(OLD) Ken General Discussion Thread (Combos, Techniques, etc.)

[yode]

That happens to me against a few characters… And I think it happens against most when your standing jab hits at it’s max range (where it almost looks like he’s punching the air in front of their face). To be safe, just leave either the c.jab or the standing jab. The standing jab is easier to get the c.forward link from, but if your opponent was crouching when you started the combo, then it might whiff… Then again, if they are crouching, your Tatsu is gonna whiff anyway, so… yeah…

hmm alright thanks for the clarification. Is it worth it to go for the Ex-tatsu that 100% hits? Because i know the ex-tatsu is sort of meh.

[crimsonson]

EX Tatsu meh?
It puts you in a +1 frame advantage on final hit.

An EX Tatsu combo is Ken’s best combo short of a F-Ultra.

Also air EX Tatsu can be combo’d to a F-Ultra.

Or am I wrong?

[Mr.Basara]

Also EX Tatsu will combo fully a bit further than RH Tatsu. It’s definitely worth the meter to use EX instead of RH.

[yode]

EX Tatsu meh?
It puts you in a +1 frame advantage on final hit.

An EX Tatsu combo is Ken’s best combo short of a F-Ultra.

Also air EX Tatsu can be combo’d to a F-Ultra.

Or am I wrong?

was sort of talking damage wise. anyway, is the F-Ultra combo true? You are talking about the Ex-Tatsu mix up right? Might have seen it once in an edma vid. I didn’t think this was 100% confirmed… is it like a 1/10 times not sure thing?

[crimsonson]

Damage wise, it still does excellent damage. I think 330 for EX SRK vs 300 for EX Tatsu (fp combo starter). But the +1 frame advantage is huge because you can lead to another combo. This is separate from your initial EX Tatsu combo, meaning no damage scaling penalty.

Look at Ed Ma’s videos. This is the combo he is famous for.

Yes the Air EX Tatsu will do full Ultra if done right. There is no secret to it, you just need to make sure you land in range after the hit confirm from your Ex Tatsu and you execute immediately.

[Jtwelve]

gotta start experimenting with the cr.lk cr.lk cr.mk ex tatsu combo. rely on cr. lk cr. lp fp shoryu too much

[Mr.Basara]

I don’t think c.lk links int c.mk. You gotta do c.lk, c.lp, c.mk. And it is definitely a better combo as far as damage. You just need to get used to not only hit confirming, but making sure they are standing as well!

[dark_knight1128]

HI, i had a question about frame data. Ok now when i do a hk tatsu and or ex i

know it leaves me at -1 frames, ex leaving me at +1. This to me only becomes a

problem vs sagat and ryu, and maybe blanka because it seems when i would try

to dp them sagat just breaks threw me, me and ryu trade. Now i dont know if

what im thining will work so i want to ask before i try. I was thinking that i would

have to if no special bar is up, use mk tatsu which will end me out at 0 frames,

the problem to me seems that i never get the full combo or sometime even miss

mk tatsu when im doing clk, clp, cmk. what should i do about this?

[dark_knight1128]

I don’t think you can ever get off a guaranteed Shoryuken from f+mk. You are probably just hitting your opponent’s counter poke or something. Also, you probably shouldn’t be doing step kick that close anyway, since it technically leaves you at minus frames on block. You should probably go with c.lp, c.lk, or c.mp at that range.

What you do after a blocked f+mk is pretty much range and opponent specific.

At max range, I like to do c.mk after it (hit or blocked). Usually, I’ll follow this up with a Hadoken (depending on if they have ultra or not, since the Hado won’t combo at this range). When I think the opponent is getting wise to the c.mk, I’ll typically start doing a c.jab afterward to stuff counter pokes. Some charge characters like to do their forward move (headbutt, scissors kick, whatever) after a blocked f+mk. If that’s the case, I will try and shoryu or just block.

At a closer range, I like to follow up with a c.lp. into hit confirm combos. If I think they’re still gonna block, I try to Kara Throw… But, for some odd reason (and this is certainly just my poor execution skills) I tend to get a second step kick when I try to Kara Throw after a step kick…

thanks, i think i have a good idea of what you mean.

[Mr.Basara]

HI, i had a question about frame data. Ok now when i do a hk tatsu and or ex i

know it leaves me at -1 frames, ex leaving me at +1. This to me only becomes a

problem vs sagat and ryu, and maybe blanka because it seems when i would try

to dp them sagat just breaks threw me, me and ryu trade. Now i dont know if

what im thining will work so i want to ask before i try. I was thinking that i would

have to if no special bar is up, use mk tatsu which will end me out at 0 frames,

the problem to me seems that i never get the full combo or sometime even miss

mk tatsu when im doing clk, clp, cmk. what should i do about this?

Sounds like you just need to mix up your post Tatsu game. Don’t always go for the shoryu or c.short after a Tatsu (especially after the RH Tatsu).

For the first or second Tatsu of the round (against a new opponent especially), I will usually Option Select Throw after the Tatsu. If they go for a shoryu or something (like most do), you block it. Then, don’t just punish with a throw. Hit em with cl.Fierce, Fierce Shoryu or another Tatsu combo to rinse and repeat. After a while, they will start techning (If they’re smart). This is better than nothing, but, you don’t want to break your momentum after a Tatsu. If you have two bars stocked up (rare after an EX Tatsu, but it happens), go for the shoryu AS SOON AS Ken’s feet hit the ground. If you see them blocking, FADC into something (dash forward throw, dash forward shoryu (pretty risky but beats a throw attempt), dash forward c.short, or dash back to be safe).

Fun fact: If you are in a post tatsu mix up with Sagat and he does a reversal Ultra, if you time your EX Shoryu just right, you’ll hit the tip of his head during his tiger knee portion of the combo.

[dark_knight1128]

Sounds like you just need to mix up your post Tatsu game. Don’t always go for the shoryu or c.short after a Tatsu (especially after the RH Tatsu).

For the first or second Tatsu of the round (against a new opponent especially), I will usually Option Select Throw after the Tatsu. If they go for a shoryu or something (like most do), you block it. Then, don’t just punish with a throw. Hit em with cl.Fierce, Fierce Shoryu or another Tatsu combo to rinse and repeat. After a while, they will start techning (If they’re smart). This is better than nothing, but, you don’t want to break your momentum after a Tatsu. If you have two bars stocked up (rare after an EX Tatsu, but it happens), go for the shoryu AS SOON AS Ken’s feet hit the ground. If you see them blocking, FADC into something (dash forward throw, dash forward shoryu (pretty risky but beats a throw attempt), dash forward c.short, or dash back to be safe).

Fun fact: If you are in a post tatsu mix up with Sagat and he does a reversal Ultra, if you time your EX Shoryu just right, you’ll hit the tip of his head during his tiger knee portion of the combo.

Thanks for the advice, but that doesnt completely answer the question. Will i be able to beat out ryu’s dp and sagats tiger upper? After those tatsu’s? In essance i would think after an ex tatsu and mk tatsu.

[Mr.Basara]

I think Ryu’s lp Shoryu comes out faster… I don’t think I’ve ever beaten Sagat’s upper, either… I’m not sure on all the data… If you EX it, I think your shoryu will beat their uppers, but don’t quote me on that.

[Dr.Chaos]

Well after a rh tatsu if they do a reversal dp, then you do yours I believe you will win the majority of the time. Because yours comes out later since your in a frame disadvantage . However after an Ex yours comes out before theres so you will probably lose. Just a theory, I dunno if its true.

[Mr.Basara]

Well after a rh tatsu if they do a reversal dp, then you do yours I believe you will win the majority of the time. Because yours comes out later since your in a frame disadvantage . However after an Ex yours comes out before theres so you will probably lose. Just a theory, I dunno if its true.

Makes sense… So it would actually be better to shoryu from an RH Tatsu than from an EX Tatsu…

[dark_knight1128]

Makes sense… So it would actually be better to shoryu from an RH Tatsu than from an EX Tatsu…

ok the question now is which dp should you be doing?

[Mr.Basara]

That, I’m not completely sure about… Someone would have to help me on invulnerability… Since your shoryu starts second, I would think you would go for the HP Shoryu. But I have no clue. I always go for HP Shoryu after Tatsu if I feel that I’m gonna get em. If I have doubts, I’ll usually use the LP version when I chicken out…

Er… In short, wait for Dr. Chaos to get on…

[khayri]

sometimes I use ex-shoryu whenever I decide to shoryu…I cant remember if Ive ever done f.shoryu after tatsu.

[System_1]

Ok i have a question. im a 2400bp ken atm. im haveing problems with sagats jumping elbow. i think its lp or mp not sure. but that hit stuffs everything. you can counter with fierce srk but even that trades. lp and mp srk trade and you still take more dmg from the trade. what is the safest way to counter this?

[Dr.Chaos]

Ok i have a question. im a 2400bp ken atm. im haveing problems with sagats jumping elbow. i think its lp or mp not sure. but that hit stuffs everything. you can counter with fierce srk but even that trades. lp and mp srk trade and you still take more dmg from the trade. what is the safest way to counter this?

Late strong shoryu doesnt trade, neither does late fierce shoryu. And Ex shoryu never trades.

[System_1]

alright thanks, so just have 2 do late.