Nerfs? Namameso begs to differ
???IV???TV 2/10/11 09:41PM PST, 2/10/11 09:41PM PST supa4blog on USTREAM. Video Game Marathon
He was fighting alot of bad players manā¦ I donāt know.
Oh wowā¦ from near top tier in Super to 0 in the top 50 characters used in AE. Yowch. Owch.
Reeaally donāt know what to say. Honda was an asshole in Super but I can think of characters more deserving of nerfs.
As you know, Iām one of those Hondaās that was āin loveā with it. I realize what you say is true, that they āshouldnātā hit if my opponent is jumping correctly. However, even when they are able to block it (which is most of the time), it still put them in spacing that favored me. Itās like a footsie against jump-ins that does a little chip. Also, it helped against trying cross-ups all day. When theyād try a cross-up, even if I missed the auto-correct, itād still get me out of there and Iāll have recovered by the time they can punish, but again in favorable spacing.
Iāve just grown really accustomed to it for footsie and spacing against jump-in chars, so itās taking a lot of adjustment for me.
It seems like meter awareness is much more prevalent in the AE.
Hello again everyone, long time no speak.
I am in need of advice and so have come to ask for help regarding Evil Ryu. He was released yesterday here in Japan and Iām planning to go to the arcade tonight or tomorrow to fight him. I hear that his kara throw is pretty decent, but is there anything else to look out for? Iāll find out for myself very soon, but if anyone has experience versus Evil Ryu, a little advice would be much appreciated.
Also, has anyone else here noticed that a surprisingly large number of Honda players canāt be bothered to understand AE Honda? Maybe itās just a local thing or maybe because I recently started frequenting an arcade nearer my house to appease the wifey, but I am growing tired of watching otherwise sane people repeatedly jump in with j.MP from unsafe distances or wasting U2s.
I personally donāt mind the Evil Ryu match up, but it may be because I have yet to face any true high level players in my area. I have played against some brutal Oni Akumaās.
Cheers for the reply, kontrad1cti0n. I have just seen the Oni video on the front page and am worried about dash cross-ups and that EX slash. I do get the feeling based entirely on that one video, however, that EX splash will be useful - is that the case?
I got round to playing against Evil Ryu last week. I too did not feel that he will be that big a problem unless used by someone who really knew what they were doing with him. In the few games I played and watched, he seemed to take too much damage to take full advantage of his close options. Moreover, I noticed that a couple of decent (20k or so) Ryu players were struggling with him, while another distinctly average player based his whole offensive strategy around that funky F+MK hop kick, which led me to believe that he thought he had chosen Ken.
Iām looking forward to playing against Oni on Friday once my business trip has finished.
Thereās a guy at my arcade who was trying to switch mains to oni akuma and I was picking his brain about the character and specifically the ex slash. He was telling me that the move isnāt a very good use of meter since you can beat the slash with pretty much any poke. I havenāt played against his oni in a while but IIRC the spacing for the ex slash is just a bit out of cr.jab range so whiffing low jabs when he gets to the spacing where he would be able to land the ex slash crossup is a good way to limit his options.
Thatās wonderful news - thank you very much matey. The video made it look pretty solid, but Iām glad to hear that it can be poked out of easily. I shall whiff jab my way to glory on Friday night!
Since youāre here, may I also ask about the range of Oniās air dash? Does a forward dash end up behind/out of range of bj.MP or bj.LP?
Yea the ex slash isnāt really a problem you can kind off think of it like Adonās ex wall kick in Super - he flashes bright yellow before he does the cross up and it is pretty easy to block on reaction.
Yeah, I noticed that and felt reassured. I felt that the ground pound was nasty and f.HP is a pain in the rectum when trying to get close, but neither the air dash or the EX slash are not worth worrying about. I realise that it is still very early, but I have found it much more difficult to deal with Evil Ryu than Oni so far.
What the deal with Honda vs The Twins? Give up at the character select screen? lol
It is still way to early and Iāve been slacking over the last couple of weeks with playing AE, but the twins arenāt nearly as hard as a dealing with a Sagat. For me personally Iāve been getting beat down, but it is mostly because I never played 3s and these are brand new characters. After the gimmicks run there course you just need to make sure you learn your spacing donāt be intimidated by them and run away and let them build meter with that palm move (which has a lot of active frames so you canāt just headbutt after you see it).
All in all it a lot like playing any other rushdown character you just need experience learn the match ups and the twins tricks so they donāt get into a rhythm and rush you down and learn the frame data on their dive kicks so you donāt get caught in any frame traps. After I played a few sets and got used to frame traps and gimmicks they were good characters that I had to concentrate on playing, but still very beatable. Learn to block more and work on your hhs x hhs combo to build meter and donāt go wasting it on every single time you see someone jumping at you.
I know I havenāt given any concentrate match-up advice, but between not going as of late and not really ever having experience against them prior I still get tricked I havenāt been able to sit down and think it out. I do want to say this to all the Honda players who are worried about the nerfs to our character and how OP everyone says the twins are. Yes, the twins are good but anytime a scrub chooses them it is pretty easy to wreck them; Yun and Yang take a lot of skill to use and strategy with their super so donāt worry about getting bodied by an army of twins, and evil new characters. The Honda nerfs have been well documented but you get used to it after a while, but you get over it. Honda is a fun character to play footsies that reward the user for good reads by allowing you a high damage output. If you just wanted a character that does a lot of damage by spamming sumo slash and full screen headbutts good riddance I am glad you dropped Honda. Yes, it takes more work now but Honda still plays the same you just have to work a little more and canāt be lazy doing jp mp hhs because you donāt feel like being patient and or thinking. If thatās all your Honda game is based on get out of here; Honda is a thinking mans character.
Couldnāt have said it any better sir.
What changed that would make this strat = fail online for example? I mean most legit Honda success Iāve seen (Cen, Ross) didnāt get by with this stuff anyway. Well Ross seems to always get damage from Jump ins, but I always just gave him the benefit that he just makes good reads. Cen does seem a bit butt splash happy but maybe good reactions to jump backs???
thanks for the write up by the way.
Also, why are there like no posts in this forum???
I just left new jersey after 2 weeks and all I did was play AE at the break.
I know Iām about to take a bunch of grief for saying this but I really like AE Honda, sure he has a damage nerd and anti air jab HB sux now but he feels mostly the same in terms of being a solid character, yea he plays a bit differently but I like it for the most part. His footsies are better IMO, jab HB works very well in footsies (itās a actually a little surprising how good his footsies are now) I feel like maintaining your meter is key now. Itās not free for the shotoās to do c.mk all day and feel safe. I think it takes a bit more thinking to play him but I think he will be just fine once Honda players learn their matchups. To me there were alot of random random Honda shenagains in Super (ala random HB, and sumo) that just donāt work in AE, in order to play Honda successfully in AE you need to learn how to make solid reads and capitalize on them.
I feel likely Honda harder to play but BETTER. (in the sense scrubs canāt just play hella random now. He is not a pick and play random alt character anymore) AKA play Solid or go the F**k home.
Iāve been playing AE for months, I main Chun but Honda is someone Iāve been messing around with to counter-pick the twins (Chun vs. twins is miserable). It seems like in theory, maybe, Honda is at least 5-5 against Yun. Against Yang it might be worse because he can DP your neutral jump fierce on reaction from pretty far away.
My favorite thing about Honda vs. the twins is that his standing fierce shuts down so much of the bullshit divekick stuff that other characters have pretty poor answers to. Donāt get me wrong, once the twins are IN on you (like doing shallow dive kicks over and over) no character has a poke that is going to get them off you, but as far as keeping them out, standing fierce does quite well. The only problem with it is that you have to be extremely careful when you throw it out inside of a certain range. If you are too close, throw it out as a prediction, and they donāt do anything, they can punish you really hard for whiffing this move.
The reason the twins are so good from what I have seen is mostly that once they are in on you divekicking over and over, most characters have such terrible options. Chun-Li for instance literally just has to block until she eats a command grab. She can try to backdash or something but save for Yun/Yang making a really unlucky guess or a bad read, youāre probably just going to die once they are in on you. You might think then āWell then just keep them outā, which would be a great strategy if Yunās EX lunge werenāt -2 on block. The EX lunge will hit you out of jump startup as well so you canāt reliably neutral jump fierce to deter it. Neutral jump fierce WILL deter it because it can in fact hit an EX lunge from a certain range and timing, but from the wrong range it will go right under you and heāll combo you when you land, from the wrong timing heāll hit you out of startup. Itās good at least that Honda can do something to try to deter the EX lunge, because against some characters itās basically a get in on them free card, it bypasses all zoning and footsies. I feel like the startup of EX lunge is so fast that you would really struggle to EX headbutt it on reaction. Maybe if youāre just sitting there watching specifically for it you could punish it on reaction. Iāll try testing this out a bit more.
If Yun actually gets in on you, EX headbutt wonāt help you. Yun can just divekick over and over and if you EX headbutt and he divekicks it will cross over past the headbuttās hurtbox and flip you up into a reset that heavily favors Yun. You can buttslam though which seems to have about a 50/50 shot of hitting him out of a divekick or going up into the air and making you eat a combo. This isnāt as bad as it sounds because the twinsā divekick pressure is so broken that you will eat a full combo if you keep blocking, having any move that you can do to try to just hit him out of it and create an advantageous situation for yourself is really nice and will keep him somewhat honest with his divekick spam. Even the EX headbutt will make him worried about trying to command grab you; the command grab is generally what makes Yunās divekick pressure so much more obnoxious than Rufusā for example.
Anybody have any strats vs Ibuki? I mean specifically getting out of the vortex??? Seems like a total guess where to block and none of Hondaās invincible moves seem effective. Could be timing though.
Stanf fierce is very good against the twins divekicks from both far away and up close. Works much better than it does vs rufus, also no neutral fierce from closer than 1/2 screen as both their dpās will hit you for free. So far good tbh, the new jab hb is surprisingly useful as a footsie tool and after the initial shock the damage nerf is not so noticeable.
Less go Honda.
The oicho damage nerf was a kick in the testis tho, hey at least theres a reason to use he ex one now i suppose.
Gl guys.