Cool idea. Nice bat top, too.
Thanks! It came out a lot better than I expected. I had to cut the wood thick enough to cover the outer edge all the way to the inner edge and as you guys know the plastic where the screws are located is recessed a bit on TE’s. So I super glued m6 washers in open spots in the recessed areas to make it all flush. That may not have been needed but the top now feels incredibly solid so I think it worked out.
And I do love this bat top 
As you can probably tell it’s the PAS aluminum and I also have a 3lbs spring in the Hayabusa.
Very cool indeed! Just out of curiosity why did you decide to make a wooden panel instead of moving the neutrik?
I have my stick modded with a TE-Kitty, XB1 and PS4 support all running through one Neutrik using a couple of toggle switches to go between modes. That made me uncomfortable with relocating it to the right side of the stick so I went this route instead.
Guys, good news, we will be getting levered reed switch Omrons, it will take month or two, but they will come in and should work for the Hayabusa.
I got a very nice digital caliper yesterday. I’m going to take some actual measurements of components like the actuator so that there can be more concrete info on this thing. Probably going to to take some measurements of the switch placement compared to JLF and LS-56. I’m really very curious about what actually makes the Hayabusa perform the way it does.
Awesome!. Very interested to see the results…
I’d like to give a shout-out to @teleute for the info about the JLF gate. After playing with the Hayabusa for hours last night I simply couldn’t execute certain things I normally hit every time due to it having a square gate and me not being used to it and it f’ing with my muscle memory. Today when I finished most of the rest of what I needed to get my stick setup I decided to drill out a JLF gate I had and install it on my Hayabusa per teleute’s instructions. Now I have a working circle gate and it all feels amazing now and I’m hitting everything. So the work was worth it
Also, my stick is now a tank with that oak spacer in there. I still need to shave a bit off of the plastic on the side but I might just leave it and I had to order some black 4m/30mm bolts to replace the stainless ones which is all Lowes had in stock at that length. And since the wood I used is Oak it’s pretty tough so I might just install a handle on the top to carry it since it’s now 3/4 of any inch thicker making it a bit more unwieldy. Off to the questions thread for recommendations in that department.
Spoiler
Had a moment to do a comparison to the JLF, since I finally got my hands on one.
a) JLF gate measurement: 18 mm
b) Hayabusa gate measurement: 19 mm
x) JLF actuator top diameter: 10.5 mm
y) Hayabusa actuator top diameter: 10.5 mm
Formula for calculating JLF throw:
a - x = j
Z / 2 = jt
Formula for calculating Hayabusa throw:
b - y = h
h / 2 = ht
JLF throw: 3.75 mm
Hayabusa throw: 4.25 mm
This means Hayabusa has .5 mm larger throw than JLF.
The actuators appear almost identical. I am not seeing a .5 mm difference between them. Hayabusa is slightly larger but I don’t think it’s anymore than .25 mm difference. I do not think it is enough to change anything drastically.
So, at most, the engage is, at most, .25 mm shorter on Hayabusa.
JLF PCB can be mounted in Hayabusa. This requires a mod similar to my lever mod, you will need to cut away the other side of the edge where you would normally make room for the ring shaped PCB. This means if you don’t like Hayabusa’s extra PCB poking out you could get a tad more clearance by using a JLF PCB. JLF PCB mounting within Hayabusa requires a destructive mod to Hayabusa’s body, so beware if you try to sell your Hayabusa people may not want one that’s been permanently tampered with.
The JLF gate fits on Hayabusa exactly. This means the switches have the exact same layout because the JLF gate requires the mounting nubs fit in the mounting holes within the switch. They line up perfectly, same as the stock Hayabusa gate. Which means Hayabusa has near identical engage as JLF because the switches have the same mounting measurements.
Which brings us to gate compatibility. Yes, they are full compatible. JLF gate will fit on Hayabusa perfectly but needs drilling for the screw mounts. On the other hand, Hayabusa gates can be fit to JLF by cutting off the JLF snap in tabs. Both mods are destructive to JLF parts only, in this case, the JLF gate and body.
So basically, Hayabusa is a JLF clone with .5 mm extra throw. It has higher quality materials. That’s about it.
So why do I like Hayabusa so much and not JLF? I’m not sure. Hayabusa definitely feels snappier than JLF. On top of that, the parts are of obvious quality (seriously the plastic used for JLF’s actuator is pure ass, just look at that shit) but the engage is exactly the same and it even has more throw. Now, I do not like throw, and one of the first mods I did was a no throw mod, so almost out of the box it felt like what I’m used to on Seimitsu. Secondly, I did not get into stick modding as much until I had already moved on from JLF. The most I tried to mod on JLF was no throw, which did not work. Perhaps I need to revisit JLF modding. Third, the extra throw in Hayabusa actually allows it to be more ghetto no throw mod friendly: hence, my enjoyment of using it over JLF. Which brings me to Seimitsu LS-56, I’m now also inclined to believe that once levers are thrown on a JLF, it will have the same engage and with a Hayabusa gate on it, the same throw as well.
Perhaps also, I need to calculate the throw and engages on my Seimitsu sticks, and see if they’re really all that different after all. My biggest gripes with most sticks is throw, and perhaps because of how unfriendly JLF throw modding was at the time I was simply unhappy with the stick. Toss onto that the lower tension of JLF (and stock Hayabusa) in comparison to Seimitsu, and maybe that’s why I didn’t like it.
Now that there are more mods out there, perhaps I will change my mind on JLF. Perhaps after a spring and throw tweak I might even like it a lot. Seems the case that I love Hayabusa with a spring, lever, and throw mod, maybe I could love JLF too with such mods. I think the main difference at this point between Seimitsu LS series and JLF is that Seimitsu sticks almost all have 2 of the aspects of the stick already stock that you would have to mod onto Hayabusa and JLF. Levers, and spring tension. IMO, JLF offers better pivot design over Seimitsu, and it too feels pretty damn buttery smooth now that I mess around with it. It’s one aspect I always respected about the JLF, is the pivot always felt damn good. The micro switches also are slightly higher tension, too. That is, aside from the shit plastic used on certain JLF parts and the shit gate design. This is all stuff Hayabusa excels at over JLF, it’s a damn higher quality and higher spec stick, that’s for sure.
Oh well, going to have to do some new calculations for my Seimitsu sticks now.
@GeorgeC you may want to read the above. Mind blown?
Hayabusa pivot diameter at the top: 18.5 mm
Hayabusa pivot diameter at the bottom: 12 mm
JLF pivot diameter at the top: 17.5 mm
JLF pivot diameter at the bottom: 13 mm
Pivots aren’t the same.
Washers are different, too. Hayabusa washer is larger. Not interchangeable. Guess Hori couldn’t make it too much like JLF Spring hat (or flange) is also a bit different but not significant enough, other than the JLF part being made of shit plastic XD
You beat me to it. Nice work.
Haha! I still haven’t measured body size or anything, and that stuff might be useful for people looking to mount.
No reason not to “double check” the results ;D
Excellent work! Nice to have hard numbers for comparison. I’m going to try swapping the actuators again. I may have been too hasty in abandoning that.
Edit: Do you have enough numbers to calculate the engages on both sticks?
Not yet, but the engages will be exactly the same. They have the same mounting positions for the switches, so besides any +/- manufacturing margins for actuators, they won’t be any different. Which begs the question why you are having diagonal difficulties, since not only are the engages the same as a JLF, but you have an additional .5 mm of increased throw range which means you have (barely) more space to hit diagonals.
I’ll try to get some numbers for engages in the next week.
I’m planning on doing a Wiki article for Hayabusa soon. Most of the information here will be documented in it.
Moonchilde,
Great work on digging in deeper with the Hayabusa!
I agree. The more I think about it the more odd it seems that I should have issues with the Hstick and diagonals. That’s why I intend to try swapping the actuators around again to see what happens in Windows. I played for several hours on Saturday with the Hstick and still have the same issues (got fed up and went to a stick with an LS-32 lol).
Suffice to say the JLF is compact, and the H is bulky as hell. On that note, when you swapped the JLF pcb in, did it change the feel of the H? My observation had led me to believe that the micro switches are part of the difference in feel.
In any case, thanks for breaking out the calipers and doing some actual measurements.
Can you weigh the stock shafts and balltops for us too?
@Moonchilde :
Mind-blown… not really!
This stuff just keeps confirming the Hayabusa’s a better made joystick.
As far as the throw is concerned, I’m not sure that I agree it’s more than the JLF.
If it is, that’s news to me. I must admit I haven’t touched the JLF in months for anything other than part analysis so I can no longer say with certainty much about the throw… I came to grips wth the Hayabusa fairly quickly… Faster transition than the JLF to the LS-32 for sure. Minute differences from the LS-32 for the most part but better enough where it counts for me to stick with it. I guess if I were going to adjust anything on the Hayabusa besides a minor spring tweak, it would be cutting down the throw to LS-32 levels and I thought stock-condition was good enough. IF the H-stick has longer throw than the JLF, obviously for some of us that’s not so much of an issue because the H-stick recovers/rebalances/recenters very well unlike the JLF. I personally think the H-stick rebalances/recenters at least as well as the LS-32. Frankly, unless it really bugs me too much – which it hasn’t so far(!) --, I probably wouldn’t adjust the Hayabusa throw.
The shaft length is probably the biggest reason why the JLF (and now Moonchilde is saying Hayabusa) has a longer throw than the LS-32. What bugged me more about the JLF in retrospect was recentering. That left a very big (BAD) impression on me!
As far as Hayabusa HRAP compatibility goes, I think Hori is being overly conservative with what past HRAP’s will work with the Hayabusa. Have they really even test-fit the Hayabusa into these cases or did cross-fits with the JLF P1 Mounting Plate to be sure??? I have my doubts there! I think Hori’s concern is more with current production joysticks.
Let’s be honest – I doubt Hori ever gave much though to people putting anything other than JLF’s in the HRAP cases pre-Mad Catz TE introduction. It’s a minor miracle we had HRAP SA and SE models… Mad Catz forced ALL HRAP’s past 2009 to be universal because before 2009 the standard production HRAP and PS2 variant HRAP’s (excepting the HRAP 2) were non-universal. I doubt they’ve done extensive cross-checking on the older HRAP cases. I think the Hayabusa will pretty much fit into any HRAP that you can fit an LS-32 into… What you have to be concerned about is not so much the mounting; that’s no big issue because if the Hayabusa Mounting Plate is too wide, you can use the JLF P1 Mounting Plate with the Hayabusa OR go without it on the HRAP 3, HP3-45 (white HRAP 3), and licensed PS2 HRAP variants. The bulk of the Hayabusa base is what you have to be careful about. Installation is like the LS-32 because you have to take into account spacing considerations (due to the larger-than-JLF sized base) but it’s not a big deal on the HRAP’s where you would think the Hayabusa would have difficulty fitting in… it installs and works just fine in the HRAP V3/VX and HRAP N3/NX. If anything, the older-style HRAP’s should have more room for Hayabusa installations than the HRAP V3/VX/N3/NX!
I installed an LS-32/Zippy clone joystick into an HRAP 3 SA base (HP3-53). I had to be a bit careful putting the faceplate back on because one of the directional 0.187 tabs goes underneath the PCB area of the joystick. No big deal as long as you’re aware of that. (That directional tab also had to be bent a bit for space considerations, too.) The Zippy/LS-32 tab versions are bulkier than the Hayabusa (and LS-32-01) because of the 0.187(mm)-tabs. I see absolutely no reason why the Hayabusa won’t install in an HP3-53 or HP3-57 (HRAP 3 SE) unless the joystick PCB/base stack is too tall. That makes no sense to me because the Hayabusa and JLF have shorter PCB/base assemblies than the LS-32! The LS-32 mounts closer to the faceplate to make up for the difference in shaft height from the pivot to balltop… Some people still complain the LS-32 is too short (even when they use the correct SS Mounting Plate for installation) but I’ve never felt that except for the time I tried to install an LS-40 (very similar in size to the LS-32) in the White HRAP 3 (HP3-45). I had to use the Seimitsu RE: Mounting Plate to fit the LS-40 and even then it wasn’t scratching the bottom interior plastic of the HRAP 3; the shaft clearance above the faceplate WAS too short but the joystick otherwise fit into the HRAP 3 (HP3-45) case fine.
(FYI: I didn’t see the HP3-45 in the “Hayabusa/Kuro” parts compatibility list. It is the White HRAP-3 Amazon.jp variant. Other than the sticker, case and pushbutton coloring, it’s identical to the mass-production black HRAP 3/vermillion pushbuttons version. I don’t have one of those black HRAP 3’s anymore so I don’t know the model number of that version off-hand.)
Look, I tested my Hayabusa initially on a modded Tekken 5/HRAP case with an MC Cthulu control board. The faceplate was modded, yes, for “universal” LS-/JLF-joystick installations and the Hayabusa had no problems fitting into the case. There was plenty of room for it just like there was for the LS-32-01 that it temporarily displaced.
I’ll go ahead and do a check-fit of the Hayabusa in the HRAP 3 SA… I don’t honestly think there’s any reason the Hayabusa won’t install in any HRAP 3 – SA, SE, or generic “JLF-only” version.
I think more so that Hori is playing by the lowest common domination here. Hori is more than aware of the mods and such we do here, there list of what sticks are not compatible comes not from a lack of mechanical compatibility but a electrical wiring issue. Sticks such as the Hrap - EX have individually tabbed thus individual wired micro switches while the typical JLF, Seimitsu sticks ending in -01 and the Haybusa uses a 5 pin harness.
Hori is assuming the average user will not know how to (or be too nervous) to splice the joystick wiring to make the Hayabusa work in these sticks.