think you should take blanket statements as absolute truth, even if from top players, until you’ve heard the reasoning behind it and can reflect on it yourself.
He doesn’t stun unless you use bar. If you can’t stun someone with perfect reads/button presses, what’s the point? Why should I have to combo someone 5 times (usually that’s about 700-900 damage), just to have them do the EXACT same damage in 2, and I’m not being rewarded with a stun? The risk of having 800vit/900stun and no stun/damage output isn’t worth his toolset.
What sort of fear does Seth inspire now? He can’t kill, he can’t stun. He can only pray. Pray that his opponent doesn’t make the correct read. Seth is a 3:1 character, for every 3 combos Seth performs, your opponent only needs 1 to compensate.
Seth can still stun, I stun players online very frequently. I don’t know why you would complain about Seth’s damage, Seth does a lot of damage compared to other characters, 180 for a hit confirm, minimum of 350 meterless in the corner and he does good damage with his FADC combos and EX tanden reset.
Seth is ranked high mid in the recent japanese tier list, he’s still viable, but of course he’s worse than before, just gotta work harder.
To be fair, while his damage is good from a universal standpoint, if you look at the percentage of HP lost when Seth combos someone vs. someone comboing Seth, his HP loss is usually greater. I mean, he can lose 60+% of his hp to non-FADC combos from a large portion of the cast. I.e. in turn for having above average damage, he loses a bigger percentage of his hp to below average damage than what he deals out himself.
I think he’s viable for casual/online play or clowning around with your friends, at least. Personally, I would main a different character to keep my dreams of attending tournaments alive, if that is your thing.
With that new pyramid they Japanese came up with, I wouldn’t say B-tier is high mid, I’d say B-tier is the equivalent of C tier of previous tier lists.
The j.MK is shitty, but good at the same time. I’ve seen it crossup, but instead of landing behind, you land in front. It’s pretty crazy. I find it a gift and a curse, because it gives you the ambiguity, but a curse because it has terrible hit stun + the knowledge that you’re never allowed to touch down until after you press the button (otherwise you’re gonna get a headstomp and bounce in the air for the opponent to free punish).
Sad news, even though I am doing the same (dropping him.) With you and Kiku gone these forums will be even more of a ghost town.
I check it regularly even though I have no intention of putting anymore hours into Seth, just to keep up with the consensus and to see if there’s any gamechanging tech (though again, likelihood is small given that he didn’t get anything new other than what we’ve had for the past few years anyways.)
Poongko’s big problem is he HAS to do something at any given time. He has no patience. What’s Seth’s opening line? “Show me everything you have to offer.” Doesn’t this say something about how you should play him? His matches vs Infiltration, it was usually Poongko who made the first move when the best first move to make is usually nothing or to make space.
I really don’t think Seth has gotten much worse, his buffs just don’t scream auto-god tier. Seth’s probably got better raw red focus utility than most of the other characters, which makes sense why red focus extending combos aren’t a great idea.
And regarding combo output, let’s be fair to ourselves and get real about this; The game is not all about combos. Seth’s got solid zoning + whiff punishes. He can be as lame as Guile if not worse because of the distance created with lightning legs. The problem with his zoning is that it’s within the design and ability of other characters to get in on the zoning fairly painlessly. It’s such a joy when I’m playing against a character who doesn’t have a free ride on a sonic boom into Sethtown. Then it feels like I can really play the character.
It’s kind of absurd to say that Seth can’t stun, just yesterday I was playing against a high ranked Deejay and I stunned him both rounds, everytime I watch a Poongko video there’s at least one stun. I’m not gonna cry about Seth, we all know that mid tier characters are competitive in SF4, plenty of high level players play mid tier characters.
that’ll probably be the new technology, which isn’t new at all, but dashing in on hit or block was usually a good idea since you had options on hit or block. Now that you’re -5 on block, people will be much more reluctant to just dash in, even if the other player is mashing something that could catch you holding focus. Maybe DP red focus cancel and hold that will be a better idea since it seems that now people will probably be mashing normals to beat your dash in over mashing specials and ultras that can break glass.
nah I just mean if you’re going to hold the focus in case the person’s doing “reversal” crouch tech or some whiff punish buffer that connects. If I really wanna be safe I’ll just teleport.
For the love of God give us his j.hk back to its former glory, tandem engine cancel off normals and I will be fucking happy with Ultra Seth. Come on Capcom do is a favour for the love of God!
I posted this in another forum already, v2012 seth is not coming back. If i was in charge at capcom i would just make him a bit better at zoning, so, less recovery on booms and a better walkspeed backwards to space dps. Also ex tanden needs to be fixed, that shit is too bugged atm to be use as an Anti jumpers/backdashers tool. Fix ex tanden, make close.jab hit crouchers and maybe just maybe, a bit more hitstun on cr.forward. Also if you think tanden cancels are coming back i feel sorry for you ;(