@Nybb I haven’t fought too many good Poison players to be sure, but jumping in general seems super risky.
Even if you make a jump from a good distance, if you hit them at the start of their fireball you’ll most likely trade unlike other fireball characters which is heavily in her favor since she can juggle afterwards. It’s very frustrating, I know.
The reason why this happens is because her hitboxes are huge and wide at the start of the attack.
To approach the matchup, I try to walk forward, neutral jump and focus dash the fireballs. U2 or double ultra can be handy here. EX fb and jaguar kick are the only thing that can break the focus from a distance and if she throws out a random jaguar kick, you can U2 punish her. I don’t jump a lot on Poison even if I have a read, the only distance I jump in on her is if it might be a crossup (to avoid the fireball hitbox), sadly that’s also the range where she has the best tools to anti air you.
jump strong is still good on poison, i hate fireballs mostly though. Playing elena is really helping ease the pain of gouken, guile but my most hated shoto as honda is still ryu> anyone else idk why i can handle akuma more than ryu…he just has EVERYTHING
the way i beat shotos is just blocking all day making them walk backwards without pressing a button other than focusing some fireballs to build ultra and some NJ FP’s. i tend to stay at a range where you can AA with st FP which is about 3/4 screen dont bother moving in on him if you have significant life lead. learning to figure out their fireball timings is huge thats how you basically score the damage in the first place, its always very hard to outpoke them (but possible)
ryu is my best shoto other than oni probably because i played against so many
i hate ken cause of his tick game other than that hes easy to u1
akuma has the hardest mixup to deal with by far and most safejump options. he can just air ex fireball and force you backward anything you do except maybe ex buttslam will get you hit
Ok so my friend was trying to tell me honda beats cammy, I am not articulate or knowledgeable enough to explain why that is not the case. Admittedly, he had some good points.
Cammy can stay on top of you really easily especially with meter. On the ground it’s pretty even I would even say slight honda advantage but if you let her in it can be a really rough ride trying to get her off. Just slight advantage for cammy pretty even tho
you can pressure her with hands and mp headbutt since she can only punish with ultra 1…if she jump forward or back ESPECIALLY BACK focus attack even if she jumps right in front and ex arrows your FA pushes you back far enough so that she will not cross up and you get a free crumple
Many cammy players don’t even know u1 punishes headbutt lol I basically find that match is all about finding the spots to ex headbutt and lk buttslam the holes in her block strings that’s why it’s so key for them to cross you up and kill your charge. I tend to go cr tech lk buttslam during the string to stop 3 common setups :instant throw and tick frame trap / throw
wow i beat fei long this weekend, there is a canadian fei long who has been known for some of the most solid footsies since ST, 3s and vanilla and i have never beat him until now. i see he dropped maybe 1-2 combos so hes not as on point as he used to be but also has switched to rolento (i had to beat both characters i went 2-0 with honda) was very surprised in myself. i just played footsies using almost only cr lp i was shutting down rekkas and making him whiff rekkas. i did not get a chance to use ultra 2 on the whiff (my reactions are not that good) but still hhs combo is nice. this guy was still very hard even if i had a poorly spaced hhs i got blown up for it which most players cannot identify that quickly. i did not use a single headbutt because i know he will just jump it or of course block and ex rekka (this guy likes to build meter and his reactions are so good he just jumps it and gets full combo)
i lost to an abel player which i am a bit mad about because i dropped i think 3 cr jab xx HHS combos, one would have led to super. i also whiffed an ex oicho by 1 fr on his wakeup which led to me eating 2 mixups. another mistake i could have red focus cancelled a HHS and missed it. i also got hit but EX COD because i accidently went low on the 3rd hit (didnt realize you have to stand block that one too) my strategy was obviously very good still despite all those mistakes it went to final round final hit for each player. i took the advice of someone and pushed forwards standing because abels low options are shit. i walk cr jab my way to the corner, got st FP on the wheel kick (usually trades though buts ist ok) did not use delayed standing / quick standing enough (something i really need to wrok on) tried not to use headbutts so much this guy was jumping + punishing them im never doing that again just walk up and footsies the range i hate his within his st hk. trying to get from that long range and into short range is hard as hell!
Just mentioning, but you can Ultra 2 between every hit of Abel’s COD. If your opponent knows this, then it’s more likely your opponent won’t do it anymore if you have double ultra or u2.
If you don’t have charge it’s the best way to avoid the 50/50 high low mixup that leads to a knockdown.
abel roll: u can use orchit throw or tech throw. wheel kick on block can use u2 or corach wek punch hhs to punish. abel knocks u down and roll to get in, u can do an ex sumo splask to option select him. if your sumo splash is blocked, u mat consider striaght jump. u can use striaght jump hp to hit his wheel kick. when your jump in attack is blocked, u can do a striaght jump again to prevent him to use invincible throw. when u knock him down u may do croach weak punch hhs combo. use jump mp to get in and jump back hk for anti air
If I’m close, I actually never use fierce hands on Abel. I like to go with cr.LP xx M.Hands after a cross-up, jump-in or when pressuring super close.
After M Hands hits you can confirm if the opponent is standing or crouching:
If the opponent gets hit crouching, you do M extended Hands into HK, HB or U1.
If the opponent gets hit standing, you do cr.LP xx EX Buttslam.
wow that is very strong never thought to use u2 in between blocked COD. i am going to use that. thank you for those matchup notes guys really appreciated!
by the way, what is your input for cr lp xx MP hhs?
Since I don’t use cr.lp xx mp hhs in footsies, I just buffer the m hands (from a dash, jumpins,…), it’s easy and gives the same results.
Depending on the situation, I usually do LPx4, MP, nothing fancy.
i see! ok thanks. I tried last night i can do LP HP MP HP MP but it puts me off my “home row” its all done with index finger and middle. i need to spend some serious time in the lab practicing timings i am losing a lot of tournament games because of input errors and giving up a lot of free damage for combos i cant do.
I’d like to incorporate DWU in my gameplan, but I have no idea how and how it works in specific matchups. Number of times I’ve recieved pms “You should use DWU, you’d win more”, and I have no idea whan I should use it or not. I know you guys are all way better than me and could really use your help.
@Blueberry I just use it very often on all hard knockdowns and adapt accordingly. If my opponent has DWU setups then it’s obvious you need to mix it up and not do DWU on every wakeup.
i am sort of just getting into the swing of this. I actually went through all of Super, AE + 2012 not using Quick Rise. so basically every knockdown was a hard knockdown against me. get in the habit of mashing the buttons when you get knocked down. I didn’t realize how many potential setups I could have been escaping. people were jumping all over me when I could have been EX Headbutting them for free.
it helps to play against someone who is using it against a specific set up you have. ex. decapre backthrow lk+hk scramble divekick to beat DPs, when they technical then I land behind them with just enough time to meaty lk.
just keep if that situation occurs, someone whiffs an air attack they are likely going for a meaty. lk butt or ex headbutt accordingly.
like anger said, if you utilize both these defenses and they adjust to it, stop mashing the buttons. for quick rise you can also mash it at any point to have a really random wakeup time can be in many more intervals than DWU which obviously is just 2.
a DP or cross up air tatsu is the most obvious point you should always be using it at first. if you get stuck in ken/ryu mixup and you get hit by one of these attacks think of that as the end of their safe mixup. if they go in again you can ex headbutt in time.
EX Headbutt is not always the answer. The people I fight love to empty jump or go for ambiguous crossups that sometimes makes EX headbutt lose.
The empty jumps are definitely a problem though, especially if you tend to throw out headbutts at the first signs of trouble. If it’s blocked you can say goodbye to your health and the game. GGs
Anyone knows how exactly the Akuma mu changed?
Atm, I pretty much play the matchup like I used to, but I still get caught offguard way too much when an Akuma does demonflip > ex fireballs.
My main answer to demon flips used to be headbutts, buttslam or even focus attack, but now that he can do ex fireball it’s a real pain in the ass. Jump back HP might be a good solution (haven’t tried it yet) but that’s giving up a lot of ground…
