KOF XI Thread :: Ver 2.0

you’re right, I forgot about the saving shift. okay, scratch everything I said about Duolon then.

and okay, Ash is more of an annoy-you-to-death character than “beast”, sure. But I’ve still never seen any videos that made me think Ash was anywhere close to the top, and the Ash’s I’ve played against didn’t do anything to convince me either.

and I still wholeheartedly disagree with King being D rank. Sure I’m biased since I play her all the time, but I honestly think she’s at least around the low B’s. So much potential and yet nobody plays her.

KOFXI Ash is is meant to be an annoying character. Cr.AX2 into B sommersault is all he needs. A fireball is fast and has fast recovery. I’ve played a few good Ash’s before…see in 2k3 Ash was a fireball-whore but in XI he can go rushdown or zone you with fireballs.

I think Griffon is low C. The only thing that’s been nerfed form 2k3 is his JH grab and nothing else.

i tried in some vs matches at home before…
kim ash terry

ash teams very well with kim
i fast alternated pressing strings with kim then zoning with ash’s fireball and vice-versa using terry as battery for damage/mixing up zone and rush

damn i totally screwed up my opponent (my friend a very good eiji gato mary player)

now i can understand why ash is A tier and his perfect position on the screen is far/middle distance from the opponent closing up only to try a grab or poke poke poke into sommersault
when under pressure i also tried his LDM as antiair then custom…if near corner you can land the entire custom to kill

more to come in few days…

the only sad thing is that i’ve removed shen from my team…i like him very much but he lose that bad against top tiers…against gato i can do wonders with terry but not with shen…i have to improve more :frowning:

Anyone have any Elizabeth strats/combos? I’ve been learning her together with Vanessa, and so far I only use Elizabeth as a finisher, she hardly ever starts the match, nor does any real damage during the course of the match. I’d like to get a better handle on her so she’s worth something more than just a LDM.

Also, given those two characters who’d bea good third to round out the team? I’ve had Oswald and B. Jenet in the mix, but I’m looking for that perfect fit. Anyone have any other suggestions?

I hope all you people that shit on that tier list actually play XI in the arcade with good comp. I hope you all arent just playing theory fighter and make your tiers from matches of you and your little friends or mall arcade scrubs. Cause its pretty much 97% accurate to most high level play.

yes, tier lists are a good 80% theorical when vs matches comes in
due to the fact that 2 player of the same level does not exists…

tier lists are comparison between character priority, speed, damage and matchups…

it don’t care if you’re strong or a scrub but the tier list basically say that if gato jumps athena can’t do nothing against

but the player with athena can prevent gato to jump or evade the situation in other manner
so a good athena player still kick a gato scrub ass while gato himself is a pain

take my examples with a wide meaning eh!

then you have to choose your roster only by your gamestyle…for me for example is almost impossible to pull an effective fireball zoning game so i avoid picking athena or kensou…even athena 2k2 was impossible for me to use and i switched over billy as god tier 'cause i’m good at poking
in xi i like so much to rush so i have kim as my main…and sometimes i pick gato (i hate only his godly priority 'cause i don’t wanna play cheap) but i can’t stand defensive so i avoid eiji
and so on, got the point?

About the tier list-
I don’t think Gato is an entire rank above Kula, though I do agree that he’s better in XI. Kula is overall more solid but Gato’s offense is just that much better- a bit less simple but when he can link supers off like 95% of his normals or something silly like that, he can afford to use a few different setups.

And yeah Oswald doesn’t strike me as being quite as good as those two. The unblockable closes the gap though. Let’s put it this way- if you block Oswald, most of his strings just kinda reset the situation (what’s he going to do off blocked whatever > f+A that doesn’t get him raped?) but if you block Gato, he can easily just continue pressure in a bunch of different ways until he gets his hit/throw/LDM guardbreaks in.
Plus Gato and Kula generally have better QS setups, though Oswald is probably the best of the 3 coming off a QS.

Still though… you could just play all 3 on the same team and not worry about who’s better =P

What do you guys think about team composition in this game?
Usually I stick with the good ole cvs 2 format of battery,meter,anchor. The intersting thing in this game though is the fact that you have this leader. So normally you’d think hey Leader = Anchor, but alot of times your Leader can probably make the best use of your meter as long as you know you picked a leader with a useful ldm. But then the problem is what if your leader gets beat up? Even a little bit of beating on the leader seems to dramatically shift the Judgement gauge, and when you lose your leader well ouch the judgement gauge becomes very hard to shift it seems. And then again on the other side if you land LDM you get a nice big block of judgement for you. This game actually has alot to think about with team management, so many options especially when you take into account things like who can I do the best quick switch combo with, who should I use for a leader, what order should I put my team in? I think this game deserves some serious discussion on team formation, screw teir lists, sure some characters can get owned pretty hard but it seems to me if you can get on top of someone with almost any character in the game, save for maybe athena and whip and maybe sho, you can rush down to victory as long as you know what your doing. So yeah team formation discussion time! What do you guys do? Why do you play the teams you do? What order do you use and why?

I currently play Duck/DuoLon/Ozzie or K(L) (I’m better with K but I’m slowly learning Ozzie)

I play them in that order, because duck is a really good battery and while yes he does have two amazing supers, they aren’t neccesary. Bu the thing is with Duo I never use super really except the fireball from far off to try and get in. Which is why I was thinking of either playing Duo/Duck/Ozzie or K (L) or Duck/Ozzie or K(L)/Duo. Both of these would probably solve my underuse of meter. And all of them have good quickswitch stuff (WHY IS DUCK’S SO HARD?) But the problem is I don’t know if I trust duo as often he can be hit or miss with his mixup and rush down, and if someone plays good keepout it can be hard to get real damage, which is the same as duck. So if he’s my Anchor, and I’m not at least relatively close to the other person life/judgement wise if they play smart they could keep me out. Or if I start him and someone keeps me out I may not get a chance to ever get back in. So yeah team problems what do you guys think about all this?

Also, Ramon is so bad… Lame, cause he’s fun to use, I think they were afraid he would do too much damage so they made his cr.C do very small damage, at least it’s got good range I guess.

Battery/user/anchor doesn’t work quite as well with tags and such. It makes sense in CvS2 and more traditional KoFs but not so much in XI.

Think of team dynamics more along the lines of MvC2. Who sets up what for who.
A great team will have QS options for each character with both of his/her teammates. Battery characters are nice but you really should have 2 if you have a meter-hog who doesn’t build meter well.
Order actually doesn’t matter a great deal IMHO, since you’re probably QSing people in and out all the time. The main deal with team order is just who you start, really.

Generally you should pick a leader with an LDM that can come into play often. No sense wasting leader on characters who can’t make use of it often, especially if you have other characters who can.

true that true that. Yet I never use QS combos

I’m tired so I side with both Rengoku and CrimsonDisaster. Tomorrow you guys will get me wide the fuck awake…lol.

that was the good thing about 03 u started out with full meter so you might play ur leader 1st,but there no point in 11.

duo lons LDM > ashs LDM just for the fact it can be done anywhere and requires only one skill stock (via SC or QS) and 2 bars.

only if your oppenent has NO skill bars otherwise a SS will cancel all your said meters above

its fine if they have one.

agreed. I dont believe in using Ash’s LDM kind of a gimmick to me

Syo me the money.

I am so damned tired right now. Getting raped on (still) subpar sticks by Kyo and company does not help this.

Whoever was asking about Kim. I know that a couple of people talked about it already, but Kim has horribly nasty jumping Es. His are debatably even nastier than Clark, who I surprisingly beat a lot today with Kensou. That, and as I’m sure someone else mentioned, he has invincible anti-airs (which seem to have all-around invinciblity, unlike Kyo’s low vulnerablity) and he can link two supers together, only needing “spirit stock” for one due to that damned launcher.

Besides my usual opponent (who rapes me), the only notable characters that I fought that were different than the usual Iori, Kyo, Clark, Oswald, and Leader Benimaru were a great Gai (heh) and an even better Shingo. Too bad he left after about three matches.

Oh, and fought Vanessa a lot today. Damn she’s annoying. Even though Kensou owned her for the most part via HCF+B, she did manage to KO him once.

Anyway, I guess I want to get to the main part of my post:

I like Sho. He’s quite interesting. I can see why he’s low, but damn if he isn’t fun. I swear, knocking people on their asses with the fastest special projectile in the game is loads of fun in and of itself.

He’s rather easy to get into, but there’s still a lot to using what (perhaps comparatively little) potential he has. Like realizing that his boomerangs may not hit on the way back, but they have active hitboxes until the apogee (or nadir, for the jumping ones) of their arc. (Unless, of course, they hit something before then.)

Kyouretsu Kiri (qcb+C) seems to have a quite a bit of priority, it’s just slow as hell, though it seems to always hit if cancelled into and the sluggishness can be helpful at time. It’s relatively safe, but can apparently be punished by Iori’s Deadly Flowers and probably a lot more.

Hiten Shou Ou Kyaku (dp+K) also has a quite a bit priority, though like most SNK special anti-airs, it mainly hits in front of him. Still, I haven’t seen it trade yet IIRC, meaning that it’s possibly second to Ryo’s priority.

Reppu Satsu is odd and should be used merely when it seems right (and you’re above someone). It seems to make a better air-to-air unless you’re trying to chip someone to death. Still, it seems hard to punish if only because it’s so odd and, at times, like with Kensou’s aerial qcb+P, can cross you up at times.

Asoka Kyaku (qcb+K) seems to have little other use than randomly bouncing people off walls and pressuring people with Kuuchuu Asoka Kyaku (air qcb+K), which seems to be able to done at like hop level. Regardless of what level it’s done at, it seems to also have priority and you can usually follow up if you hit people with it.

Nendou Hitsue (qcfx2+P) would probably make Sho a half a tier, if not an entire tier, if that damned charge wasn’t mandatory. That thing does a ton of damage and you cannot roll past it. Instant homing projectile from Hell? Yes please.

Gen’ei Hitsue (qcbx2+P) is kind of overrated, if only because the boomerangs seems to be “stopped” (read: keep going but losing their hit box) if they hit normal projectiles and that person can then run up and smack you since you don’t recover until the bommerangs come back. Still, it does some nice damage, you’ll probably be cancelling to it super-wise unless Nendou Hitsue becomes instant when super-cancelled, and I’m not sure where or not it can negate DMs as well.

His LDM seems rather mediocre, but it did half-damage when someone was at full health and it hits low, so… shrug

Now if only the boomerang hit on the way back or at least had two hits.

dreamy sigh

shrug Ash only “needs” 1 skill point and 2 levels to go into his LDM in the corner, which is where you’d be using it anyhow.

Umm…Ash’s LDM only needs 2 stocks and no skill points to be done at mid-screen (juggle to corner). I’ve seen it done before.

Command grab move XX run XX LDM, b~f+A XX run, b+B, (corner juggle)xN

Hence the “needs” as opposed to needs.