So you admit this thread is useless?
Well I can believe the balance but I think that as things go on, people will see that although some people may be low tier or god tier or whatever, there won’t be such a disparity between tiers as has been seen in the past. The top tiers will probably be easier to establish than lower tiers as everyone you’d suggest for bottom tiers would be highly contentious.
If I say:
Top Tier
Dante, Wesker, Magneto, Pheonix
Middle Tier
Others
Bottom Tier
Thor, Arthur
Fail Tier
Galactus
Arthur and Thor aren’t that bad as characters, they’re just not that great. Arthur has some neat tricks and Thor can still beat any of the top tiers I mentioned. I could probably suggest others who might be low tier but they’re not bad. I think Zero, Haggar and She-Hulk could be low tier, but i’m probably wrong on some counts.
I could also contest Phoenix as Top Tier, she’s dangerous but gimmicky. The other Top Tiers are just dangerous characters but that doesn’t mean they’re unstoppable killing machines.
Can everyone stick Dante/Wesker on the top of their lists so Capcom nerf them. Their teleports wreck my shit.
Thx xx
Yeah, I think I wrote my post at the same time as you, so I didn’t see yours. Interesting to see we pretty much agreed on the top. Given what we know about the game right now, I think I agree with the rest of your list too; however, it’s a lot easier/more likely to find tricks that will make a character rapidly move up the list (like practical infinites or the DHC trick) than it is to find something that will rapidly move a character down.
The other thing I forgot to write was that a traditional tier list won’t be as meaningful as in other games for Marvel just because of the team element. A character like Thor can be useful if you can keep him on the sidelines because he has a reasonably good assist, and can probably kill you when tagged in with the DHC trick, then tagged out after the kill. However, he remains a pretty sub-par point character. How do you account for something like that in a general tier list? You can’t really, unless you make separate lists of point characters and support characters; the latter would have to account for more than just DHCs, and would be very difficult to make.
I also just wanna say that right now I think Doom’s Cuban Missiles is the best assist in the game. If you can safely get him on the screen, you are protected from combos for the next few seconds, which is incredible in a game where one combo can often mean a dead character.
The thread can stay, but any REAL tier list discussion would have to wait. So far, we have only seen like 2 major tournaments with a few minors mixed in between them. Though I really would like to see a assist tier list being discussed more.
This is pretty fucking pointless. I think just about every character is at least mid-high. Except for Ryu, who sucks. Cap at least has that infinite, but he doesn’t have a lot else. Plus if you want a character with a Super that beats just about everything go with the BIONIC AAAAARRRRRMMMMMM! I still wouldn’t say he’s garbage tier like Ryu.
Not only that we were wrong in a number of cases, from Fei to Adon.
Lol, once again, that incident comes to mind.
how is X-23 gimmicky?
and Phoenix isnt low tier
Only the popular characters:
SS
Magneto with Sent assist (Best and most practical OCVer in the game by far)
S
Storm with Sent assist (Best overhead, lack of priority doesn’t matter when drones cover you)
Zero with Sent assist
A tier
Amaterasu, Sent, Dante, Phoenix
IMO, I think X-23 is dangerous, with the right characters backing her. I personally believe Chun Li is a perfect partner for X-23.
X-23 already has high damage loops that generate a lot of meter and carry the opponent all the way to the corner. Chun’s Legs assist boosts X-23’s combo potential up, as in the corner, it can be used in tandem with her Ankle Slicer to connect Weapon X Prime(other assists can be used for landing Weapon X as well.) After that DHC into Chun’s super(Hyokusen) for an air leg loop and bam, 1.mil damage. It’s also cost effective as the whole combo needs two bars, but X-23 generates 1 bar from her loop(the game auto-starts you with 1 bar anyway), which gives you two bars, and after the meter spent on the two hypers, Chun’s loops leave you with about over a bar and a half; you were better off meter-wise than when you started. And you can do it again and again. Against characters with average health and below, she can theoretically mow them down if she gets a single hit.
X-23’s Weapon X Prime provides the DHC glitch for other characters, her Level 3 is really powerful, especially if you use assists to lock people down(like Chun’s assist). A command throw that can lead to more loops, Mirage Feint allows ground cross-ups and general mix-ups. She can feint her strings for CH set-ups. Plus nasty resets in the corner too.
I’d say her weaknesses are that her normals don’t appear to be all that, lack of air mobility without using her Talon special, which can be risky and it can be tough for her to get in, though her wavedash is very good.
Feel free to disagree, that’s the point of this topic.
Are you seriously putting Storm in low tier? I disagree. I’m not one to care much about tier lists or about creating a team exclusively of high tier characters but come on, Storm is easily one of the best characters in the game, especially with the right assist.
X23 high damage not really. If you can’t do 850 when starting a combo with 1 bar no xfc your not a high damage char. X23 does what 400 500.
So how many majors do people need to win with she hulk on point before people realize she’s s or s+ tier. Her damage is up there with sent and she’s got crazy karable comand grabs. The best resets in the game and an otg assist. Oh yeah 1100 health. She can get rushed down no multi hit no armor her normals don’t have the best aa properties. I would say because of her ridiculas damage she has a match up advantage vs everyone except zero wolverie who have an advantage and wesker skrull dorm and phoenix with level 5 and xfc are even. If a char has less than 900k life she hulk has the advantage.
I personally think magneto has too little life for how slow his normals are and his damage output is really only so so till you get the level 3. He’s really good but not godlike.
Sent is way over rated. His damage is just easy to do and people are to lazy to figure out how to punish his bs. " but in xfc lvl 3 he’s so good." I can hear people saying. Here’s a tip everyones so good in xfc lvl 3 not just sent. Drones are god like though so he’s still on my team.
I think you’re heavily underestimating M.O.D.O.K., Iron Man, Thor, Joe, and Viper.
M.O.D.O.K, Iron Man, and Viper simply have too many useful tools to be anything lower than B. We just haven’t really seen anyone try and play them to their potential, yet.
Thor and Joe simply outclass the likes of Ryu, Hulk, Spider-Man, Captain America, and Hsien-Ko.
EDIT: I suspect that in about a year, the top tier characters of MvC3 will be Dormammu, Iron Man, M.O.D.O.K., Phoenix, C. Viper, and Sentinel.
What’s impressed me so far is that the top-tier and mid-tier don’t seem too far apart, and we’ve also seem some mid-tier characters get serious play in tournaments because of some abusable element about their game. I think Tron would be a good example of that - she lacks a lot of tools on her own and struggles if she’s on point or the last one standing, but her assist is still that good.
There are only a few characters that leave you scratching your head at the moment.
I’ll say that Super Skrull is good, he’s just not big in the US. On the same weekend as Final Round, there was a tournament in Britain where a Skrull team guided by a player named Zade placed first (link: http://shoryuken.com/f380/check-out-my-skrull-play-skrull-video-thread-267097/#post10391816). I’m hoping it at least gets people curious.
Indeed. The only characters at the moment that I think are hopeless are Ryu, Captain America, and Hsien-Ko. The first two are obvious, but, Hsien-Ko might not be to most consider how cool Dark Force Senpu-Bu is as an assist. Of course, considering you could pick Haggar or Tron instead if you want an awesome invincible assist, Hsien-Ko is rather pointless.
EDIT: Skrull will be considerably more awesome once we see more keepaway teams out there. Considering how high damage is in this game, I suspect that we’ll begin to see a lot of ranged teams in the near future. When that starts to happen, Skrull will be a great meta-pick since he eats zoners for breakfast.
EDIT 2: On a side note, I suspect the falling characters will quite simply disappear from the tournament scene once the game has developed further:
Captain America
Spider-Man
Hulk
Wolverine
X-23
Chris
Morrigan
Ryu
Hsien-Ko
Felicia
She-Hulk
Chun-Li
Yeah, I put She-Hulk, X-23, and Wolverine in there. While strong at the moment, I have a strong suspicion that once everyone knows how to deal with these characters they won’t have enough redeeming qualities to warrant running them in tournies still. It’s a shame, since She-Hulk is by far my favorite character in the game.
This is a huge case of “It’s the players, not the character”. She Hulk is obviously good, but even in the hands of the two most talented players in the country, she gets blown up sometimes in difficult matchups. She can get zoned out really well. She has tough times getting around drones/projectiles w/o superjumping (i.e. she can’t really).
In combofiend vs marn, she hulk got taken out every time.
Also, remember that Justin has Ammy/Tron behind she hulk and combo has Task/Spencer.
See, that’s the thing about magneto, he doesn’t HAVE to rush you down. He’s got the best projectile in the game with crazy mobility to go with it. Seriously, just play Magneto with hidden missiles and shuma laser and see how hard it is for 50% of the cast to get in.
Bonus, magneto combos hurt like hell, actually. Base fierce loop does 500k without super. If he’s using meter, it’s for level 3 or for the DHC trick and your character is dead. Magneto is definitely tops.
Agreed 100%. however **sentinel’s **team factors (drones, counter->hard drive, DHC glitch, assist killing) put him in the top 10 easily.
I put **MODOK **in the “can be good w/ the right team”. I.E. you have to build a team AROUND modok for him to be effective. He also gets beat up really bad by the teleporters and Ammy.
Iron Man I’m actually giving him the benefit of the doubt. I think he’s crap. Bad buttons and meh supers (shinkuu’s outclass in every way)… and i’ve yet to see people do well with him, despite a good amount of usage.
**Joe **can only be annoying at best. Flash M. and Josh Wong have busted him out, and it was not impressive at all. Low health, low damage, not very fast… yuck.
**Thor **I like as a design, but there’s nothing he can do that she hulk doesn’t do better, really. Sure he hits hard, but how do you get there? The DHC trick works for him, but Damage isn’t thors main problem.
C.Viper is ass. Kinda slow for a rush down character, no life, mixups aren’t that great, and a complete meter hog. Why do the EX moves take a full meter? They’re good, but not level 1 super good. Here’s all you need to know about viper in MvC3. There are a ton of very talented Viper players in SSF4 who are playing MvC3 (Marn, Flash, RyRy, Sanford)… none of them have Viper on their teams. That says a lot.
I totally agree. I think it’s pretty wide open on my list all the way down to list E. Any of those characters can rock your shit w/ the right team combinations.
Btw: I expect zone/keepaway characters (Chris, Deadpool, Arthur, Doom, Dormammu) to get a LOT better with the Shuma mystic ray assist. That thing is ridiculous.
Yeah, but Hsien-Ko locks the opponent down AND obscures the screen. That’s something she has over Tron and Haggar.
And I think rating Assists might be fine for the moment, just because that’s usually easy to understand.
You must not have fought a good Wolverine or She Hulk yet. Chun Li and Morrigan both seem like they could be pretty good if people do their best combos in matches, but it seems no one has put the effort into them with easier to pick up characters out there right now.
But yeah Wolverine… no way in hell he’s bad. His mixups and damage are top notch, and he pretty much ignores zoning with C Berserker slash. Also, amazing RTSDness.
I don’t even think there are any bad characters in MVC3 really. Except maybe Hsien Ko but even she can win, I just think her movement severely hurts her.