Your options when you are getting pressured is to hold that shit because somewhere along the line you made a bad decision. V reversal is the price you have to pay to escape the pressure and get back to a range that is more comfortable for you. Against cross ups you are also completely fucked. You have the option to just block and V reversal out or try to challenge their cross up with stand jab. Be aware though that you are taking a risk that if you win they take 30 and if you lose you take 300 or more.
I agree with almost everything you said, though Nash isn’t completely helpless against crossups. If your reactions are on point, you can challenge with air-to-airs. I’ve had success with j.HP, j.MP, j.HK, j.LP, and air throws against crossups. It’s a much better option than st.LP. If you’re too slow with your air-to-air, what usually happens is you just get counter-hit and air-reset.
That is good info to know. I need to try those options out. I have also had success recently with using bazooka knee to pass under them and just avoid the cross up.
The cross ups that I find most challenging are when I am getting up from a knockdown and they are already in the air above me. can you still challenge those with early air to airs?
Never been in such a situation myself so I can’t say for sure. Probably not. Nash’s dash seems to go pretty low so you could try dashing under like how SF4 Cody can dash under non-meaty crossups.
In my opinion, it depends on what you want to do. If you intend to keep that updated, make a new thread. If not, just post it here so that we see it now. It will probably be out of date by the time this thread is full of comments, anyway.
I have problem with frame traps get frametraped alot. How to deal with it? What are Nash’s frame traps?
Frame data is your friend here. I can’t check in the lab at the moment, but looking at frame data, here are a few frame traps you can try out:
st.LP/st.LK into st.MP
[details=Spoiler]These 2 light normals are all +3 on block. st.MP has 6f of startup so it would beat any 3f normal in the game. I did not include cr.LP because it is +2 on block therefore a 3f normal would beat out your st.MP. If you are against a character with no 3f normal then cr.LP into st.MP would be a viable frame trap.
[/details]
any light normal, into b.MK
cr.MP into b.MK
Spoiler
b.MK has 5f startup so any move which is +2 or +3 would be a good start for a frame trap into b.MK. Note that b.MK has shorter range than cr.MP and st.MP so do test these out.
EX Sonic Boom (1st shot) into b.MK (corner only)
[details=Spoiler] EX SBs first shot is +2 on block so same logic as above. Outside corner though it pushes the opponent out of b.MK range.
One thing I’ve been doing that I’ve shamelessly stolen from Infiltration’s stream is doing:
(In the corner) cr.MP (blocked), b.MK xx EX SB.
b.MK xx EX SB is my hit confirm. If they pressed a button and get hit by the b.MK xx EX SB, I will confirm into cr.LP xx LK SS/EX SS/EX TA. If they blocked the b.MK, the EX SB will allow me to frame trap with b.MK xx EX SB again if I’m not shy to spend the meter, or just b.MK or jab to be safe. If your reactions are really good, you can probably confirm off the b.MK alone into HK SS (this is what I’m currently practicing) [/details]
cr.HP into st.MP
Spoiler
cr.HP is risky to throw out outside of setups because of its 9f startup, but it is +3 on block and you can frame trap into anything that has 6f of startup or less. However, if I’m not mistaken st.MP is the only normal that will be in range from the pushback on cr.HP.
Any version of Moonsault into b.MK
Spoiler
LK and EX Moonsault are both +1 on block so you can frame trap into b.MK **ONLY **against characters that don’t have a 3f normal. MK and HK are +2 and +3 respectively so you can frame trap against 3f normals. Moonsault is difficult to utilize for frame trap setups though unless you are sure they will not be able to anti air you.
As for dealing with frame traps from other characters, Nash doesn’t have a 3f normal or an invincible reversal, so the answer is to just block and be patient. Do not mash buttons by any means as any frame trap would result in a counter hit. Either wait for a move you can punish or wait for a move that can safely be v-reversal’d.
I feel like nash folds under pressure.
Another thing. Sonic move is frustrating me, first tine I used it I was killed by bison when he wasn’t even facing me. Then in a mirror match, I did it and wiffed a grab because I thought it was close enough.
You think that’s bad - Was playing some Battle Lounge against my friends Ryu.
He activates Denjin mode and starts charging his fireball.
As Nash I decide “I don’t want to block that, Imma just zip behind him”.
From behind I press cr.HP so I can get some real damage when suddenly, I get hit.
The damn fireball, which went in the direction it was supposed to, managed to hit me. I’m assuming it’s to do with cr.HP pushing forwards as they let go of the fireball but I was salty as hell.
First answer is obviously “don’t let the rush down get to you, stop it before”. That includes learning not to throw unsafe sonic booms, learning your distances very well for anti-airing with c.mp and c.hp (w-o meter) or ex-scythe (with meter). These two come with experience and cold blood.
Second answer is learn to alternate block forward and backward to guard against successive cross-ups, learn to recognize patterns between throws/frame-traps. That also comes with experience.
You can always mash an ex-scythe during the small intervalls in your opponent’s rush down. It’s VERY unsafe, might cost you a round, but to do it early in the game will tell your opponent that he’d better watch out.
When you get your v-gauge, you get a safe way out with v-reversal. So practice that one.
Highly disagree with this part. EX Scythe has 6f of startup and has 0 invincibility. You would rarely get a 6f gap in the opponent’s rushdown if he isn’t brainlessly throwing out random normals unless maybe he walks up to throw you. In both cases (random normals or walk up throw), if you really want to press a button, it is better to jab confirm into LK Scythe (st.LP, st.LP xx LK SS). At worst you get hit out of the jab (same case as EX Scythe but you save a bar of meter). If you’re lucky or you time it right, you can hit him out of a random normal and confirm into LK SS or make him block the jab (+3 on block) and just don’t let the LK SS rip.
I’ve noticed that the question of Anti Airs tends to come up a fair amount so I made this short video. Trying to get to grips with my editing software so I can make a decent video but for now -
Nice. Bit surprise how well st.MK hits when the dummy jumped in so deep.
Yeah, I was trying to get the different timings on each anti air so I could show the angles of them. (Which is why I did them all a few times)
St.MK performed even better than I expected to be honest. I really didn’t expect it to hit so high above Nash’s head.
I’ve found that if you see someone who is crossup happy, whiff one of his normals that moves Nash forward. Like f.mk or f.lk. It moves him out of position of the crossup so it whiffs overhead.
was putting in a lot of time with nash for the first time tonight and had a really nice set with a karin player from japan (connection was smooth as hell considering i’m on the west coast).
here was my personal highlight lol
Currently watching the master Infiltration right now.Haha.His Nash is SERIOUS
Use the back roll wake up or quick rise wake up to try to avoid the cross up pressure. Vary between the two of those also so you don’t become predictable
Not sure if this is common knowledge but EX FA gives you back health…
1:48:56 in Infiltrations archived stream from yesterday.