I knew I wasn’t crazy. Some days I can block it and others I miss the block nearly all the time. I seriously hate that move so goddamn much :tdown:
Even though Chun has less control, I’m pretty sure Vega’s wall-dive crossups are luck of the draw as well a lot of the time
I’m actually going to have to argue with everyone here. Every time I do that, I’m pretty certain I know if I’m going to cross up or not. That’s the whole point in my opinion, to do x amount of cross ups or not and mixing it up to mess you.
I’d take the pepsi challenge with this anyday. I do 10 in a row seemingly ambiguous neckbreakers and each time I’d be able to tell you which way to block.
Having said that I don’t actually care that it doesn’t cross up anymore because I don’t need to rely on it… and I’m switching to dic in HD anyway, lol 
It will be less useful as a meaty now though, because ryu (for example) will always know which way to input the dp.
That’s not the point though. The point is it doesn’t matter if you know or not. You can do it repeatedly and put all the pressure on the opponent guessing without being aware of the outcome. The fact that you can control the crossup is irrelevant. it’s still a 50/50 for the person guessing that comes out by sheer luck.
Honestly the neckbreaker cheese is just an aesthetic issue as far as i can tell. It looks ugly when one move is done over and over, doing just a little damage each time, and causes someone to lose a round. But theres a million ambiguous moves in the game… its just that they typically kill you right away instead of drawing the agony out over a minute.
Imagine if Dictator’s crossup forward kick knocked down and set him up for another one. Now imagine seeing a match where Dictator won by doing that move over and over until his opponent died because they guessed wrong every time. People would complain the same way as in the Chun case. But yet, in reality the move is ridiculously better than that because you die if you guess wrong the first time…
I mean whats the big deal about the neckbreaker? It doesnt do much damage. So you guess 50/50 each time, and on average you’ll take two neckbreakers worth of damage, big deal. It looks bad when you guess wrong every time, but beyond aesthetics theres waaay more broken things in ST than this. (Chun’s stored super is way more broken than this)
It doesn’t so using that as a basis doesn’t make sense. You could make an argument for everything in the game if you start adding properties to moves that the moves don’t have for the basis of comparison.
Hmm, whats all the fuzz about Chuns neckbreaker?
Cool that the crossup on it is gone, now I dont have to remember on which characters it works and doesnt lol
chun_li1
When you look at the way Sirlin has made changes to other characters, it’s pretty clear that he’s going to nerf neckbreaker. He plans to balance the game and increase the fun factor for casual gamers. Neckbreaker is a joy-kill for casual gamers, as is her walking OS tick throw. IMO a good solution would be to give neckbreaker a wider arc(2 character widths instead of 1).
tomorrow?
Anyone hear word on whats going to happen tomorrow
since its the last day of the beta. Can we still play local matches with Ken/Ryu?
It seems that you ether take the damage or manage to block it only to get thrown for almost free.
You get to play laggy SF hyper again…YAY!!
So what? Tech the throw.
You got knocked down, you’re taking some damage, boo hoo.
…And the neckbreaker is brain dead easy and is damn near impossible to reverse in most cases. At least an ambiguous cross up takes timing, spacing and the margin for error is much larger on the part of the attacker. It’s also nice that the neckbreaker is a one hit knock down and leaves you in perfect position to wash, rinse, repeat.
-wes
I will show you two clips, the frame difference it takes for Chun to cross-up and not cross-up Cammy. The difference is not there.
Again, the main reason why I think the move is more abusable than even the one-mistake and you’re dead Bison example is because Bison doesn’t get put into that position that often. His jump is so damned far that your opportunities for cross-up are far fewer than Chun’s chances. Every knock-down she has leads to it.
Not only that, but the reason I think it’s not as evil as Vega’s is because Vega players still have an idea which side they want to choose. You’re playing RoShamBo at that point. You CAN try to guess which side the opponent is going because you CAN think to yourself, “Well, he hit from the same side twice, so he’ll probably try to switch now…” and even the slightest hints can be discerned from his flight patterns (BARELY, I admit that fully).
But with Chun, there is literally no visible difference. So if the Chun user hits the timing at around that time, the CHUN player has no idea which side she’s hitting on. So it IS a total guess. There is nothing more to it than that. It’s 100% a guess on both sides. And what makes matters worse is that Chun has no reactions needed. See, if the opponent guesses right and Blocks, Chun can follow-up in the EXACT same way every time (she lands on the front side no matter what). Whereas in the cases of Bison’s Cross-up forward, a mis-distanced Jump Forward CAN end up on the wrong side, and leave Bison with no charge, so there is some slight possible punishment, regardless of how slight it is. But in Chun’s case, it’s pretty much fool-proof. There is no possible outcome that was not expected for Chun at all.
Granted, I hate this more than others because Cammy is the character MOST affected by this. Many characters can block it the same way 100% of the time no matter how she times it. But of the characters that can’t, Cammy has it BY FAR the worst.
If anyone really is that curious to see the two comparison clips, I’ll make them and post them up.
I would love to see that James.
well ryu is my most common match and against him you only have to walk back a few pixels before the move no longer crosses up and I’ll stick with my statement that I know 99% of the time which side I’m going to hit. I assumed it was the same for all of the characters that you can cross up.
Now I have literally never played anyone who uses cammy. I just messed around against her in training and it seems you can cross her up from hella because her hit box is so thin. Meaning that the cross up boundary is far more difficult to spot (for both players… except it obviously doesn’t matter to the chun). It does seems to be worse against her.
I’m not arguing in favour of keeping the cross up btw.
Was Chunli really that bad(or should I say good) in ST? You guys are making her sound like O. Sagat or Akuma.
Fixed.
Nah, she’s not like that, but she’s still really good. And in my opinion a lot of her stuff is bs. Random-crossup neckbreaker, strong throw doing jab spd damage, walking toward strong-strong option select, and especially storable super are all really retarded and retardedly effective ways to get wins.
I think she needs the most changes out of all the characters to make her reasonable. Unlike Honda, who only needs a couple negative tweaks and improvements to his easy matchup characters to not be retarded, Chun’s retarded things are hard to fix without really changing her up, and unlike Gief, who just needs to get better, or Sagat, who just needs to get a bit worse, her changes need to keep her at about the same level of goodness. I’m sure all the changes I’m looking for won’t happen, but I’m glad to hear that at least she won’t have crossup neckbreaker. And I hope she’s been changed since I got my info to get rid of her stored super, too.
You wouldn’t put her up with O. Sagat?
I think, Chun, just like O. Sagat, is right below Sim, Boxer and Claw.
She’s a fucking whore in ST.