wow.
Divekicks don’t recover until you land, which means frame advantage is variable, depending on how far from the ground you are. I don’t know why any frame data would include it; it doesn’t make a whole lot of sense.
:eek: It’s to spawn worst-case scenario conjecture that is so polarizing that people will either quit or dedicate their lives to finding ways around it.
All air moves should really just have hit stun, block stun (For it being the first hit) as opposed to how + or - it is on hit or block. That way people can determine for themselves if they connect near the ground versus connecting high in the air etc.
Also, does anyone have a chart or equation or something that determines how something’s hit stun changes based on:
Whether the executing character is in normal jump or super jump state
and whether the opponent is on the ground or in the air.
IE super jump C with viper has dramatically longer hit stun against an opponent in the air than normal jump C.
Zero’s 6C gives you forever to link an attack after it if it’s against an aerial opponent.
I tested it with Doom and Storm so I can at least say it doesn’t work that way for them. It’s probably just a typo in the wiki.
Like you mentioned in your post, hit stun for sj and normal jump are different. The same goes for blockstun. A good example is Wolverine. Regular jump dive kick can be thrown, but super jump dive kick is the one that gives +8 on block and cannot be thrown. While the frame data chart is extremely good, unfortunately it’s not complete in this case.
edit:
whoops we’re talking about two different things here. But yeah it’s interesting to note the differences between the sj version and nj version.
I will money match you for 30$, a meal at fatburger, and “jumping on the grenade” duty. FT5.
What gets me upset is this:
Player A has Wesker and Player B has Dark Pheonix activating Level 3. Now Wesker CAN use his projectile counter and eat Dark Pheonix with barbecue sauce. But I do not see players do this at all…
his projectile counter moves him a very specific distance and won’t work at most of the areas she’s shooting him from.
so its more of them being scared instead of making her chips. if ya know the distance and u see the fireball coming dash into it and then counter and then blam!
Assuming she doesn’t super, teleport, or any of the myriad of options that destroy that, Taskmaster’s is infinitely more efficient at accomplishing the task.
Yeah if you’re too far away he’ll teleport into the projectile instead of actually hitting her. Plus the projectile counter has 5 frames of start up and if you whiff it the contra fireballs will hit you and you die. Still is worth doing though because if you get it she dies.
It’s a decent idea, but the 5 frame startup and the -5 on block are killer when her crouch A is 3 Frames.
It should work much better on… Tron 
It works but you have to time it so that it hits her within half a second. Most likely around midscreen area. Even if she tries to super, Tiger Uppercut H has 18 frames of invincibility. It only works in very specific cases, ground to ground (and you have to be a set distance) or she’s in the air very close to the ground (and you also have to be at the correct distance). It’s impractical because a good Phoenix player doesn’t toss fireballs like that and you can’t always get the right distance due to the randomness of a live match…
Spiderman is the new bullshit. The best hard counter to Phoenix so far, and extremely stupid on his own with the right assists. Totally belongs in S tier.
Jajajaja, you a funny guy!
Wait, you are kidding, right?
Right?
okay good so im not the only person that happens to. shits retarded it gets my vote for best air - air normal in the game mainly because of that
Answer me this:
- Are you a Phoenix player?
- Have you played against a solid Spiderman player ever since the new maximum spider XF UWT was found? (Hint- He can DHC from any super that hits Phoenix)
This pretense that Spider-Man is an ass character is totally wrong but so is the other that he is godlike. I think he is low B or high C in the tier listings. He absolutely HAS to have assist to be a viable character but he is highly mobile, has a low to the ground hitbox, has a true reset with the right assist, and is decently damage.
I am a Spidey player and I can tell you just because of this new discovery he isnt S tier.
Edit: He’s like high mid he doesnt need assist to be good