On the Gouken match up, I don’t know what to do at all. The thing that scares me the most is his counter. Every time I jab xx hands, it gets countered. I try to mix oicho in there and they see it coming and neutral jump. His fireballs are fast and his cr.mp stuffs out my j.mp. What is the best option in playing this match?
Jump up after them/wait->punish on ground/don’t be as obvious with the empty jump. If you mean jab hands as in you’re on the ground… headbutt instead?
mix up your jab hands with short hands/forward hands to get around his counter. goukens love the stupid counter on wakeup, make them wish they hadn’t by mixing up low/mid meaties and oicho. When i’m testing an online scrub gouken, i like to meaty fs.rh just to see if they counter on wakeup to test the waters. Once i get a feel for that, i go all out on my approach. Once you start punishing their counter you can go in with the jab hands pressure all day…unless they don’t adapt. Also, if they like to EX counter, just wait a couple frames instead of meatying and punish with the biggest combo you can manage. Only has 14 active frames.
Gouken’s pokes are ass, establish your ground game with s.rh and s.fp and he can’t really stop you. If he starts throwing poorly spaced fireballs or just spamming them in your face, just block and bulldog your way into where you want to be or nj.fp wiggle your way forward (try to react to fireballs because an angled one will reset the situation). Your s.rh and s.fp come out a lot faster than his fireballs so just abuse him at s.rh range. If he starts to randomly counter low, move up and s.fp. You have plenty of time to react to a whiffed counter. Not necessarily a punish, but you can really start to pressure him by moving into his face if you want to make him uncomfortable when he whiffs a counter. Gouken has really good anti-airs, so approaching from the air isn’t the best option.
I wonder why there isn’t a Q&A thread here…
anyways…
How does Honda do against jumpins?
With meter? Without it?
After a knockdown and while hes standing
Whats his best AA? His buttslam a viable AA? Or easy to stuff
Honda has a tough time with jump ins generally speaking if he doesn’t have charge. If he does then EX headbutt and lp headbutt are both solid anti airs (the former being better). Close standing fierce can be a good AA as well as an early s.hp which often trades but can trade in your favor.
Buttslam has some AA uses but in general it has to be used really early and does crappy damage anyways. The main applications I’ve found for it are to stuff people trying to jump in the corner and to tag people if you’re expecting a throw.
Neutral jumping fierce and roundhouse are great as well if you do them early enough. Fierce in particular owns really hard because you can wiggle forward and jab hands if they land short, but RH has more active frames and is harder to stuff with crap like shoto far standing RH.
e: if the person you’re playing is fond of meaty crossups or knows how to safejump OS, prepare to just do a lot of blocking on wakeup. It’s a fact of life.
im learning honda WOOT get ready guys
Any tips against vega? I played a turtling vega some days ago… it was bad…
Yep, this match is pretty hard and methodical. You gotta pray to dear lord to get a life lead and turtle. Try to save meter to anti air vega w/ ex headbutt. To build meter, space him out and lp xx hhs him. DO NOT try to out poke this bastard, he will win. LP headbutt is hard as hell to use as an antiair so try and figure out Jesus Chop(FP) timing or react to his jumps and quickly go air to air with him. Whiffing oicho = death by ultra2. If you score a knockdown and he doesnt have ultra 2, go for meaty jump ins and apply pressure to build meter.
A tidbit on the vs Rose matchup: You can stuff her U2 activation with Oicho. Has to be meaty, like you’re trying to grab her right after she wakes up. Did two more times after I discovered, pretty easy since the rose players are pretty obvious with their activations since they think they are safe.
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I am a pretty new honda player and having trouble with anti airs. Ex HB is great but when you do not have charge what are the go to options? LP HB seems ok, maybe a timing issue I am having but i usually trade.
Is lp HB a good anti air or should I drop it? I have also tried using st.fierce but it will often trade and can be hard to time if not flat out beat from early jump ins. NJ. FP is also a great option for me so far but is not always possible.
Any tips on AA’ing?
edit - Just read some of this post i skipped. Seems like i named the main AA’s for honda and he’s pretty poor at AAing without charge?
Close and far standing fierce, close standing roundhouse, jump back fierce/roundhouse/strong, jump forward mk, crouching fierce if they jump in front of you and press a button where they deactivate their trip guard… they’re many tools in the toolbox that is honda… There isn’t 1 tool for every job, but used in conjunction with each other will bring you success
in fact, no you can’t.
It works a lot of time, and will still works probably. but soul satellite has zero recovery frame. Which mean if the rose player, keep the direction up during the animation, or mash sc.mk, the oicho will whiff.
if I’m wrong and you can prove it with training mode, I 'll be happy to know - and all rose player obviously.
Frame data lists Rose’s U2 as 1+4, so four frames of recovery. Honda’s oicho is a 5 frame grab, obviously. So in theory what I posted was correct, if you start the oicho before the U2 activation, it should be inescapable. However I will test in training mode later today to be sure.
It works, I figured that out a few days ago, but I hadn’t had time to test it
f.hp. Or jump and meet them with j.mp or nj.hp, or j.hk, or nj.hk, or… just push buttons. Honda has a lot of anti air tools for every situation, you just need to find what works for you.
Wondering if anyone has come across solid sims using U2 yet. Once they have an Ultra it shuts down a huge amount of our game. He can land it after any jump in or close nj, and can use it out of teleports which adds another layer to guess on when sim vanishes. I’ve been using the basic tactics and limb trades still, but if I’m not sitting on around 20% life lead by time he has ultra its one rough fight. Just wondering if anyone has found any setups or baits that are effective against it.
I’m glad you have joined my world of pain. This match is 7-3 borderline 8-2 when they use ultra2. If you have any ideas how to win this fight plz let me know
I’ve worked about 10 hours plus this match up this week and I’m at a wall. I only win by psychic/lucky hb and a lucky limb trade, then sitting on that lead. Not a wining strat to take to the bank. =(
This match is 6-4 Sim. You have to trade health for distance and counter hits.
I’m trying to find my matches from Dev so I can make an attempt to break them down. I also was lucky enough to play a good 10 matches or so with Champ before Dev.