Keep Yun out. Once he gets in you’re screwed. Divekicks can be beaten by far.MK, st.LP, close.st.HP, nj.HK (sometimes), jb.MP, focus (sometimes), counter, LK.pinwheel, MK.fireball. It’s really spacing dependent. Be careful of tossing fireballs, because Yun can go over low ones with a properly timed lunge punch and under medium ones with his shoulder move. You have to stay unpredictable. Ex lunge punch is very hard to stuff even with far.MK, either avoid it (with nj.HK perhaps), block, or throw. Cr.MK can go under lunge punches and hit him but you’ll probably reset him out of the air.
I try to keep him at the tip of far.MK range and if he neutral jumps, so do I. HK or MK or a divekick can hit him if he tries to divekick you. That said, I have lots of trouble with this match myself.
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<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/83075/FengShuiEnergy">FengShuiEnergy</a> said:</div>
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If you don’t count it as a dive kick…what would you call it?</div>
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Shikusen. :shrug:<br />
Dive kicks, in the traditional sense, are low risk, high reward. Anti-airs generally don’t do all that much damage, but if you hit you get a nice combo and on block you’re safe enough for some oki.
Shikusen’s long recovery means you get no oki and if you’re lucky you get to eat a full combo because you’re on the ground instead of being in the air.<br />
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Shikusen is a dive kick in the sense that it changes your trajectory in the air, but you can’t really use it the same way every other dive kick is used.
Hey guys, I need a little advice regarding Yang’s mix up.
How do you guys cope with this mix up?
Tourou Zan > FADC > c.mk > j.HP > fwd dash > ambiguous cr light
Is a pretty standard mix up and the only problem I have with this match up. For now, I just and guess and commit on one direction. Is there way to manage it? I couldn’t find this on the video section told by 4neqs so I’m posting it here.
So I played the mirror match for a little bit last night with a guy and he would always beat me in the air with j.HP. (well, not always, but enough for me to notice)
As far as air-to-airs go, can someone give me a rundown of when to use which one?
I pretty much only used j. mp and j. hk just whenever and kept j. hp for oki situations or off a juggle.
Its possible I was just screwing up because I’ve been really sick lately and playing with a fever.
But I’ve never really though of j.HP as a really good air-to-air. Is it?
He could also go into a raw cl.MK which allows him to repeat the exact same mixup, a followup combo in the corner which does decent damage, a dash > cl.MK > MK upkicks combo to carry you into the corner or dash ultra.
The mixup isn’t even that dumb to be honest. You have to look out for how late the j.HP hits you. If it’s done around the peak and he dashes it will be always crossup, if hes done it pretty late (around 3/4 jump) and he dashes you have to look out for his stance. If he is crouching it’s a fake crossunder and if he is standing it’s a true one. I guess you could use the cl.MK / cl.HP stuff but if hes decent he will punish you hard for it (at least I would). After cl.MK is blocked you can use cl.MP to counterhit him if he presses a button.
The mixup he was talking about makes Yang c.LK whiff one way, and end up in another. Close MK will trade with anything he does that will “hit” you so you will reset out of the air. It’s a small price to pay for not eating a good chunk of damage.
Why would any Yang player use this mixup. The cr.LK will always end up into the direction the opponents character is looking (=crossup), the 2nd one will hit front unless he hit her too high in the air. It’s not even ambiguous and it will always be a fake crossunder because it lowers yangs hitbox allowing Juri to fly over him again. It only trades because yang puts himself at a frame disadvantage with cr.LK. Why put yourself at a frame disadvantage when you could use a more ambiguous mixup with alot more frame advantage (meatys possible). I also haven’t seen Kyoku or Nemo use this one a lot (or at all). I can imagine being useful vs Viper or Rog since it lowers his hit hitbox but I haven’t tested it that much.
cr.Light could mean lk or lp. He didn’t use short, or jab either.
Because the short is going the wrong way – which makes people think you’re going to land on that side when Yang actually lands on the other side after the crossup c.lk. It’s really ambiguous – to me anyway – in person.
To clear up, eISH was correct about the ambiguous part. The problem I have with this reset is Yang being able to control which side he lands based on his timed ground dash. He can also do fwd dash > cr.lk which makes Juri lands directly above Yang and ‘slides’ down which makes it really awkward to block. Kinda like the shoto j lk corner set up.
To make it worst(Shiroyasha was right on this one), he can simply choose to raw cl. mk and repeat the mix up. There’s also an option to go for grab or block.
My match with Yang usually goes like this.
Juri total control of the match > Yang gets the mix up > 10 seconds later > match thrown. (O_O)
Since he has so many options going his way, I thought maybe there’s something Juri can do to pressure Yang to think twice about this mix up. Kinda like against Abel step kick mix up.
I appreciate the video and eISH cl.mk. I’ll take these inputs and hit the labs to try to figure out to see is there a good way to handle this. Then I’ll post it back here and we can discuss.
Would you mind posting a few replays ? I am kinda curious how he’s able to control on which side he lands on with the cr.LK since I can’t get it to work lol.
When Abel step kicks in he is at +0, if you go for cl mp(3 frames), you beat all his normals since he has no 3 frames. He will try to counter it with command throw, but your cl.mk will beat that. So, every time he wants to do a step kick, there’s pressure on him too since there’s a chance he will get punished. This is what I’m trying to create with the Yang set up because my Juri is so free to that set up.
Here’s the vid of the set up. Since Shiroyasha mentioned that top players don’t use this set up much, that means it can be countered or managed, something that I’ve no knowledge of.
^ its private :(, abels stepkick has to be +1 on block though if hes using the dash. I never hit him out of the cl.HP which is 4 frames. It always traded.
cr.LK makes his cl.HP whiff and you get a free hitconfirm. cl.MK gives you an airreset.
I’ve been playing Abel recently – and I can tell you Step Kick -> Dash is +0 on block. Close s.MK will get you out of every situation at a small price (s.HP or s.MP), jumping back will get you out at the same price but if he goes for command grab, you can punish harder if you use Close s.MK. You can try to use Close s.MP but if he does ex.Command Grab, you get shit on -_-;
Basically jumping gets you out of all of Abel’s mixup at a small price (I think it’s 80 damage on s.HP first hit) IF he even does it -_-; c.HP is kinda hard to react to – for me anyway – for it to hit with the juggle part of it, ex.Falling Sky only has 4 frames of Strike Invincibility so it’s really finicky~
Close s.MK is really good for Juri players especially when we’re holding a friggin’ lk.Fuhajin charge~ Obviously I’d like to be able to tech, but I will consider it a fair trade to have a fireball release with such little recovery~
Unless it’s been changed in one of the updates, Abel should be +1 after step kick dash. Maybe it’s not, I haven’t messed around with him in a looong time. This means his reg throw beats all non air borne attacks, he can hit you on your last pre- jump frame, or he could trade or beat with the rest of your normals.
I wanted to post that when Genki posted that vs Abel set of his, but really I try to avoid posting about theories and opinion based subjects(which basically means I just dont post anymore), especially when it comes to people’s play. I didnt think that Abel player knew much technicalities like the ones mentioned.
The amount of times he kept getting hit by that st.mp was SMDH worthy. I understand it coulda been lag, but even when he had meter for ex command grab he wouldnt put a stop to it. Another thing he didnt understand was that the majority of the time you should be rolling behind Juri on wake up and the front roll should be the occasional mix up(of course this isnt a hard rule). This increases the chance of messed up dashes/inputs and desperate mashing/jumping.
Thats just my theory on the match , but I bet if you rewatch, that match, and look for the traded st.HP after step kick, the behind the back roll, use of ex command grab, you’ll notice a very different outcome in the fights.
But like I said, maybe the frame advantage has changed, so please no one call me out lol. Anyways I think I’m gonna give Abel some run, Im expecting him to be relatively strong in this next update.
Now if he would cancel the 2nd active frame into the dash he would be +1 since he removes 1 frame of “recovery” due to canceling the 2nd active frame.
Now just to proof my concept try this:
Take juri and record this with abel: Stepkick > dashcancel > cl.s.HP
If it combos it will be as tight as possible. cl.s.HP has 4 frames startup. Now if he was neutral on block (which I actually assume he isn’t) you would be able to score a counterhit with Juris cl.MP right ?
I might be just completely shit but I find it outright hilarious that I can land pretty much any 1 frame link in this game except this counterhit setup.
The problem I see in using cl.MK is that he can simply LP Falling Sky you out of it. Juris cl.HP trades with you eating 0 damage.
There is no cheap way out and it’s actually always a guessing game. However I too use cl.MK a lot until I get my ass handed lol. Also just an unimportant and completely unnecessary information: How in the hell is able to combo into cl.s.HP (4 frames) when he is only +3 on hit…