I don’t think FRC -> force break is that great an idea either tbh. If it’s like how force breaks are currently, it would change the animation, which would allow it to be read earlier. The other thing it would change is the length of time you have to decide whether you want to FRC. Granted, the amount of time that you have from startup to FRC-point is usually pretty short, but important, decision-changing things can happen during that time. Things that might change your decision to FRC or not.
I think the best option is to widen the FRC window. Slashback I really don’t care about.
EDIT:
OR, it could be a different input entirely that doesn’t require timing at all. Something like “Hold the button to FRC at the FRC point, let go for no FRC”. That way you could also buffer a negative edge without having to spaz on the buttons, you could still decide whether or not you wanted to FRC up to the FRC point, the FRC window would stay the same (actually it might shrink because it would become a single frame that checks if the button is down), and it wouldn’t be hard at all!
But it can potentially make FRC’s broke; as SJ said, widening the window makes the FRC leak into active frames.
Imagine Order Sol’s Bandit Revolver FRC. He could make the move FRC on hit, for hit confirm into combo; FRC on block to keep himself safe; or FRC so the move doesn’t go active at all (as it is now) and begin general throw/bait/delay mix-up’s =/ GG’s pressure game is near overwhelming already, this could make things unbearable; not to mention that it being easy doesn’t give FRC’s nearly enough downside for the reward, and this example is one of many…it’s bad balance. Not to mention everyone flocking to Potemkin cos of easy PB frc lol. Being able to hit or feign makes pressure alot more safe, alot more confusing for defending player, and makes hit confirms too easy. It also adds a whole bunch of annoying 50/50’s that serve no purpose but to remove skill for randomization even further.
Imagine Stroke The Big Tree if it could hit or feign; being able to delay GF frc; being able to adjust when you can Dandy step FRC; Jam’s 236,236S; Axl’s Rensen FRC if it could hit or feign; Baiken’s already unseeable Youzansen; Millia’s disc etc etc etc.
The game will be watered down to a state where people are pressuring in the same way with all these same easy, safe, hit confirm mix-up’s; taking away almost all match-up diversity, risk/reward diversity, pressure diversity/character diversity and you will be left with some sorry ass gameplay that will make you question why FRC’s are even limited to one move or are even in the game in the first place, because then you truly will be left with a useless system.
Like, FRC’s aren’t hard for no reason. It’s the way they have to be; people are too quick to dismiss things has being ‘needlessly complicated’. If you take away or change FRC’s you’re gonna have to redo the whole games’ system mechanics…like slowing the game down drastically, so that moves have much longer, lower than average start-up time…lol, that would make GG one of the worst fighting games in existence.
I had the same idea as Kyuubi regarding FRC’s. You can just make an 8-10f window to push the FRC button, and it auto-activates at the same point as before.
Really don’t see why people are freaking out about the “easier” comment. Even if you made Guilty Gear easier on the technical aspect, it would still be a difficult game. Then he didn’t even specify how easy, only that FRCs and Slashbacks wouldn’t be included. You could take a few things out here and there to make it more approachable, but still a difficult game.
Hmmmm, unlike most people I am not sure that online play will help GGXXAC. Online play has never been the thing that cures all ills, if anything it tends to make community dynamic worse by locking out new players after a few months (save match making systems that defer the effect, but don’t stop it from happening).
That said, it is the future… like it or not. It will make the hardcore take noticed which for the Guilty Gear series (which has always been kind of niche), is something that it needs at this moment. And moving the game to HD would be something of a lost cause at this point, but that is more personal than anything else (I don’t care all that much for HD… I am happy with a game even if it comes in 480p, so long as it looks good and plays good, I am good).
Given a new direction for a new game, I am not going to speculated. The one thing that stands out is that Pachi seems convinced that the series does need to simplify itself a bit to approach new gamers. I am fine with that at the moment, since… for any series… new players means new life to the game and series. We’ve seen this effect with Street Fighter multiple times (the start of the Alpha series, SF3 and SF4), and after playing AC… Guilty Gear is rather due for that itself, if only for a rather big series reboot.
That said, ummmm… Can I get some GGvBB before a series reboot? I would kill for some of that craziness…
I honestly think that developers wear the “easy” banner on their shoulder sometimes. It’s very possible to make a game accessible without taking out advance tactics. Marvel is the perfect example of this. Casual players love Marvel, but they aren’t playing high level Marvel. Still they tend to think they are decent in the game despite that. Why? Because the game let’s you do enough and gives you the illusion you are playing correctly. You can mash, be focused on magic series, and ocassionally you’ll do an accidental combo. It’s more than enough to make casuals believe they can play.
Guilty Gear is a game that is easy to play. Again there is a major difference between casual play and high level play. Guilty Gear was notorious for letting you do combos as long as your opponent never techs. All of this was easy to do.
I mean, years ago me and a few friends got into Guilty Gear. We had no idea how to play, we had no idea what FRCs were. We just did techable combos on each other and overdrives. Our strats even revolved around instant kills. That's the type of scrubs we were. We enjoyed Guilty Gear as long as we could play it wrong. And we thought we were really good in the game.
Eventually I started to try to level up by lurking dustloop, and finding out about FRCs and such. We started out a group of 6 playing GG. But when I started to do more advanced things like IDs, FRCs, oki traps, and learned real untechable combos (and how to tech at all for that matter) my friends started droppping off. A group of 6 became a group of 2. But the other 4 guys still love the game as long as they can play it ultra scrubby.
GGXXAC may be a really technical game, but it doesn’t mean scrubs can’t enjoy it. When I was a noob I enjoyed the game, and it never occured to me that I sucked. I see tons of Marvel scrubs on PSN, and play them everyday. They probably have no idea they suck either. And these games are technical. But as long as you can give a scrub the illusion he’s doing something, he doesn’t care.
The issue is when a game wears it’s complexity as a badge of honor. SF3 always presented itself as a complex game. And while it’s less technical that GGXX, less casual players like it. Why? Because you can’t do ridiculous stuff by just mashing. You have to have execution to do anything worthwhile. And that’s why noobs don’t get into SF3 and never have.
Nominated for an article, that right there speaks my mind on a silver platter. In addition to that, companies need to focus more on the marketing aspect when trying to appeal to casual players rather than doing make shift dumbing down in their games.
It is not even a question of finding a middle ground, rather it is findin a way to fool the shitty players that their playing not playing shitty.
