So ive been looking at the frame data in the Prima Games guide and im confused on 2-1 moves and what happens to the execution frames.
~first off when i do crouching MK it gives -1 frame of hit advantage BUT if it hits on the 2nd, 3rd, or 4th frame of the active Mk then do i get 0, 1, and 2 frames of hit advantage?
~I guess my main question is what happens to execution frames in general in regards to a 2-1 attack, for instance cr. mk -> hado at best you can only get 1-2 hit frame advantage but the execution of hado is 14 frames so why does it link as a 2-1 and i assume that no one can reversal it between a hit 2-1 (from what i can tell a blocked 2-1 of this sort can be reversed, and i assume it can be reversed because of the block disadvantage from a blocked cr.mk)
~Is it that a bunch of frames drop off on a 2-1 because visually it appears to be missing frames and if so how many frames are gone? :shake:
I’m referring to whiffing due to the angle and length of your cross-up jump. My favorite position to launch a cross-up is from a cr.lp (full extent) range. You will land on them… but from behind, and at that distance it is near impossible for ANYONE TO ANTI-AIR you with such little time.
A little training exercise…
cross-up, cr.lk, cr.lp, cross-up, cr.lk, cr.lp, cross-up, cr.lk, cr.lp
The cross-up works best at the extent of a cr.lp… generally leaving you in good range to launch the jump. See what happens when you repeat the cross-up at this range. Mix it up if you want. I’m just trying to point out that defending against this repeated OBVIOUS string IS VERY DIFFICULT… especially when instead of cross-up, you can throw out a cr.mk or back.mk (overhead). Death from above
Spent two hours tonight playing against regulars at the arcade. Two boxers and a Guile.
Out of two hours of continued fighting. Only 2 anti-air flash kicks were landed on me and NO HEADBUTT ANTI-AIRS. The flash kicks were due largely to my error of jumping into a readied crouching Guile FROM THE FRONT!
Simple rule… don’t jump at them if you are going to land in their frontal regions. It doesn’t even matter too much if you jump past them (although this isn’t ideal), I’m just trying to point out that once you pass above their heads they don’t really have too many options except to block.
Cross-up is a VERY EFFECTIVE manoeuvre. And against charge characters… even better.
So today as everyday I was trying out some shit in training mode. I found out that with my opponent in the corner I could do cr. mk -> ex hadou -> fadc -> hp-srk.
So I started thinking… What if I do all this in combo?
So I tried cr. mk -> ex hadou -> fadc -> hp srk and it worked.
So I figured sky’s the limit. Anny combo that I can finish with cr. mk I could cancel into ex hadou -> fadc -> hp srk. And this would only cost me 3 ex bars.
I continued trying out combo’s with the ex hadou fadc and I found that If I would fadc the ex hadou verry fast I would have just enough time to link Ken’s Ultra.
Ok it only works in the corner but it works 100% hitconfirm and only 3 ex bars.
This is how I do it: cr. lk -> cr. lp -> st. lp -> cr. mk -> ex hadou -> fadc -> Ultra!
If you get it right it will fully connect and give you 23 hits.
I did this on Ryu so I think it will work on any character but I havent tried it out on any other character yet . I’m still looking for a way to make it work in midscreen. Maybe combo it of a cr. lk somehow. Well see…
Wow, that’s awesome that you got that to work. I must not be able to do the ultra fast enough, because every time the CPU either blocks me, or the ultra hits but it doesn’t become part of the previous combo. Since I can’t test it myself right now, do you think you could test and answer two questions for me?
Will a regular hado work?
Doing close c.mk xx fb xx FADC >> ultra I would think would work at midscreen, because that doesn’t put you very far away from the opponent.
Maybe yes, I tried with no luck yet. I think that with the regular hadou you don’t get enough hitstun to link the ultra. I think the key lies in speed, accuracy and distance. Specially the distance is crucial. The 23 hit full ultra corner setup works because it puts you in the exact right possition to fadc the ex-hadou into the ultra. I also tripple tap the 3 punches so instead of 1 chance I get 6 chances for it to connect. Timing is still crucial though…
Annyway this shows that Ken’s ex-hadou is usefull and does not have nockdown properties for a reason. Just gotta be creative. I’m working on cr. lk -> cr. lp -> cr. hp -> ex-hadou -> fadc -> ultra. Havent got it to work yet but I think it might be possible to learn.
You literally have more time to confirm a st. jab against a crouching opponent into ex. hurricane than you had to confirm a st. strong link to super in 3s?
This seems really retarded to me for some reason.
:lame:
Edit:
OOOOOOOOOOOOR, is the +7 on hit actually +3.5(4) due to how the game was made? According to the Ed Ma FPS theory(fact)?
3 ex.bars and a ULTRA
cr.lk, cr.lp> st.lp> cr.mk xx ex.FB xx FADC ULTRA
Damage (unscaled): 20, 30, 20, 70, 50.40 = 230dmg
Damage (scaled): 20, 30, 16, 49, 30.20 = 165dmg
I’m not even going to attempt calculating ULTRA damage. But by the time you get to it… scaling will mess it up really bad. Think of how Boxer’s ULTRA after a headbutt whiffs a few punches and gives him crap damage.
ULTRA will start off getting 40% damage on first hit. and reduces to 30%, 20%, 10%, 10% etc… on following hits. Extreme scaling.
The ULTRA in the full combo above-above would have to do 134dmg to just break even with this example of combo.
> What I’m pointing out above is that it is not economical to do long strings. Instead a better option would be (in punishment situation):
cl.RH xxEX.FB xxFADC ULTRA
110, 50.32 = 192dmg
And the ULTRA comes into starting at 70% damage scaling.
Even so. Costing 3 bars and an ULTRA is a lot to pay to get minimal damage. Whereas cl.RH xxRH.TATSU will do just the same for not cost.
In footsie situation at mid distance…
cr.mk xxEX.FB xxFADC ULTRA
70, 50.32 = 152dmg + ULTRA coming into at 70% damage scaling.
You can’t FADC a regular FB into a combo. Ex is needed.
Above is corner punish scenario. The damage output including ULTRA is weak and it costs 3 ex.BARS.
Practicality is the issue. For it to come into play would be extremely rare. Let’s look at the conditions:
an ULTRA meter that cost you a decent chunk of life
a turn-a-round ending with the opponent in the corner
Three ex.BARS that you have in stock
All of this and the end result is shitty damage
sorry if this question has already been asked but I don’t have much time and the limited time I did have to search for the question has already been spent, so here goes:
I can’t do a lot of the tough combos, but I can do the BnB combo of j.Hk,cr mk, then hadouken. Naturally I discovered I could do a super from cr mk, but this rarely happened since I use the bar on Ex moves. However doing ultra instead of super doesn’t seem to work, it never comes out for some reason. Is there anyway to link Ultra to a normal without any of the fancy FADC that I can never seem to do? So far the only way I can get an Ultra on an opponent is if their careless on my wakeup or if I FA and get them then dash forward and do it.
You pretty much can’t link ultras off of normals - that’s one of the things that makes supers worth using, because you can link them. One exception is you can link an ultra off a counter hit. I don’t know which types of counter hits count - if not all of them - but I know a CH j.hk for example can be linked into ultra.
Only normal I’ve seen Ken’s Ultra link is a very very well timed jumping foward HK or HP. It happened against me on 2 different occasion and both time the guy jumped right into me and pressed the button at the last moment possible to land the jumping attack. Went straight to Ultra and it was pretty.
I prob wouldn’t risk doing it, but it’s the only time I’ve seen any type of his normal linked to an Ultra.
You have to wait for the opponent to go into the 2nd stage of the crumple where any hit will reset them.
Full ultra and does 25 more dmg than FADC, Ultra
Joe, Could you please tell me what works best for Ken in the air? I seem to get beat in the air every-time I try to approach. Does he have anything that has high priority in the air? Also, I am very poor at Tatsus and Hadokens (in Akumas case) any tips? Thanks
If you’re trying to jump in, I would suggest an ex tatsu as there’s no recovery (or seemingly none) on land which means you can easily combo into almost anything (like ultra!) or defend as needed.
I also found out earlier that roundhouse tatsu makes you unable to jump out of Giefs Ultra, although you can still get out of spd and ex spd with it. Ex tatsu is safe to jump out with though, and since its two frames safer I’m assuming Gief’s ultra takes 1 or 2 frames to come out.
Whoops, I meant to say I have trouble executing the control notation while in the air on those moves. I can’t seem to move from jump to the QCF/QCB notation quickly enough to get the actions with any frequency.
Joe - We need to get some more sparring in. I think Ive improved 18% since I got my ass handed to me by Dr. Chaoz & Ed Ma, lol
Sad, b/c I dont think Ed Ma will play me anymore b/c we have a 3 bar connection. Happy, b/c I have 2 vicious ass Ken’s on the EC; you & Chaoz that I can learn from…
