everyone was too busy complaining about sagat, 200 damage EX messiah and “trade DP to ultra” ryu, , sagat trading an anti-air for 60% raises more red flags than honda doing 30% off a bnb, its unfortunate but the people who are the loudest are often the only ones heard, there’s even people who posted videos complaining about how powerful sagat was, even though he’s probably the weakest “best character” in any capcom game besides maybe yun in 3s.
lots of weird things go unknown until the better characters are nerfed, I didn’t even know this but Gen has normals that do like 200 damage or some shit, not sure how useful they are but goddamn, 200 damage off a fierce is goofy.
honda would be too gdlk, what to expect in reality
damage nerfs
damage nerfs
nerfed hitboxes on air normals
can jump out of U2
damage nerfs
something to make EX ochio useful
less frame advantage on hands
If those changes were made, Honda would become complete ass.
Most people don’t realize that his damage is basically all Honda has for him… his damage makes up for the fact that Honda has such a hard time getting in on fireball characters, and heavy zoning characters.
Also, I don’t see why they would make it so that people can more easily jump out of U2, it already has shit range for a command grab ultra.
What Honda really needs is a more reliable AA normal, maybe have st.fierce have a faster startup.
make cs.fierce a command normal, that and make hhs comboable into sweep, that’s all I want, I’ll take the damage nerfs, it wouldn’t be so bad for honda to get that if you’re going to take away the only thing he has going for him. (we don’t know for sure yet, but considering forum-warrior whining produced an A-tier guile I’m going to remain pessimistic)
hell, screw all that, if they make U1 half as good as balrog/chun li/abel/bison/rufus/adon/blanka I’ll be happy, atleast I’ll have something to threaten people with at a decent distance instead of just outside poke distance, its kind of dumb they give characters who already have punishes for fireballs anti-fireball ultras, while honda is doomed to be zoned out forever unless he has a super stocked or can eagle-eye a fireball and nail someone from like 1/4th screen.
mostly I just use U1 to catch some jumps (bison,chun,guile) aswell as punishes for akuma’s air fireball, ibuki knives, bison’s reverse, and the occasional meaty ultra when I sniff out a backdash mashing rose or chun li.
I do believe and I know this has been discussed before, the reason why they’re so careful about making U1 easily comboable is the fundamental act of ultra: putting the oponent in the corner. One can argue that other ultras do the same such as 'rog but honda’s is the only one that guarantees putting someone in the corner no matter where you are on the screen. And because of that I think its arguably the best ultra in the game. The only way I can see U1’s comboability go up is if they severely reduce the damage, like less than half of what it is now, or they completly rework the ultra into something else entirely. And if that’s the case I would vote for leaving it alone. Because FADC ultra against fireball spammers and taking %60 of their life gives me a chubby.
Honda is easily one of the best characters in the game. There’s no arguing that. 260 damage off a 4F jab with good range? I know you can’t combo into st. RH off max range cr. jab xx HP Hands, but still. His worst match ups aren’t that bad, they’re much more manageable in SSF4. You can headbutt through Sim’s fireballs. You can fierce headbutt under Sagat’s fireballs. Plus he rapes the rest of the cast.
With that being said, obviously I don’t want him to be nerfed because I want him to stay high/top tier. But I’m expecting nerfs. I mean, if that cr. jab BnB goes down to 200, that’s still insane damage.
^ You obviously were not watching the live SRK stream this past sunday when the 3v3 happened of NorCal vs SoCal. Mike ross owned filipino champ 3 times in a row!
pretty much agree to everything in the fixed post, honda doesn’t really “rape” any character within the top half of the tier list except maybe cammy or terrible bisons who don’t know how to be lame, everything else is 5/5 or disadvantage. hell, I don’t even think honda has any 7-3s except maybe T.hawk or Hakan? every other character has a chance to beat honda, stop jumping into headbutts/supers and holding forward and maybe people will realize honda’s not even that good in this game, if the tier list was actually done correctly honda would be around upper-mid tier at best.
I can list off all of honda’s bad matchups but you can just look at the matchup thread instead.
I agree, Honda should be around low-high or high-mid tier. What he has going for him are: great stamina, nice range on command throw (not counting Gief and Hawk), and an all-purpose tool of a special, HHS. He does have one of the most damaging b&bs in the game which becomes the most damaging in the game, non-counterhit (iirc) for just one stock of meter on most characters (EX hands->jab hands). Spammable specials? Not at high levels. Good normals? Well, decent except for an almost shoto-tier crouching jab. It’s just that his bad matchups are so lopsided.
Thanks haha, but I don’t play Dudley anymore, I haven’t for a while. I actually play…Honda. :razz: Yeah, it was presumptuous of me to come into this thread and announce that you’ve all got it wrong, so I’m sorry about that. I don’t have as much experience with the character as you guys do. I guess running win streaks on my friends got to my head, which is stupid of course.
But I still stand behind the general sentiment of my post; that Honda is by no means a bad character, and he’s in fact pretty damn good. I never said that his hardest match ups are easy now, just that they aren’t as bad as they were in vanilla.
lol damn, i was pretty free. u know, i kept mashing teleport whenever you’d do the fadc out of hundred hand slap into oicho but it never came out, and i ate it almots every time haha. oh well. i learned not to jump in retardedly when you have charge like you can against some other characters. some of my setups againts ryu where his srk would whiff also don’t work against honda, that was pretty interesting. also ex headbutt on reaction to ex psycho was really tight, didnt know that worked.
overall, looking forward to the next set, fuming. i’ll look at the replays and cut out the stupid shit i was doing.
yeah man just stop jumping, I remember browsing through Kim1234’s bison post and reading “if you beat a honda player by doing anything other than being lame, that honda sucks” just work on being hella lame, your pokes are the only real advantage you have over honda in that matchup.
