(OLD) Ken General Discussion Thread (Combos, Techniques, etc.)

Yes, Chaos knows his shit, if u ever play him DO - NOT - JUMP - EVER!!!

yo dr chaos, two questions. 1st what do you use a fightpad or arcade stick. number two when are you gonna take me friend invite on live?

Ex2 for the moment, and I never got a friend request from you.

lol i play you O.o. i got up to 2900 2day but i donno is i got tired or what but started playing sloppy ill send you a f request :slight_smile:

what is an ex2?

lol so i played dr chaoz 2 day in championship mode lol you walked all over me. and i to sent you a f request and a message after the match you never responded. :(. what gives lol.

http://www.breakitdownblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/hori-ex2-arcade-stick.jpg

The good doctor has other ass whoopin’s to hand out, son.

thank you sir. those look nice. are they cheaper than the mad catz?

They are cheaper. I have a slightly modded one and I love it now

yeah they are pretty good, I’ve played on them a few times with minimal complaints.

im having trouble for some reason against ryu. after i get knocked down he’ll stand right over me and charge his FA. seems like it’s a 50/50 guess where i have to shoryu to armor break him, or block on wakeup and hope he dash cancels out of it cus it was a fake. i dont like to guess too much, so i was thinking i’d do a wakeup ex tatsu. that should armor break him if he’s FA’ing on wakeup and it should reach him if he back dashes out of it, right?

ex tatsu is a good move because it will do everything you say, but even if he is baiting and throws a neutral jump or just blocks it will get you out of harms way for a reset and back at almost full screen distance.

If he tries to level 3 you on wake up, you can always back dash.

I doubt it’s level 3. You have a pretty big window. Good players are letting go as soon as you get up, and your own fear/hesitation kills you, because in the end–you could’ve just blocked it lol…

But yeah, just block, you’ll see by how long it is if he’s tryna level 3 or not. But Ryu’s range is dangerous, so be careful.

What are some of your strategies for wake up game? What do you do when you knock a shoto down? What do you do when you are knocked down? How can you create/ tell if you have a safe jump opportunity? Is it better to let them stand and start over or can a knockdown guarantee more damage?

I am having some trouble figuring this out. I am at about 50/50 right now. I feel like I am playing rock/ paper/ scissors and I don’t want to do that anymore.

Also, how do you guys tend to use focus attacks? Against jump-ins?

I know these things must be basic, but I could definitely use some help with them!

How do you figure out counter hit advantage? I don’t see it listed here.

Not sure if anyone mentioned it already but I saw http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=186686 earlier and after some training mode the technique there really helps me with ch f+mk, d+mk link.

i.e.
ch f+mk, d+mk, d+lk+mk

Reversal game is a a difficult aspect of SFIV because of the reversal window is bigger than previous versions. So you have to be careful how to apply proper pressure. That being said, wake up with Ken still goes back to mix ups and cross ups.

In order to throw people on wake up you have to make sure they feel threaten by your cross ups, empty/neutral jumps, low pokes (c.lk), Focus Attacks, etc. You have to make sure they must be ready to defend to most if not all of those form of attacks.

To do this successfully,

  1. Try similar positioning during wake up as much as possible. Don’t be over them when you are about to throw and far when crossing up. Wrong positioning will “tip your hand.” This is why Kara Throws is so important aspect of Kens game - the same distance to Kara Throw is basically the same distance for cross ups and low pokes.

  2. Like positioning, timing is also important. Don’t start mashing c.lk so early. Having a ‘poker face’ will open other things for you and it can force your opponent to play it safe and block.

Take Rog for example - the 4 popular moves on wake up for Rog is block, jab spam, tech throw or Buffalo Headbutt.

Block < throw
jab < cross up with j.mk
tech throw < cross up
Buffalo < standing block + FP xxx EX SRK punish. Cross up j.mk will stop it but in mid air and both of you end up in neutral position.

If you place yourself at max jab range every time Rog will need have a difficulty defending. You are now dictating the situation instead of just pure guessing. At worst, nothing happens as no damage applied to both sides. At best he eats a cross up hit confirm SRK.

Focus Attacks on wake up don’t really work at mid and high level plays. You can try double faking it (basically, FAing in the assumption they think you will just FADC it anyway).

Defensively a lot of mistakes that beginners do is that they forget that Back Dash in an incredible safe way to reset. It makes you invulnerable, it often screws up cross ups and eliminate most FA mix up attacks (certain characters have a big range that even a Ken back dash is not safe).

Focus Attacks - there are a lot of ways to use it. Stop cross ups that is to hard to SRK, ‘freeze’ opponents, bait them to do a particular move (Tatsu or SRK from shotos for example) so you can punish, break an expected incoming combo (like a Ryu c.mk + hado combo or a Guile ground poke mashing).

Thanks Crimsonson, that is really helpful. I think one of the things that I really need to work on is similar positioning. Does about one body length sound right? Thats about the distance for cross ups and kara throws right?

What are some of the main ways to create/ control pressure? I think this is something that I am close to understanding, I definitely have a sense of what is going on, but I am not at the point where I can control it. Any advice on this? I can see how alot of it is match up specific, but in general, what are the mechanics?