Hey what was the KoF guide you mentioned that you read that helped your game?
Not sure if it was because I was tired but I really didn’t get why I was losing the matches I did last night in KoF. So you’re probably right, I do need a better grasp on the base of the game. I’ll see how final round goes though. I might just drop it afterwards depending on how I see it played. Maybe just wanna focus on Marvel and SCV afterwards since they’re the only games that make sense to me at a higher level.
Might try this BB game as well. I feel like Relius would let me play how I like to play.
Also I’m officially dropping Viola. My suspicion that she’s really limited once people learn how to deal with her tools and that she needs more openings to win than the other characters is holding true. It just took me learning Natsu to see how bad she was lol
Its just that people will get “hype” then find ways to kill that same “hype” they created. 3S I messed around with very little back when it first came out, but after hearing about an XBL/PSN port I got excited when the thought of playing some of the old 3S heads came up. And since they were looking for an “arcade perfect” port there would be no reason for me not too. If I stayed in Charlotte I’d be trying to get up with Knuckledust and Face every other day if I could, but unfortunately I don’t.
3S was a game I enjoyed watching, but never got into. Given a second chance with 3SOE I only came up disappointed with the lack of people I could find after everyone was “hype” about it, so I said screw it and went to something else empty handed. I really like GG, so I’ll be pretty upset if I go through the same thing with that game as I did with 3S. I’d rather keep pushing people to play KOF XIII, a current fighter, keep leveling up in T6 and the TTT2 demo before Tag2 hits, and prepare for VF5 cause if the training mode in that game is similar to VF4E’s I will be all over it.
Very true and correct. Problem with that is its a “port,” not “arcade perfect” in which a lot of people will give an excuse for or another. I enjoy the fact that I can just turn on the system, select game, and play without the hassle of a disc. I will more than likely still purchase it for XBL for that simple fact. Had a similar conversation at the Tekken tournament, but soon all games will be like that. Old and current. I like having a physical copy, but a digital copy not only allows for easier access but also cuts down on piracy. But that’s a whole other conversation.
I remember people wanting to play Melty Blood and playing the game on a PS2, not sitting around saying “I hope they port it to XBL/PSN.” Whenever I want to LAN Halo 1 or 2 we break out the original Xboxes and play on those. Its a hassle having to hunt down first gen Xboxes AND controllers, but that’s just how much we really enjoy the game.
Speaking of PS2s I noticed that a few of the local game stores have PS2s for sale. Some of them are the fat versions and some are the slim.
Any recommendation on which to get? I’ve heard that the slim is very reliable and quieter but the fat has better backwards compatibility. Not really sure where to go to find solid information.
Not sure either. I think it may come out to preference, but that’s just a personal opinion. I prefer my fat PS2 over my slim PS2, which I only use the slim to play Japanese games. Any American PS2 or PS1 games I play on the fat, which they seem to work fine. I have heard that the fat supposedly runs PS1 and early PS2 games better, but take that with a grain of salt. I’ve also heard that the PS2 slim’s processor runs faster (see why I say take with a grain of salt). If you do manage to get a fat PS2 AND and a adapter you can install a hard drive and download your games to it.
I’m sure there’s someone with more info, but if you can find a new fat PS2 and would like to install games to the hard drive and/or other things you could go with that. If you want something that’s light and portable then I would say go with the slim. You can find a brand new slim for cheap these days. I would have a hard time trusting a used fat PS2 unless its was from someone I trusted. I haven’t seen too many bad looking used slims, but that’s just me.
Both have really good information, but differ from each other.
While going through things on Dream Cancel I found info that I think will help me fix some issues I had before. Here’s what they listed on “Shortcuts/Sequential Buffering;”
Canceling dp into qcf inside HD mode only (e.g Kyo’s dp+P [1hit], [DC] qcf+P…) --> dp+P, f+P (Liz seems to be the only character that can do this outside of HD)
Canceling dp into qcf for K’, outside of HD --> hcb~f+P, qcf+P
Tricky motions like Shen’s CABC can be hard to buffer. You can start buffering it while getting up, in the air, during the ending frames of a move or even off a s.C itself. A useful trick is to tap in this order (just hold the down motion the whole time): d.A, d.C, d.A, d.B (this will buffer the first 3 inputs) and press C when you want to activate the DM. By doing this technique, Shen appears to only do two d.As (since neither d.C or d.B link off of d.As), as soon as the opponent jumps, press C.
Except nobody wants the PS2 version ported to XBL/PSN. They want the updated version, Current Code, ported to something other than PC so the scene isn’t guaranteed the bullshit it went through during MBAC…but I’m sure you already knew that, seeing as how you know all.
Yeah, I actually did lol. If you had known AA was for PS2, which people played on PS2. AA:CC is the latest installment, so instead of playing AA on PS2 they now play AA:CC for PC. Yes they would prefer AA:CC on XBL/PSN, I know I certainly would, but it’s for PC so there’s nothing that can be done besides play it on PC.
GGAC+ is the latest installment of GG and has been available for PS2 for years. I know because I bought it when it came out. People are just now noticing when the game got announced for XBL/PSN. But I’m sure you already didn’t know that, considering how I know all.
There’s probably as many GG players as there are 3S and a lot more than two people still play 3s even in Fayetteville but when you only make it out to RDU gatherings that’s what prevents you from seeing it. Pretty much everyone that was ever serious about 3S is still going hard with it. The final EZ weekly which wasn’t too long ago had 9 players for 3S.
Mike I know you’re trying to defend the honor of GG and I do commend it. I would love for the “hype” for GG to be real, but I’m not gonna sit here and lie to myself. I’ve searched, went out, posted, asked players who I’ve physically seen pick up a stick/controller with 3S in it. Nothing but crickets afterwards. Knuckledust and Face will travel out of state just to attend a 3S tournament. How many players at EZ will honestly do that?
If I’m wrong, I’m wrong. Like I said I would absolutely LOVE to see GG rip through the fighting game scene, but I’m not gonna preach false beliefs to the masses. KOF XIII, along with a ton of other fighters coming out this year are just more worthy to spend time in. Support GG, buy the game, post up its awesomeness on the forums if you must. As much as people playing, it won’t last very long. Hopefully with the XBL/PSN port enough voices will be heard and a BRAND NEW actually current GG will be made. Maybe a GGXXX, but something about the triple X’s tells me they will call it something else.
Yeah, I don’t think I’ll be able to find a new version of anything to be honest. I think you’re right on holding back on the fat PS2. As the older system, it’ll be more likely to be less reliable. But man, I’d love to have a fat to install games that never made it over here onto. I don’t have a PC though, which probably makes it that close to impossible. Ah, c’est la vie.
I have an issue with this. The effect this system mechanic has on a game in terms of the metagame is WAY more drastic in SF4, because SF series in general is based upon having to commit to your actions. SF is not designed to handle a “Roman Cancel” type of system; reversals are supposed to have risks attached to them in that game. Instead you have most of the risk being mitigated and the reward increased massively. You could see this in vanilla SF4 with Ryu and Sagat.
Comparatively, GG gives you so many ways to bait and deal with reversals that having an RC or FRC available is just not as big of a deal. Pretty much everything in GG is checked by something else in the system. That’s the beauty of it.
I’m gonna address these together. What is it about these systems that is so bad? The second statement is especially ominous, as pretty much anything your opponent can do on defense is something you “don’t have much control over”. Do you now not like invincible reversals? Really think hard about that one.
Just Guard systems are good when they are implemented correctly. The Instant Block in the first BB was overpowered, to the point where they had to tone it down two games in a row before they could get it to a level of acceptability. However, this also points out one of BB’s other failings, in that most characters don’t have very strong offensive options. It’s the same reason why I’ve always had a problem with Parry; there just aren’t that many things in 3S that validate the necessity of having a parry available, which ends up making parrying extremely powerful.
Instant Blocking in GG is fine. It’s not super easy to do like BB, and the advantage conferred is variable, which allows offensive players to easily compensate for its use, turning certain blockstrings into frametraps, taking advantage of the reduced pushback to continue your offense for longer than is normally possible.
Another instance to look at is Slashback, GG’s “parry”. Not only was this really hard to do, but the ramifications of missing it were pretty tremendous. The window to successfully Slashback is something like 2 or 3 frames. 3S’s Parry is 5 frames minimum, with 10 frames maximum with the proper execution. Compare that with the relative speed of the two games and see the difference. If you missed a Slashback in GG, you couldn’t block for 30 frames. You could attempt another Slashback with a reduced frame advantage if successful. 3S parries let you buffer them into so many things with so many option selects that in many instances, there is almost no risk for a parry attempt (this is not to say that there is no risk PERIOD, just that there are many applications with minimal risk for maximum return). Slashback costs meter, Parry is free. The designers even designated a 10 frame period where you are getting up off the ground where you cannot Slashback, so as to ensure that getting knocked down still forced you to deal with wakeup mixups, so the offensive player was still motivated to continue their pressure when rewarded.
My intent was not to put 3S on blast here, just that this was one of the easiest contrasts available to demonstrate the amount of thought that went into GG’s design.
You had one set of frame data to learn for each character. Level doesn’t even come into play until you factor in Instant Blocking, because Faultless Defense and Slashback had universal changes in frame advantage and disadvantage (Slashback had a uniform blockstun, Faultless Defense you just add 2 frames to their blockstun). Even then, Instant Block wasn’t that complicated; subtract 2 frames from stun if it’s level 1, 3 if it’s level 2 or 3, and 4 if it’s level 4 or 5. That’s it. I could set a frame data table for a character in front of you with this paragraph and you could calculate anything you want. Roman Cancel, just remove the recovery of the move because that’s all RCing does. I think you just blew the whole thing out of proportion because you have this tendency to over think things and make them more complicated than they really are.
As far as fun factor, fun is a really subjective thing. But I can understand how you would not have fun with a game if you never really took the time to understand it.
It’s pretty much what Matt said. It’s not that the community built up a fear of talking about the game. It’s that people saw how much was involved in learning the game and suddenly they didn’t want to talk about it anymore. I’m always open to talking about the game and answering the questions that I can answer.
It’s also hard to talk about a game in a constructive manner when the opinions the older community says about the game are uninformed and close minded. For years the stuff I used to hear about the game was that “there’s no thinking involved” and “it’s just mindless rushdown, you just go back and forth”. Now we’ve basically come to “the game is too hard” which is almost a total 180. It’s also disheartening because now all these new games are out and everyone complains that they’re too easy and scrub friendly. Sort of sad that when those same people had gold in their hands they chose to toss it aside.
The window for FRCs, depending on the move, ranged from anywhere from 2 to 6 frames. The definition of “prohibitively difficult” implies something so hard that even tournament players will not use it regularly. FRCs are not prohibitively difficult. Watch any tournament with reasonably good players in it and you will see.
As far as making certain moves just RC for 25%, that would fundamentally affect the balance of the game. Slayer would be waaaaaay too good if you didn’t have to use timing to FRC Dead On Time. There would be even more bitching about characters like Sol just because now every scrub could do Gun Flame FRC. I agree that things which are just hard for the sake of it are silly, but some things are balanced by their difficulty. That’s why ASW just took out the concept of FRCs when they made BlazBlue, and look how THAT game turned out.
OK seriously, WTF Mike? You have a tendency to say shit out of the blue, but I don’t think I’ve EVER heard you talk about GG before this. You really think you’re the only person who plays GG in this state? Fine. Find a place for us to play TODAY, a place with a CRT, and I will bring my PS2 and my copy of the original GGAC (because GGAC+ is buggy and not tournament standard, Mr. Know-It-All), and I will happily body you, REPEATEDLY. Trust me. You just don’t know.
Weird. If they stopped selling them then it had to be just recent then. When I go back to the store I’ll specifically look for it and/or check some other stores in the area.
I’ve talked just about a lot of fighting games on SRK and off, even offered to open my place MULTIPLE times for gatherings or just solo sessions. Even posted that if anyone is playing that I’ll DRIVE OUT to you and play. I’ve even mentioned to you when you said you couldn’t find anyone to play BB with that we could play at my place or yours. I don’t mind too much if I have to drive out to find players to play against.
I post questions, legit advice, or ask about gatherings or tournaments. Nothing. Then when I post facts, personal opinions about something, or just truth people flame “out of the blue” because somehow they can only read stuff they feel they can mindlessly argue about.
So don’t try to make it out like this is the first time I’ve EVER mentioned a fighting game or invited people to my place to play or ever SEARCHED for people to play. You love GG, that’s awesome Titanium Beast (yeah, I did some research), but you honestly are gonna tell me you’re gonna still be playing the game long time after it hits XBL/PSN? These aren’t the glory days anymore. GG did well for when it ran, but its done now. Its just the truth and I’m sure the truth hurts, but that’s just the way it is.
And how does the XBL/PSN version stack up against the PS2 version? So the game has been out since 2008 and nobody played it because it was “too buggy.” I’m just waiting to hear the excuse now when it hits XBL/PSN.
sheeeeerug if the new version fixes the couple of bugs in AC+ and has good online, it’s over, I will probably play nothing else. That’s part of what you expect from a company that does this type of thing, you advertise a product, it had better be just as good as the prior and preferably better. The fact that this will be on next gen systems is important too, because the fact that most of the popular games are on these systems which require different hardware and display options MATTERS, and is a big factor in what type of games get support.
And my point was that I never heard you mention GG before. Yes, I’ve seen you mention other fighting games, I’ve heard you mention before you would have people over to play, but here’s THE THING:
You don’t really advertise gatherings at your place, you just mention once that you’d like to have a person or two over. Doesn’t grab people’s attention.
If it’s JUST gonna be that one or two people, most of the players aren’t interested in just playing you, because you are really bad at fighting games.
But if you wanna play GG TODAY, and you have a CRT at your place, I will, as I said, happily come out and beast you. Hell, I don’t care if we play AC+, cuz my character only benefits from that version.
The other thing is, you may say “it’s the truth”, but you’re also talking about the future, which is something that no one knows about. In addition, NOBODY wants to hear negativity about that kind of thing, so even if you feel like you’re saying “the truth”, you’re probably gonna get yelled at about it. That’s why when I have an opinion like that, I tend to keep it to myself, unless someone asks me. Coming out and posting something like that on a board is asking for trouble, especially when everyone around you is excited about it.
3SO failed because 3S purists are horrible people and at least half of the people who were good at 3S didn’t really like the game and only played because it was the main event Capcom game at tournaments for so long.
The GG community is different; the people who got really good at GG, really fucking LOVE the game.
