Yeah I’ve thought this about SF for a long time. I play a lot of chess, and the rating system would be beautiful for SF
turbo spd’s are too good. and i stand by that statement, no matter what, through personal experience. BULLSHIT! people probably getting accidental lightning legs off 2 low forwards probably cuz they mash it =) i never got accidental lightning legs off c.forward x 3 when i played
changhatai: you cannot lockout the xbox dashboard. MS will NOT allow that
Wait, what? Since when does Zangief’s Spinning Piledriver need you to mash any buttons?
Or by “turbo pad” do you mean “pad where you push a button and it does 360 + punch”? I thought we were talking about these pads where you hold a button and it rapid-fires for you.
It would also be the only game to my knowledge which would cancel matches because of lag.
I mean, yeah, a high rank is cool an all, but it should be used more as a tool to match players of of similar skill level , then as something that you need to achieve.
Sry if it’s already been answered but will it be possible to play “classic” with the new input commands ?
It wouldn’t be classic then would it?
no, im talking about holding a button down with turbo, and just doing 360 motions over and over. its bullshit on reversals. reversal spd on wakeup and in between pokestrongs is already extremely good with competent players with decent timing. with a turbo button, it makes it MUCH easier
Nah, Just your basic double tap (4 quick inputs) of the c.forward x2 with chun was getting lightning legs, I promise no mashing. =)
I don’t see how execution barriers have anything to do with the balance of the game but w/e.
Too bad Samurai Shodown has already 30-died Capcom (or something) with the shittiest netcode ever. Fuck rankings. Most of the community cares for great netcode and, if you’re pretty good, you can find the other pretty good players by name. They’ll all be from SRK anyway.
I have to back up my man Sabre on this one as well. Turbo controllers allow not only for much easier reversals, but it helps on Combos as well. For example, with Gief, you could hold Down and Jab to get three Jabs and then hold ROundhouse to Link the Sweep afterwards. Normally, thhat would take timing. But with a Turbo Controller, that four-hit Combo would be trivial to pull off.
I think it was Alpha 2 that had an option to turn on automatic Turbo in Training Mode. I would mess with that, and anything that required a Link basically became a non-issue.
- James
I agree with Sabre on turbo SPD & reversals, they break most aspects of the game. On ggpo I have a friend that uses the extra 3P/3K for reversaling@turbo speed. He rarely misses wakeup DP’s/flash kicks or any useful wakeup move, it becomes suicide to jump or go for meaty or even tick throws there is certain level where such a thing is pure annoyance.
The problem here is if we implement turbo button detection then some top players will complain cause the drumming method does produce turbo like results. Also it will be harder to try HHS and Lighting legs cause they well be detected as turbo.
I think a lot of people here don’t understand how much of an advantage turbo/programmable pads give ESPECIALLY in laggy matches where you’re going to lose even if you’re daigo. Last night in HF I played 2 geifs who got instant 360’s even in the matches with noticeable slowdown I also played a boxer on ae who used buffalo reversal and TAP’s like he was the st ai.
Most of this won’t be much of an issue if the online play is relatively lagless but also take into account how hard reversals can be to do against people with programmable pads. I don’t want to see turbo hand slap/psycho crusher spam into walkup throw rule online.
I know it’s probably too late to implement anything but just my 2cents:
-Have a drop stat be displayed before going into a match so that if it’s over a certain % then you have the option to quit without taking a loss.
-Modify the 360 trueskill rating system because if I lose a match I don’t want to go down 100+ ranks and have to win 10+ matches in a row just to get back to where I was.
-Keep ping shown by numbers no stupid bars and be able to avoid players who have too high a ping.
-If a match suddenly spikes causing too much warping/rollback then have the game be automatically paused until the lag goes down or give both players an option to restart (both must agree.)
^^ wouldn’t the spinning clothesline register before the 360 motion if they used macros? 
^^ how would a turbo button still affect reversaling with a buffalo headbutt? wouldn’t you still need a clean down, up charge at the right time?
shrugs
…and taking online SF rankings seriously is pretty funny.
^ ^ ^ I don’t think anyone here takes online rankings very seriously. I thought we were just discussing BS hardware advantages.
Regarding turbo on charge moves like Boxer’s headbutt: you are correct that, of course, you need to charge back or down for the required amount of time. After you hold for long enough, starting from the moment you let go of it, there is a very small window of time where you can wait before pressing up or forward. (This is how Guile can combo a standing (neutral) attack into his flashkick.) Once you’ve pressed up or forward, there is again a small window of time that the charge input “lasts” before you’re required to press the action button (kick or punch) to complete the whole input command and actually execute the special. If you wait too long, the special doesn’t come out because you were too slow and that tiny grace period has “run out.” (This is why you can do Guile’s sonic boom by pressing punch at the same time as forward, or a split-second after instead.)
Your timing on the charge still needs to be reasonable and on-par, but it’s a much more approximate thing compared to the exact-frame perfection of the last button press, which completes the input sequence to bring out the special.
Think about doing a reversal dragon punch. That’s why we piano inputs; it gives us a better chance of having a “press” of a punch button be on the first (reversal) frame. The actual joystick motion (f, d, df) needs to happen a very short time before the reversal frame, but it’s really a variable thing. I could finish my DP motion six frames before the punch, I could finish it one frame before the punch. As long as the entire input fits into the allowed space of time required to trigger the move, only the very last press dictates when the move comes out, and thus only the last move requires specific timing for reversals.
If you do the joystick motion during the right time period (not very hard) and then hold down a turbo button, the attack button (the important part) is being pressed every single frame nonstop, and will automatically come out on the very first possible frame, guaranteeing a reversal.
This same notion applies equally to throws… probably even moreso for regular throws (ie. not command throws) because the joystick motion for them is as simple as purely holding down left or right, and they have absolutely no whiff animation (other than the possibility of a standing normal coming out).
As already mentioned, the rapid-press specials (Honda slaps, Chun legs, Blanka shock) come out easily so having a turbo is no advantage there.
I’m honestly not too worried since most people who use turbo are generally very dumb, gullible players anyways, but it would be neat if the game had a built-in threshold for speed and regularity of rapid-fire inputs so it could detect a turbo and maybe just lock up all of their inputs for a second. 
I’ve never had a problem with the 3P/3K macros because usually only pad users ever use them, and pad users need them for those inputs. Almost everyone who uses stick is too used to playing with six buttons to bother with the seventh and eighth anyway.
I DO think that Mad Catz should leave the turbo switches off of those SF4 sticks, but that’s another issue entirely…
Turbo from controllers presses wayyyyyy faster and way more regularly than basically any human could ever do (every press is exactly the same length of time apart from every other press, with like 20+ presses per second).
Regarding piano, it’s pretty frickin’ easy for a console to tell apart two presses each on three different buttons than six presses on one button. Every button would be subject to turbo detection individually. Sorry don’t mean to sound condescending but this is a pretty no-brainer part of the way they’d have to implement it.
As I understand it ST gives priority to certain special move inputs for example with Ken if you do QCFx2 + 3P you’d always get the Jab DP because the game puts the motion for DP ahead of the FB motion also Jab/short over the other button presses.
But in Zangiefs case clothsline inputs cancel SPD, if you do 360+3P you’d get clothsline not Jab SPD. Anyways Sabre meant doing repeated 360 + 1 or 2 buttons @turbo speed and trust me even at an actual arcade machine match that’s ugly.
i never said every move becomes beneficial to turbo. obviously charge moves do not apply much. but links, and non charge motions can be easier to use as reversals, MUCH easier. maybe you havent experienced the situations? I dunno, but I have extensive experience VS it, and I’ve even tried it myself for shits n giggles and it does jack up your success ratio for reversals.
the fact that theres people shrugging this off as no big deal is LOL to me.
spirited: theres many games that have turbo detection built in, and have never interfered with a player. turbo detection basically works by paying attention to the timing in between input presses. for instance, you have a turbo pad that does 120 presses per second. And the timing for each auto input is EXACTLY the same always, no HUMAN can press a button at blistering speed and have the EXACT timing of each button press, everytime. its impossible.
Some people,(i know i can) can press buttons fast enough that can rival a basic turbo controller(YAY track n field!!!), but each button press will never have the same interval.
pianoing 3 buttons is so minimal that no turbo detector would ever pick up on it. and like i said above, i highly doubt the intervals between each press are 100% exact timing. a regular standard button press on a turbo controller would probably be about 10 button presses (ball park figure), aint no one coming close to that with a piano…
onikage: hmm, unless he made it more lenient, last time i played, i never had problems. it was easier, indeed to bust out lightning legs. but i never accidentally got it. granted, when i do link combos, I don’t drum(double tap) the buttons. maybe that’s why I don’t have that problem, i guess?
Everything Sabre said. Don’t waste your time with my post, just read his. :lol:
haha sorry dead, i started typing my long winded response before yours was up, so i didnt see it til i posted. but good shit tho =)
By drumming I meant using your two fingers to drum on a single button like jab resulting a turbo like effect not piano button input BTW. 