Netcode

[Wikum]

sf4 is far from fine and no, you can never adapt to variable input delay because its an unkown number that changes, those are incredibly ignorant things to say. To properly tech throws online for sf4, you have to tech shit before your opponent even thought about throwing you sometimes. That shit is awful. You take that same timing offline and what ends up happening is that you tech throw so fast that its at the wrong damn time and you either wiff a stand throw or a crouch tech. Any game that forces input delay to the degree sf4 does online is impossible to play properly outside of Japan. Fighting games are mostly based on reactions and when input delay is there, its impossible to react properly because it will delay the shit out of your reactions.

this in a nutshell is exactly what i hate about online sf4. i could live with most of the stuff, but throw teching was just a joke. trying to tech viper would make you want to pull your hair out. then there’s ryu with his many different ways of putting you in block stun, so you’d have to know the timing of everyone of his throw setups…but if that timing is different for every match, you’re never going to learn it! lol. then there’s the half screen walk up throw, wakeup walk up throw, and my personal favourite, the bison fadc throw. so many high pp/bp players would rely on that shit. i’d wager that the majority of people who prefer that netcode over sfxt are just pissed their throw tactics don’t work anymore.

[w00denTEETH]

sf4 is far from fine and no, you can never adapt to variable input delay because its an unkown number that changes, those are incredibly ignorant things to say.

…the adaptation for most was to pick a character that benefits from lag. This provided a double benefit because those characters were considered mid and low tier on any reasonable tier list. It was heaven on earth for bad players.

[shoultzula]

another thing bad about sf4 online is that it made 99.9% of any connections smooth. You could be playing wirelessly and it will still be smooth. It tricked new players into thinking that their wireless connection or their shared network connection over a router as someone is surfing youtube allowed for “perfect” games. No matter what you did online for sf4, it was smooth quite a bit of the time but smooth doesn’t mean playable by any means

now, those same people with shit connections are starting to see that their internet connections fucking suck ass and are being exposed for bad sf4 online strategies and think its sfxt net code’s fault. When in actuality, they never knew what good connection looked like in the first place and are basing what a good connection is by using sf4 online as a template. sf4 is ass online unless you live in Japan. Even Daigo complained how bad sf4 is online for the USA so people calling it good online have no fucking clue wtf is going on.

[extravagant]

I play SSFIV on the old CRT TVs and the same with SFxT. So all my complaints about input TV delay are not much of a problem.

If I could compare SFxT and SSFIV, I would say that SFxT is worse. SFxT only feels better for the scrubs on here who claim it because they are glad that combos in SFxT are so easily to link and chain. There’s plinking and combo system in SFxT is a complet joke and the game is really dumbed down. Ryu’s plinking combos that were actually challenging and took strict precision are now laughably easy for scrubs.

If people are complaining that SSFIV had a bad net code, they better fucking check again:

• SSFIV has stricter and precise timing for moves
• MOST players on here probably 95% of you own HDTVs that lag BAD with SSFIV. SSFIV does not correlate well with HDTV.
• So Capcom makes combos a lot easier, stupid scrubby easy to make up for the majority of scrubs who can’t link combos for shit, and Capcpm compensates these scrubs in SFxT.
• SFxT nut huggers are the one who are illusioned.

Think of it this way…

• SSFIV + Precise Timing + SHITTY HDTV = Trashy anywhere online/offline

• SFxT + Easier Timing + Input Leniency + SHITTY HDTV = Acceptable online/offline

Those of you who are complaining that it is laggy, try running both games on a TV that actually has NO input TV lag. HDTVs are pieces of shit and the only TVs that run close to native Arcade are old SDTV, HD Monitors, and expensive HDTV adapters.

[jedpossum]

• SSFIV has stricter and precise timing for moves

• MvC2 has stricter and more precise timing then anything from sf4. The rerelease of MvC2 used rollback netcode. I hear no complaints from the mvc2 players about the netcode on that rerelease.

[extravagant]

And those complaining about the lag is the reason why SFIV throw tech was bad well thy better check again. SFxT has a different system for throws and it is almost impossible to do the same throw setups in from SFIV. The games are just different like that it is not a matter of “online issues” why you cannot land or tech throws.

I was able to throw people abusively online or offline in SFIV at arcades and at home. So I don’t believe you when you say it is the net code.

Throws in SFxT are harder and less powerful tool so most people don’t use it as much. It’s not a net code thing…

[extravagant]

• MvC2 has stricter and more precise timing then anything from sf4. The rerelease of MvC2 used rollback netcode. I hear no complaints from the mvc2 players about the netcode on that rerelease.

The older games use less resources so that’s why 3S uses GGPO and MvC2 uses rollback. However on a higher demand resource game such as this I am not too sure about it.

SFxT is overall dumbed down a bit and everything easier to land chain and link so if the core game is already easier like that then that also means online it will be easier than SF4 overall.

The older games all had stricter timing, my gosh landing BnB combos in CvS2 was ridiculous. SF4 set a new bar of “easier gameplay” when comparing SFIV to mvc2 cvs2 and 3S. But SFxT set an even “easier than easy gameplay” which really dumbed down things. I’m not saying its bad but if the core game is set to already be easy then of course it is easier online too. The net code in SFxT is not any better IMO it’s just a less challenger game to play and it caters more to mindless gameplay rather than precision and timing.

[w00denTEETH]

I play SF4 on a CRT. I would play SFxT on a CRT as well but it looks ridiculous so I can’t.

All you have to do is move the joystick back and forth from left to right at the beginning of a round to feel how unresponsive SF4 is. It has nothing to do with links.

[shoultzula]

I play SSFIV on the old CRT TVs and the same with SFxT. So all my complaints about input TV delay are not much of a problem.

If I could compare SFxT and SSFIV, I would say that SFxT is worse. SFxT only feels better for the scrubs on here who claim it because they are glad that combos in SFxT are so easily to link and chain. There’s plinking and combo system in SFxT is a complet joke and the game is really dumbed down. Ryu’s plinking combos that were actually challenging and took strict precision are now laughably easy for scrubs.

If people are complaining that SSFIV had a bad net code, they better fucking check again:

this is the dumbest fucking post I’ve ever read on srk and you sir have 0 clue as to wtf is going on and its people like you who are the problem when it comes down to the net code.

I don’t play on a HDTV because they all pretty much lag unless you’re willing to shell out more money for one that doesn’t so I play on CRT TV’s. Another thing, you have no concept as to what forced input delay does to the game.

the quality of the net code is how good you can react, not whether or not you can combo…

you just don’t know WTF is going on. variable input delay, sf4, is fucking awful. It is no different than playing on a laggy ass TV offline. **We don’t use TV’s that lag for tournament play because it affects the game so why is that when SF4 uses it for online net code, its the best shit ever? **did you even think about what you typed? you said input delay is bad so thats why you shouldn’t use laggy tv’s but the sf4 net code forces a variable of input delay. Its the same damn thing. The only difference is that a laggy TV has a set amount of input delay where as sf4 online is a variable. It can either be 7 fames of input lag for 10 frames then on the next 10 frames, its 15 frames of input delay.

you’re fucking delusional pure and simple. You have 0 concept as to how fighting games are played if you think sf4 online is fine or good.

This netcode is really good aside from the sound bug. People think the online is shit cuz they used to input delay lol

arturo has been a boss before I even THOUGHT about trying hard, I still have my b5 A3 tape for god sakes.

arturo has had mutliple top 8’s, one of the first people in the US to beat daigo in sf4, traveled and lived in Japan to train and has been in the scene for 15+ years.

what are your credentials again to make a just claim? oh, you post on SRK.com, that’s your credentials. Makes sense now

[extravagant]

You probably just suck at SSFIV and now that Scrub Fight x Trashcan wets your panties if anything hurts your beloved game then you throw a bitch fit.

[shoultzula]

You probably just suck at SSFIV and now that Scrub Fight x Trashcan wets your panties if anything hurts your beloved game then you throw a bitch fit.

hahaha, i’ve beaten regional top 8\16 players in my own state in that game. sf4 is ass

and I even bashed sfxt for being a TERRIBLE game. However, the net code is VERY good which I mentioned several times in other threads. hate the game, love the online and every game from this point forward should use roll back and make it better. Not only that, roll back style net code allows for input delay too. You can crank it up to 9 frames on GGPO so saying sf4 variable input delay is the way to go is moot. ** roll back allows both styles and you can basically choose if you want roll back or input delay. There is no reason to NOT use it because it gives everyone what they want. If you actually knew wtf you were talking about, you would know that.**

scrubs will be scrubs though. Keep it up, you’re really making a name for yourself. ** You don’t even know what input delay is and why its bad so how in the holy fuck can you have an opinion when you have to compare input delay versus roll back? **your rant about the net code is full of contradictions and that indicates to anyone that you just don’t know wtf you’re talking about.

truth hurts right? i bet ur mad so get mad

[Wonderswan]

hahaha, i’ve beaten regional top 8\16 players in my own state in that game. sf4 is ass

and I even bashed sfxt for being a TERRIBLE game. However, the net code is VERY good which I mentioned several times in other threads. hate the game, love the online and every game from this point forward should use roll back and make it better. Not only that, roll back style net code allows for input delay too. You can crank it up to 9 frames on GGPO so saying sf4 variable input delay is the way to go is moot. ** roll back allows both styles and you can basically choose if you want roll back or input delay. There is no reason to NOT use it because it gives everyone what they want. If you actually knew wtf you were talking about, you would know that.**

scrubs will be scrubs though. Keep it up, you’re really making a name for yourself. ** You don’t even know what input delay is and why its bad so how in the holy fuck can you have an opinion when you have to compare input delay versus roll back? **your rant about the net code is full of contradictions and that indicates to anyone that you just don’t know wtf you’re talking about.

truth hurts right? i bet ur mad so get mad

lol dude, don’t even bother addressing his post, he is just one more of the myriad of half developed fetuses that fell out and started posting on SRK. Leave his half-baked ass to meander and then wander back to gamefaqs, lol.

[AlboShinobi]

lol at a scrub calling others scrubs. Good one extrascrub…if you cared to listen to all the posts and explanations on here about netcodes then you might have prevented yourself from looking like an idiot.

By the way, you can ask any top player in the US if sf4 netcode is good or better then rollback netcode and if even one of them agrees with you then we will all stfu about online play from now on. But if they agree that rollback netcode is superior then how about you delete your account and stop posting in here? That’s how confident I am that you’re an idiot.

[MaggotSai]

I played cvs2 and ggx2 online for xbox 1 or w\e people call it and sf4 is in the same league as cvs2 IMO. Its just as bad. I even believe that sf4 and cvs2 share the exact same net code because they act pretty fucking close online.

sf4 is far from fine and no, you can never adapt to variable input delay because its an unkown number that changes, those are incredibly ignorant things to say. To properly tech throws online for sf4, you have to tech shit before your opponent even thought about throwing you sometimes. That shit is awful. You take that same timing offline and what ends up happening is that you tech throw so fast that its at the wrong damn time and you either wiff a stand throw or a crouch tech. Any game that forces input delay to the degree sf4 does online is impossible to play properly outside of Japan. Fighting games are mostly based on reactions and when input delay is there, its impossible to react properly because it will delay the shit out of your reactions.

This is what I mean about people not understanding the differences. Sf4 online is far from fine, its shit fucking garbage. I played soooo many games online hoping it could be good and the timings I had to adapt to were preposterous. Teching throws before any throw animation singled you to do so. Proper shoryuken AA timing online would make you have offline trade SRK timing and fuck punishing any bad footsie. To punish some moves online you had to swing so early that offline it would make actually run into the pokes @ times if you tried the same timing. Not to mention that the input delay changes on a frame by basis. Sometimes its 7 frames, other times its 15+ how the fuck are you supposed to “play” like that?

anyone who says sf4 online is good\great\fine is saying its good\great\fine to play big ass tournaments offline with laggy TV’s and you know what, tournaments don’t use TV’s that have input delay.

why you ask? because the input delay prevents the game from being played properly. If TV’s with input delay prevent the game from being played properly offline, why in the holy fuck does it magiclaly make sense that online input delay is any better? as a community, we strive to make sure we don’t have anything that causes lag and if the net code forces it, its fucking awful.

there is no better explanation for why input delay is bad than this. Its a perfectly written explanation by mike Z who developed skull girls. So you’re getting a veteran player perspective mixed with a video game developer perspective. Where as Ono\capcom crew don’t know the first thing about playing properly. They fucking suck as players.

http://skullgirls.com/2011/09/skullgirls-ggpo-and-you/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=skullgirls-ggpo-and-you

*-and thus the game feels “laggy.”Any extra input lag means bad news for playing fighting games – it may mean you can’t react to visual cues, can’t tech throws properly, or can’t perform difficult combos… *

-If you practice online, you can certainly get used to playing with lag, but this isn’t ideal, either – this practice won’t apply as well to in-person matches or tournaments because the extra lag isn’t there offline. All of your combo timing will be off, reacting to things will seem harder, and certain tricks or tactics you have learned simply won’t work anymore because the other player isn’t able to properly react in time.

Again I see where your coming from, your entire post has valid opinions but not everyone shares the same experiences as you. Seven to fifteen+ frames of variable input delay?! That sounds horrendous, not able to tech throws without preemptively inputting the command? That is not a problem I’ve encountered. SF4 is a simple game and the slight input delay that I get online works for this kind of game. Overheads take half a day to connect, your given a quarter of a day to tech a throw, and “mix-ups” feel almost non existent and are predictable in most scenarios. It’s because of this that I refuse to play most fighters online and this game is the exception.

I understand what “good” netcode is but SFxT doesn’t work well for me. Walk up throw is way more effective in this game online than in SF4 due to what feels like stricter timing on the throw tech and my opponent instantly appearing in front of me at times. Anti airs are ineffective because my opponent is in the air at one moment and on the ground the next and already attacking me, and sometimes my combos won’t register on their side so in the middle of me doing a combo a moment later I’m in the middle of theirs.

Now I don’t have the best connection in the world but even if I did have a solid connection I still think I would encounter the same problems as I do now. Just not as frequently. In the end lag free offline play is the best way to play any game and that is the only proven fact.

[Wikum]

I understand what “good” netcode is but SFxT doesn’t work well for me. Walk up throw is way more effective in this game online than in SF4 due to what feels like stricter timing on the throw tech and my opponent instantly appearing in front of me at times.

imo it’s a ton easier to tech in sfxt than it is in sf4. i was having trouble at first, but it was because the timing has changed. the trick is that you have to time it a lot later than you do it in sf4. i just got out of an overseas game (england-norway) and my opponent and i were pretty much teching at will. i’m pretty sure there’s more available frames to tech throws in sfxt than there is in sf4, but i’m not a frame guru, so don’t take that as gospel. someone else might be able to chime in and give you the proper stats.

[Rabbit2k7]

Maybe its me, but I have 15mb down and 1mb up net, and every single match lags. Every. Single. Last. One.

[Wonderswan]

Maybe its me, but I have 15mb down and 1mb up net, and every single match lags. Every. Single. Last. One.

Close your porn torrents.

If that doesn’t work, yell at your mom to get off netflix. You’ve got serious gaming to do.

[MaggotSai]

So I just got my first online match that ran as smooth as online has ever been in any game for me and based on his ID name I’m assuming hes a local. Oh and before everyone gets on me about stating that it was smooth, I must also state that there was little to no input delay.

[shoultzula]

Maybe its me, but I have 15mb down and 1mb up net, and every single match lags. Every. Single. Last. One.

sigh…

its p2p so your connection as well as your opponents matter. If both people have 15mb down but you’re playing from USA to cambodia, you’re going to be fucked.

I can’t believe how computer illiterate some of you guys are. The matchmaking is terrible, it will choose awful connections if no good ones are available. Use SRK to find some locals\state players or do a 500 mile radius. Specifically ask for non wireless connections and people that don’t share a connection over a router. Those are the best circumstances for good games.

you’re not supposed to have a good connection to everyone. That technology doesn’t exist.

[shoultzula]

So I just got my first online match that ran as smooth as online has ever been in any game for me and based on his ID name I’m assuming hes a local. Oh and before everyone gets on me about stating that it was smooth, I must also state that there was little to no input delay.

knowing how to use roll back properly creates the most ideal matches right? =)

I think that part of the problem with people on here is that they don’t know anything about computers and think that USA to Cambodia should be playable. Those same people are then forming an opinion with 0 education on the topic. I’m not claiming that I know everything about net code, I wish I did, but I sure as hell know more than the average person because I did a ridiculous amount of HW on it.

city, neighboring cities, then some type of radius for extra cities. GGPO starts to break down 130-150 MS. Even if 2 people have god like connections, the distance starts to become a factor and will start to roll back. Which is why the damn net code should allow a MS display rather than a retarded bar system that is incredibly qualitative. MS is a physical number that describes the distance telling me shit is green bar tells me nothing other than the bar is green. Its green to what Capcom deems as green which can be a 200ms connection which on GGPO starts to break down. So players get tricked into thinking the net code is bad.

man that bar was green!!! I had the best connection possible!!! this game is ass online!!!