Yep, got you covered with that meaty f.HK situation in my previous video. Honestly, meaty f.HK is SO GOOD. The frame advantage isn’t the greatest, but the positioning that Nash gets is probably my favorite thing ever.
I haven’t done any extensive testing to see what Nash can do after evading the reversal attacks, but I do know that he’s safe against them. It’s interesting to see that Nash can actually convert afterwards depending on the reversal. All in all, the situation is awful for most characters (and all characters when they don’t have any/enough meter). Definitely going to try the nj.HK later. :tup:
Also, I’m fairly certain that Nash can get a similar setup midscreen after crush counter cr.HK. Haven’t really tested its viability against the entire character (because I’m struggling to get the recordings in training mode correct), but if I find where I wrote it down, I’ll be sure to post it.
Don’t recall seeing this setup here, I don’t have em all memorized. Here is a cheeky setup:
(corner) - Forward throw - EX Sonic Boom.
On quick rise OR backrise it trades with a 3F normal allowing a combo into sHP, counterhits 4F.
On no-rise - dash - crLP counterhits 3F lights and combos to B+MK.
–
Gimmick setup
[No rise] - (Mid screen or corner) - Forward Throw - MP TA - crHP
CHs 3F normals.
I’ve been working crMP - B+MK - MP Sonic boom into my gameplan more when I can’t do TA or Scythe. MP Boom is only -5 vs -7 for LK Scythe and the B+MK - MP Boom is still a true block string from almost max range. Even point blank the MP Boom pushes further mid screen. Example, point blank B+MK - Boom doesn’t get tagged by Necalli EX DP while LK Scythe does. crMP - B+MK - MP Boom is safe from Cammy’s super mid screen but LK Scythe is punished. The best you can be with MP Boom still as a true string is -4F making it quite hard to punish, even in the corner if you have perfect spacing it lets you block a HP or EX DP by Ken. You can even block an EX DP during his V-trigger mid screen with a perfectly spaced B+MK - MP Boom, never works in the corner however.
Just a tip for something I haven’t seen much. It is, however, less chip than LK Scythe.
Does anyone know any meaty setups for st. MK? I want to experiment with it, and on paper it has the same last active frame as cr. HP (10th frame), yet all of the last frame cr. HP setups I know don’t seem to change st. MK’s frame data whatsoever… Very strange, do other moves behave this way as well? What’s the deal? I can’t seem to gain any advantage from doing a meaty st. MK.
Am I doing something wrong? cr. HP and st. MK share the same last frame meaty… So what’s going on?
Not sure what you’re doing wrong, but you can definitely gain extra advantage doing it meaty. Just tested and the combos you would expect to work after lk SS dash on quickrise do work - st.mk cr.lp or CH st.mk b.mk/cr.mp.
What about being +2 on block on last meaty frame? That’s what I was testing; Meaty st. Mk on block to experiment with the non-existant pushback on block on st.mk.
But I always remained 0 on block no matter how meaty…
I can confirm st. MK is either bugged or designed this way:
It functions properly and normally like all other moves in this game do when meatied. +4 hit / +6 CH on last active frame (10th frame)
But on block, the move is broken, or something. It always stays at 0 on block, not even +1 or +2. It’s ALWAYS 0 on block.
This makes me sad, because I wanted to do some unorthodox setups with it. But I’m pretty damn sure the move is bugged on block.
Yeah, I was just testing to see if this is true, and it does seem to always be 0 on block. Does it really have 3 active frames like the frame data suggests? Or, maybe it’s related to having a unique block animation, but I don’t think other moves have this problem.
Fairly certain that all moves function that way if they have a preset animation on block, just like how El Fuerte’s just bomb worked or how Blanka’s ball worked. The recovery animation is the same regardless when during the move it is blocked.
Edit: Previously wrote a whole essay explaining in detail how meaties work but figured you know, so here’s a short version instead of how st. MK should behave.
All moves have “preset animations on block”, the recovery frames are the same, that’s why meaties work like meaties do.
If you do cr. HP on last active frame (2nd active, frame 10), you are granted 1 extra frame advantage on block/hit/CH: +3/+6/+8 -> +4/+7/+9
But if you do st. MK on the last active frame (3rd active, frame 10), you are granted 2 extra frame advantage, except on block because ???
So it goes from: +0/+2/+4 -> +0/+4/+6
No normals in any fighting game afaik behave like this. You do realize the only way for a move to behave like this is, is if the move applied a different amount of blockstun on every active frame: 18 blockstun / 17 / 16. But afaik no moves have ever done that before in any SF game.
So the move is either specifically designed this way or it’s a bug. I’ve never heard of a normal applying different amounts of blockstun only (and not hitstun, it applies hitstun normally the same on every active frame just like all other moves in any SF game do).
The recovery is the same yeah, that’s why it shouldn’t be +0 on block when meatied, it should be +2. I think you’re confusing recovery frames with blockstun / hitstun. Because if it had the same recovery regardless of when it hit, then it would be +2 on block, not +0.
Mika’s st.MP also has that bug, if it is indeed a bug. It’s -2/+7 and has 3 active frames, so it should be possible to make it +0/+9, but no matter what setup I use I’m always negative after a blocked st.MP. It’s strange. It really pissed me off because a neutral st.MP would be ridiculously powerful against characters without three frame lights.